[T&T] Tactics & Teamwork (Europe)

Smuke · Post by **Smuke** » 2009-05-26 22:57

T&T is the beast teamwork server around for us Euros.

Keep up the good work lads!

Post by **Masaq** » 2009-05-26 23:16

Thanks for the +ve feedback, it's always nice to get it... we do our best!

Elektro · Post by **Elektro** » 2009-06-07 17:41

T&T is one of the best servers

i just got kicket for 30 mins lol ^^ was just joking give warnings first xD!

Post by **epoch** » 2009-06-07 17:49

According to my admin you were given several warnings, but wouldn't shut up.

I've restarted PB on the server, so you should be able to rejoin now.

Jigsaw · Post by **Jigsaw** » 2009-06-07 22:11

Minor hissy fit coming but I feel its justified

End of the round on Jabal today (ended approx. 20.50 BST) there was a row over a couple US APCs getting too close to the MEC main. Now whether or not they were fired upon by MEC troops is irrelevant, the bottom line is that they should not have been there in the 1st place. They were too close to the MEC main with no legitimate reason to be there.

Waiting outside an enemy main to kill assets and people coming out (even when they are outside) is still baserape any way you cut it.

The main thing that it boils down to though is that said APCs were driven by regulars on the server and more specifically admins. Firstly you should know better, and secondly if someone like myself (despite being a regular) had done the same to you then the likelihood is that I would have been off. I don't expect to see that kind of stuff on the T&T server and especially not from longstanding and respected members of the PR community. On your website you claim:

Tactics & Teamwork is community of gamers who's sole goal in the gaming fraternity to have a laugh,
enjoy ourselves, take life with a pinch of salt and generally take the mick out of each other.

All well and good but when that detracts from the enjoyment of others through breaking your own rules its not right.

Pictures from battlerecorder:

LAV looking into MEC main appears to be about to fire

Defending itself, BTR fires

LAVs hide around corner and wait for anything to come out. They are intending to kill anything leaving base

LAVs fire on BTR leaving base

And destroy it. At this point the players controlling the LAVs should reasonably expect to be banned.

Please take this as constructive feedback. I do not expect to see this kind of gameplay on a server of the prestige of T&T, from anyone and especially not the people who run the server. Aside from this incident the gameplay has always been of a high standard which I thoroughly enjoy.

MadTommy · Post by **MadTommy** » 2009-06-07 22:31

Can't really do anything without knowing who the players, T&T members or admins were.

Can you PM me the players involved please?...

Thanks

thedoombringer0 · Post by **thedoombringer0** » 2009-06-07 22:46

I can say i was in one of those lavs a mistake to camp the corner yes and i appologise for it i wont blame my squad members who suggested we did so as i was the sl.

I just want to say it kicked off due to the btr engaging us as we drove past (so an sm told me)
Because of this we engaged back if that had not happened im sure we would have kept on with our inital goal of reaching south bridge.

SqnLdr · Post by **SqnLdr** » 2009-06-08 08:15

Ello,
I was one of the gunners in the APCs. We were passing through with non-hostile intentions when we were fired upon from an MEC APC from the MEC Mainbase. Although we had superior firepower and could easily have destroyed the APC there and then, we felt it cheap to fire into the mainbase, expressly to avoid a misunderstanding like this. Shots fired from the LAV were in self defence. the MEC APC had no reason to engage - the attack it pre-empted would be against server rules, and you said in your post how strict we are when it comes to this.

We then turned left to exit the line of sight of the two TOW missile installations, as we realised correctly that they would probably be manned as soon as we passed. We waited there for ~one minute and ten seconds, figuring out how best to proceed.

Net outcome: Two destroyed LAVs, one destroyed MEC APC.
It was NOT a baserape run. No hostile action was intended. We were just passing through.

TAW_Cutthroat · Post by **TAW_Cutthroat** » 2009-06-08 10:39

I posted my reply here.

MadTommy · Post by **MadTommy** » 2009-06-08 10:58

Ok...

I've seen the evidence from both sides.

I believe the T&T squad had no preemptive intention of sitting outside the MEC main in order to camp their main. However that is what happened.

The mistake was simply to try and drive 2 LAVs past the MEC main where the majority of the team was spawning. This was foolish and led to the events described above. This could have been avoided, but mistakes happen, and it was not the intent or mission to baserape or camp the MEC main. (all players involved know too well that such intent would see them removed from T&T asap)

I totally understand anyone spawning at MEC main seeing or hearing two LAVs right outside screaming BASERAPE.

One of our members has knocked up a quick vid from the BR file and he'll post it to youtube when he gets home from work, i will link that on my post when its available.

Mistakes were made but it was an honest mistake, no malice or intent to baserape was intended, just poor foresight.

Doombringer, the SL has apologised, and i hope this can/will be the end of the matter.

Jigsaw · Post by **Jigsaw** » 2009-06-08 23:36

Just wanna say thanks to Tommy and the rest of [T&T] for the way my concerns have been addressed. As always I wish no1 any ill will, just a desire to see the game played the way it should be.

Hope we can continue to enjoy good rounds together, this is and will remain my favourite PR server (spent 25mins trying to get on today whilst Asad Khal was on but sadly failed

lol).

Post by **epoch** » 2009-06-09 06:51

MadTommy wrote:One of our members has knocked up a quick vid from the BR file and he'll post it to youtube when he gets home from work, i will link that on my post when its available.

For the record: www.tacteam.org/downloads/JabalEvidenceMovie.wmv

I should probably give them a bollocking for wasting assets

Anyway - everyone's said their piece. Apologies have rightfully been made.

Subject closed. Move on.

HurschtiWurschti · Post by **HurschtiWurschti** » 2009-06-09 10:53

I think T&T needs a better definition of a baserape rule. On Fallujah, Americans sit inside the mainbase and shoot out, but when you place an IED right outside the exit and blow up leaving vehicles you get kicked (at least when T&T are playing U.S. side).

What defines baserape? Shooting back at Americans? Planting IEDs 5 meters from the entrance? 10 meters? 200 meters?

I call minor bs.

SqnLdr · Post by **SqnLdr** » 2009-06-09 11:33

HurschtiWurschti, It clearly states on our server rules:

Tactics & Teamwork Server Rules, Page 1 of this thread wrote:Base rape is NOT allowed. Ask a server admin about the specifics for any given map.

Feel free to ask us at our website or ingame. As we have a highly active administrative presence, this shouldn't be too hard.

Cheesygoodness · Post by **Cheesygoodness** » 2009-06-09 12:19

Moving expertly and swiftly along in what I would say in my own humble opinion is a quite well done subject change.

I'd like to praise the rest of the T&T crew. There dedication to there server is amazing from conversations I have had. Both as admins and as a group of guys paying for a server for everyone to enjoy.

So basically....

Thumbs up!

HurschtiWurschti · Post by **HurschtiWurschti** » 2009-06-09 12:41

SqnLdr wrote:HurschtiWurschti, It clearly states on our server rules:

Feel free to ask us at our website or ingame. As we have a highly active administrative presence, this shouldn't be too hard.

I asked ingame during Fallujah and the answer was: you can't baserape. For me that means I can't shoot into the base, throw molotovs over the wall etc., at the same time, U.S. cant sit on the roofs and shoot at us while we aren't allowed to shoot back (which is what was happening).

Kicked shortly thereafter for blowing up a vehicle traveling between the two fences exiting the mainbase.

Bit too random application of the rule and leaves too much room for individual interpretation imho; but that's just my feedback, I am sure other people see it differently.

MadTommy · Post by **MadTommy** » 2009-06-09 12:42

HurschtiWurschti wrote:I think T&T needs a better definition of a baserape rule. On Fallujah, Americans sit inside the mainbase and shoot out, but when you place an IED right outside the exit and blow up leaving vehicles you get kicked (at least when T&T are playing U.S. side).

What defines baserape? Shooting back at Americans? Planting IEDs 5 meters from the entrance? 10 meters? 200 meters?

I call minor bs.

We have recently had in-house discussions about this very subject. And there has been some confusion, especially regarding Fallujah. Admins have been interpreting baserape somewhat differently, we apologise for any confusion or ambiguity.

You should not find yourself being accused of baserape by placing IEDs outside but near the main US gates, as this is a valid tactic. Also US troops firing out of their main effectively forgo their protection and can be engaged without baserape accusation. However this needs players & admins to use common sense and work together.

Our baserape rule is in place to two key reasons:

1. To allow a safe spawning area.

2. To protect parked/spawned vehicles inside main bases.

I hope this clarifies our baserape rule.

Post by **Rudd** » 2009-06-09 12:51

Had great games (first great games in ages) on T&T last night, quite a few mumblers meant teamwork was on a high.

But as you probably remember som1/something randomly switch from Tad Sae as soon as it started to Operation Archer.

I'm unsure of T&T policy, but I would recommend you

1) never change a map once its got started, always remember to check b4 the round ends to see if you don't want the map. This helps people who crash etc. The population was completely destroyed by the change from tad sae. (Which is a good map)
2) never force one team to go insurgent twice in a row. Its boring and unfair to make them do it imo. Switching between blufor and opfor every round is part of what keeps it fresh.

MadTommy · Post by **MadTommy** » 2009-06-09 12:54

^^ cheers Rudd, last nights admin map change can be put down to 'god' having one too many glasses of plonk. (he claims it's some posh French red.. but us in the know know it's more likely Blossom Hill)

We're all human, shit happens, not the norm and it was a mistake.

HurschtiWurschti · Post by **HurschtiWurschti** » 2009-06-09 12:56

MadTommy wrote:We have recently had in-house discussions about this very subject. And there has been some confusion, especially regarding Fallujah. Admins have been interpreting baserape somewhat differently, we apologise for any confusion or ambiguity.

You should not find yourself being accused of baserape by placing IEDs outside but near the main US gates, as this is a valid tactic. Also US troops firing out of their main effectively forgo their protection and can be engaged without baserape accusation. However this needs players & admins to use common sense and work together.

Our baserape rule is in place to two key reasons:

1. To allow a safe spawning area.

2. To protect parked/spawned vehicles inside main bases.

I hope this clarifies our baserape rule.

Hey Tommy,

that's a good clarification. I hope your admin staff will apply it as stated by you.

Thanks!

HurschtiWurschti

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