Overhaul of US Weapons

[Kenny]

Well my tip is if you are Officer on the US team use the pistol in close range up to 50m I'v taken down plenty of insgents with it in game most of the time all I had to do was 2 shots to the chest.
Although I question this, is'nt his chest area ment to be protected by bodyarmour? and I'm shooting a 9mm round at him so realisticly all he would have is a couple of bruises and I would most cerntily be dead.
If he diden't have Bodyarmour on wouldne't 5.56 round kill him strait up or is it going too fast in the CQC to initiate it's tumbling action that the round has?
Correct me if im wrong please I'm not an expert

[rampo]

please correct me if im wrong but wasnt it so that army uses m-4 whit burst and the special forces m-4 whit full auto?

[TheLean]

I see no problem with the three round burst, its great. Just let the sight settle for a second or two if the target is at close mid range. Aim for the stomach and let the recoil shoot bullets in the torso and head. One dead terrorist. Use the aimpoint if your goin CQB since you need to zoom to reduce deviation.

Btw, when playing us take try to just hit the insurgents once and then bypass them, they will bleed to death soon. 1 hit is pretty much a guaranteed kill if they havent stolen the us medic kit as civilian medics are rarely used.

[Rudd]

I am finding that 5.56 is severly inferior ingame, accuracy and powerwise.

I'll take the AK47 over the m4 any day. The SA80 has the same kind of inferiority, but at least it has auto for CQB.

I'm not an advocate for ubering blufor, or introducing unrealistic weapons. But it is my understanding that 5.56 is meant to be more accurate than 7.62

in 'Apache' by WO1 (retired AAC) Ed Macy, he does state that its like you need to put 3 rounds in a taliban fighter to put him down, but gameplay wise its kinda killer, since I don't seem to feel the body armour does much for blufor.

[gazzthompson]

The Ins and Taliban have the best weapons and the m16 just dosnt compare. Though with officers being able to choose iron sights will help this problem as the need to hip fire with the fail16 is no longer needed

[Maverick]

I wish Dragonskin was more affordable

[Brandon_Heat]

Well... probably not. Full-auto G3 kicks some major *** if the user knows what he's doing.

The G-3 like the FN-FAL is a 7.62MM Select Fire (Semi & Full Auto) Assault Rifle. Both are DEADLY lethal in CQB and accurate enough in single fire at range. It would just like to see the M-16A4 become a little less useless close in.


Another thing that needs to be fixed is the slug round in the shotgun. Im tired of getting sniped from 50M with 1 shot, when my M-16A4 at the same range with ACOG right over the guys face cant hit the broad side of a barn.

[Alex6714]

Well imo thats a problem with the M16, rather than the shotgun.

[Hresvelgr]

The thing is I always thought that the US does perfectly fine on INS as long as they don't get too close to insurgents. I usually end up as insurgent for some reason and me and my squads routinely get picked off from great distances. Whenever I'm US me and my squad typically make sure to be safe distances away from insurgents, only going close after we think we got them all or after having thrown a grenade. I'm all for making the M16 more accurate, but at long ranges most importantly. Coalition dudes shouldn't be pwning every insurgent at CQC by firing off one perfect burst at everybody while standing up to a hail of 7.62mm bullets.

[gazzthompson]

Well imo thats a problem with the M16, rather than the shotgun.

the shotguns are uber overpowered at moment (best weapon in game under 50m), so id say its more of a problem with shotgun. also isnt the slug rubbish at anything over 20m power wise ? ive shot people many times with it and them not die . they probably shooting with the buckshot as it has little to no deviation (it would seem) even when moving.

[Alex6714]

Well, its a matter of perspective, I would say M16 and others are uber underpowered in the accuracy side.

[gazzthompson]

put it this way, m16 is fail and shotgun is best CQB gun in game

[Ace42]

I see no problem with the three round burst, its great. Just let the sight settle for a second or two if the target is at close mid range. Aim for the stomach and let the recoil shoot bullets in the torso and head. One dead terrorist. Use the aimpoint if your goin CQB since you need to zoom to reduce deviation.

The M-16 (M4?) does get used against MEC, you know, and a lucky slug from the TRB won't cut it. At close range (and by close, I don't mean point-blank) I've had easy shots I could put 3 bullseyes on with single in rapid succession, but 2 of the three have been pulled off the target by recoil. I shouldn't have the drop on a target, give time for the deviation to settle, plant the crosshairs low enough that the recoil will have room for the later shots to hit, and then miss with two of the three shots. That happens frequently.

The recoil needs to come down so that a "good" shot like that described above will guarantee 3/3 hits from the TRB, and the firedev increments need to come out to do the same. By all means, increase the max firedev so that prolonged fire requires more time to "resight" or put in other deviation vulnerabilities to balance the gun out - but ATM it's unrealistic and means people have to play in an unrealistic manner to use it.

The whole point of TRB on a gun is that you don't "spam" the fire-button to create a pseudo-full-auto; or keep it permanently on semi and spam that to do likewise. If a dev posted the current in-game deviations and recoil values, I'd even nominate values to switch to to help fix it...

[Hresvelgr]

Coincidentally I just got off a round as USMC at Sunset City. At short/medium range I pulled off a couple of bursts that killed 2 guys, 1 with each burst. And I at least critically wounded others with 1 burst each. Each time I think that was at optimum range, roughly 10-15 yards with is in my mind fair for a TRB. Oddly, though, I have less success against insurgents, but that's probably mainly because that's about optimum range for an AK-47 and also I got the jump on half those Chinese guys I bursted. Either way, the power is at least fine, maybe you could make it a twinge more accurate so less ammo is wasted on single trying to get one hit. But in no way is the US underpowered at all. They shouldn't have automatic rifles as some have suggested. And they do not need to be much more accurate, only a little. I can understand why people have problems with TRB. I only have success because I usually use it at optimum range and then aim for their waist or legs. That way the other 2 rounds are more likely to hit.

[Ace42]

Coincidentally I just got off a round as USMC at Sunset City. At short/medium range I pulled off a couple of bursts that killed 2 guys, 1 with each burst. And I at least critically wounded others with 1 burst each. Each time I think that was at optimum range, roughly 10-15 yards with is in my mind fair for a TRB.

Really we need some soldiers who've hit the practice range IRL to tell us what sort of TRB grouping they get at various ranges so we get an accurate depiction of the recoil / deviation. 10-15 yards doesn't really mean anything to me - doesn't the game use meters as its unit?

Also, AFAIK, at close range a headshot will critically injure (how do you distinguish between someone giving up and 'dying' and being critically injured? I can't tell if someone's been killed outright until the score shows up or I see a medic run in) anyway - so the fact that through luck 1 out of 3 shots flukes the head is not really an argument saying that the TRB is suitably accurate.

<addendum>
Also, it's unrealistic to "cope" with a poor TRB by "aiming at their legs." IRL US soldiers aren't taught to aim for the legs so that the gun's recoil works properly...

[Brandon_Heat]

Perhaps it is mainly the ACOG im having problems with. Its a little Disheartening when at 40M I Can go prone, with a guys head filling up most of my sight, bull the trigger with the tip of the inverted V right on his face and miss 5 slowly fired single shots in a row. Again it may be more of an ACOG issue than a power issue.


Iv noticed to, that the AK appears to do better with "Spray and pray" than allied fully automatic weapons (like the L-80). I Couldnt believe it yesterday when I watched as I Fired off a full magazine of Ammo at this guy at a range of under 5M with no hits only to have him 1 shot me with the AK :-\ I Dont by any means want "Counter Strike" Accuracy but as it sits the AK feels far more accurate than the M-16 which would be "Un" realistic.

[Jay]

Perhaps it is mainly the ACOG im having problems with. Its a little Disheartening when at 40M I Can go prone, with a guys head filling up most of my sight, bull the trigger with the tip of the inverted V right on his face and miss 5 slowly fired single shots in a row. Again it may be more of an ACOG issue than a power issue.

You're not supposed to aim at their heads, apparently; you're supposed to aim at their center mass.

[DankE_SPB]

try to compensate recoil while burst, those who got used to it, as I can see, fire TRB nearly in one point at 50-100m distance, at skirmish battles(on clanwars) if i get killed with M16 its usually burst fire headshot

Iv noticed to, that the AK appears to do better with "Spray and pray" than allied fully automatic weapons (like the L-80). I Couldnt believe it yesterday when I watched as I Fired off a full magazine of Ammo at this guy at a range of under 5M with no hits only to have him 1 shot me with the AK

practice, practice and again practice
if you shoot out whole clip at 5m distance and didnt kill him you were in panic, while your enemy was calm, aimed, headshot or you just were unlucky

[hueysrock]

My suggestion would be to change the "Aim point" Riflemen weapon for all US Forces, as well as any classes that now use "Aim point" M-16A4's, or Aim point M-4's(Riflemen Spec, Crewman, Ect) to a new M-4A1 Model, with deletion of the "Front" Iron sight and fully automatic capability replacing "burst". This could aid vastly in any CQB Encounter and "level" the playing field against a bad guy with an AK who only needs to hit you two times to take you down.