Limit Firebase Building Locations

[Rudd]

A prime example of where FBs can be used in unrealistic, gamey and frustrating ways is on Muttrah.

Lets assume the USMC make it to West city,

They call for supplies from a huey, ok nothing wrong with that ofc.

But 2/3 MEC guys have taken a logistic truck and build a FB next to the USMC repair bay.

Now, this means they can fire on the US helos as they come in, and bleed the USMC of tickets as they can kill the truck over and over.

On the iGi mumble night the MEC built AA in both the North City and Docks when all the actual fighting and flag capping had moved on from there.

The only choice to combat that would be to go and secure flags that....are supposedly already taken. This kind of gameplay would demand a squad stay on EVERY flag...which simply isn't going to happen with 32 people.

IMO this tactic should only be avaliable in the form of AA kits being supplied via ammo boxes as a Firebase represents a secured location from which people can spawn. preventing enemy teams being able to build Firebases within enemy flag Radii can only add to gameplay imo.

Cheers for reading, hope you agree/have suggestions.

[Jedimushroom]

Agreed, building within friendly cap radius is debatable but within enemy cap radius is patently ridiculous.

[Harrod200]

Well if you're limiting it only inside cap radius, it won't change much (the example of Muttrah you gave, the repair bay is well outside cap range anyway) since it's just as easy to place an FB a couple of metres outside the radius. Unless you add a larger prohibited range (cap +50%), you still won't see much change in FB placement, and you also add the problem of close flags (a'la Asad Khal) preventing you building an FB within your own flag's radius.

You could always say 'no FB's within cap range of ANY flag', but then you can still build right on the boundary.

[00SoldierofFortune00]

Sort of a good idea, but on smaller maps like the one Russian one (can't think of the name), the two CPs are each half the size of the map. So basically, the Russians wouldn't be able to build their FOBs in order to attack from, giving the Chechens an overwhelming advantage.

Same with Asad etc.

[Rudd]

^ thats mestia you're thinking off.

There is only a small overlap of the two flags on both asad and mestia so I don't think that would be a huge problem.

The repair bay thing could also count as a haing a radii to prevent enemy FBs next to it

[00SoldierofFortune00]

^ thats mestia you're thinking off.

There is only a small overlap of the two flags on both asad and mestia so I don't think that would be a huge problem.

The repair bay thing could also count as a haing a radii to prevent enemy FBs next to it

Still, the cap areas are huge and the Russian's don't start out with a flag, so they would be restricted to making FOBs pretty far back, which isn't really possible since the trucks cant go up in the hills very well.

[Alex6714]

Build only in captured flag territory/radius. You should only be able to build in terrain you have secured (captured).

[Solid Knight]

On insurgency I've built firebases (as insurgent) less than twenty meters away from a US firebase. Now that was fun but at the same time highly unrealistic. You already can't build a firebase within so many meters of your own and this should be extended to enemy firebases as well.

[Rudd]

Still, the cap areas are huge and the Russian's don't start out with a flag, so they would be restricted to making FOBs pretty far back, which isn't really possible since the trucks cant go up in the hills very well.

ah, but Russia has no bleed

No rush

[Jigsaw]

Agree with this suggestion tbh.

Although it was L4gi in an APC that was killin' yo helos for the most part on that round

[Rudd]

I just spend the last 3hrs getting video from the BRs...I know what killed what.

[sickly]

The only choice to combat that would be to go and secure flags that....are supposedly already taken. This kind of gameplay would demand a squad stay on EVERY flag...which simply isn't going to happen with 32 people.

IMO this tactic should only be avaliable in the form of AA kits being supplied via ammo boxes as a Firebase represents a secured location from which people can spawn. preventing enemy teams being able to build Firebases within enemy flag Radii can only add to gameplay imo.

I'll be honest: I've never witnessed what you're describing, so I assumed that what you are suggesting was already the case. ops:

So yes, of course players can't be setting up assets in enemy territory: it's an obvious exploit.

If that creates problems on the map because flag radii overlap, then alter the map to compensate--maps must adapt to game rules, not the other way around.

(Btw it's nice to see someone who understands the logic of not expecting a few players to defend every CP.)

[Rudd]

i disagree

thats nice, wanna back that up with a reason?

Cuz I agree! so there! Beat that!

[single.shot (nor)]

I like serious suggestions, that make sense to people other than the OP.

i like this suggestion, however, what if the FOB gets placed in a friendly radius, and the flag gets capped? destruction(due to code) or does it get left there? this might be an issue

[bloodthirsty_viking]

i disagree

first of all, you need more informtion or a dev will give you infraction points for unhelpfull comments..


now.. can it just be, set it up that like on muttra, it cant be within50-100 meters of the heal thing.. i mean, that should be possible, they do that with the main and stuff. i dissagree with within flag cap radious, becuase it will intupt the flow of gameplay, and these sweet 3 squad pubb assults wont happen, cuz the squads would be to far away.

but still, like i sead, place it so it cant be within so many meters of the w/e it is called. i hope u get what i sead=P

[sickly]

i like this suggestion, however, what if the FOB gets placed in a friendly radius, and the flag gets capped? destruction(due to code) or does it get left there? this might be an issue

Good point. I'm assuming any player can use any team's assets right? (I checked the manual but it doesn't say and I've never tried using enemy assets.)

If so, then this is not a problem because it's assumed that if the asset was previously placed then it's a legitimate defensive measure (i.e. if it's manned, destroy it or frag the occupant and use it yourself, or if it's not useful, destroy it).

If not, same deal only you'll have no choice but to destroy the asset (i.e. to prevent any enemies from using it).

The lack of players issue doesn't apply in this case because the asset is right where they are attacking (and the enemy is presumably defending). That part of the OP was more in reference to the issue of players sneaking back, setting up a firebase and using it to rack up points by spawnkilling vehicles (i.e. an exploit because there are insufficient players on the map to stop this from happening--and it's something that clearly isn't an issue in RL).

There is a kind of exploit if the asset is a Forward Outpost because it means that players could intentionally avoid destroying it to rob the enemy team of 1 of the 4 available FOs. Of course, this is only an "exploit" if the enemy has no commander, who would normally use the 'Remove' function to destroy the asset if needed. But that just penalizes teams who don't bother with commanders....and that's always good IMO.

Here's how it works in v0.85 (for those like me who have bad memories):

Forward Outpost must be built within 50m of 2 Supply Crates (Supply Crates can be dropped anywhere).

HMG/AA (firebase) must be built within 150m of a Forward Outpost.

Simple, clear system to affect spawning when the CPs change ownership.

Again I naively thought this was the case already. (Checked manual, doesn't say much about spawning at FOs or RPs; there doesn't appear to be any limit--the only way you can stop players from spawning at FO is to have 3 guys near it, or destroy it.)

Players shouldn't be able to spawn in radii of enemy-controlled CP (flag) for a similar reason as the firebase exploit: it's assumed that you control the area so setting up a FO right in their midst without first capping the flag is unrealistic (in RL you'd be under constant attack, but this is difficult to simulate with few players).

(That said, it would be nice to get an automatic warning that enemy players are nearing--let alone capturing--one of your CPs, so that you can at least try to get back and defend it.)

Lines should be drawn on the COs map, by a python script, to show the territory your team is 'in control' of. So the CO becomes more important too.

What about just a warning icon in the main view HUD that appears when you are in the radii of the enemy flag? Ideally, you would want both though.

[Smuke]

Sort of agreed.

How abot firebases can only be 150m from a friendly capped flag, if it goes neutral you can't spawn on it, and vice versa.

[sickly]

Not really, you should only be able to push it if you are smart enough to use your move marker or have a CO.

Huh? I'm taking about the general player view interface: when you enter within x meters of the enemy flag (i.e. the no-build enemy flag zone), an icon appears in the corner of your screen.

Of course it's not necessary if the enemy flag area-of-effect is visible in the player's map view--then the warning would just be an added convenience. ...Anyway, doesn't matter. The point is to let the SL know where s/he can or cannot place the FO if such a limit were implemented in PR. You shouldn't need the Commander for that (wouldn't cause people to play commander any more than now, just SLs would end up guessing more or less where the limit line was...and get frustrated when they couldn't build because they were still too close to the enemy flag.

How abot firebases can only be 150m from a friendly capped flag, if it goes neutral you can't spawn on it, and vice versa.

That's the idea. The 150m or whatever is the flag's supposed "area-of-effect"; if it's within the 150m and you don't control the flag, you can't spawn at the FO (i.e. until you re-capture the CP).

It's basically the same rule that prevents you from building too close to your Command Post or other friendly FOs, only in reverse (i.e. distance is from enemy CP).