Attack Heli

[Elektro]

Hey there, i was wondering if you could give the attack choppers ( Cobra, Havok, Apache, Z-10 ) The ability to withstand 1 AA missile as the HUEYs can?

[snooggums]

The attack huey is bugged and much tougher than it should be, Devs have noted that this should be fixed in future versions.

Attack choppers generally take one AA hit and live to make it back for repairs in my experience, does this happen on a regular basis for you?

[Celestial1]

The attack huey is bugged and much tougher than it should be, Devs have noted that this should be fixed in future versions.

Attack choppers generally take one AA hit and live to make it back for repairs in my experience, does this happen on a regular basis for you?

+1 for the bugged huey comment

However, I know that some players have said that the one missile usually disables the helicopter. I haven't actually flown helicopters in a while, and hit by an AA missile in air in quite a bit longer, so I can't attest to this.


In my personal opinion, missiles should have a high tendency to disable a helicopter if hit directly.

[McBumLuv]

Why? If you get hit by a missile, it SHOULD kill you. Helicopters aren't really made to take the grunt of any missile, so if you're hit and you survive (as a pilot), then your helicopter should at the very least be inoperable, with you plummeting to your fiery death from above/crash landing with some injuries.

And as others have said, the Attack Huey is bugged. So bugged infact, that when testing out a firebase on Barracuda, it lasted through 4 missiles before even starting to smoke.

[HangMan_]

Why? If you get hit by a missile, it SHOULD kill you. Helicopters aren't really made to take the grunt of any missile, so if you're hit and you survive (as a pilot), then your helicopter should at the very least be inoperable, with you plummeting to your fiery death from above/crash landing with some injuries.

And as others have said, the Attack Huey is bugged. So bugged infact, that when testing out a firebase on Barracuda, it lasted through 4 missiles before even starting to smoke.

Some choppers can take RPG hits. The CH-47 can.. Some parts of it (can't remember exact details ) are spread out so that a single RPG can't disable the Heli in one go.

[Gore]

A .50 cal does a good job against them though.

[Rhino]

Some choppers can take RPG hits. The CH-47 can.. Some parts of it (can't remember exact details ) are spread out so that a single RPG can't disable the Heli in one go.

every chopper has its fail safes. The thing is with the Chinook its such a large chopper, most of it is simply fuselage just to hold its cargo where its engines are tucked away. If an RPG hit it in the fuselage it might kill the guys in the back and blow a hole though it but doing more than that would very much depend on where it hit. If it hit a vital component then it could easily take it down.

The thing is a RPG-7 is not an Anti-Aircraft weapon. It is anything but even then Black Hawk Down might make you think otherwise. IIRC RPGs are soo inaccurate in r/l that hitting any kind of air target with them is pretty much luck and iirc again the main reason why they lost a bunch of blackhawks in the real BHD was because the militia used special RPG warheads to take them out. I'm not 100% sure what type they where you would need to ask a MA but I might be talking utter BS here I'm just going on what some one told me ages ago

An Anti-Aircraft missile, epically advanced ones fired from ADVs etc would most likley easily destroy a chinook since most of them are designed to target the engines and take them out etc.

[Dunehunter]

Also, if you shoot a couple of dozens of RPGs in the vague direction of a hovering BH, you're bound to hit -something- eventually.

[Elektro]

Well my idea was that an SA-7 couldnt take out an apache or cobra, but make it smoke and crash ( give it some time tho )

[MaxBooZe]

An Attack helicopter (Cobra, Apache etc.) Were designed to be fast and heavily armed most of them dont have a lot of Armour e.g the Cobra, It's small, agile and light weight that is all because it has reduced armour capabilities... I dont know for sure about the Russian helicopters because they all look larger and seem more armoured but it's the basic principle..

[dominator200]

Why? If you get hit by a missile, it SHOULD kill you. Helicopters aren't really made to take the grunt of any missile, so if you're hit and you survive (as a pilot), then your helicopter should at the very least be inoperable, with you plummeting to your fiery death from above/crash landing with some injuries.

And as others have said, the Attack Huey is bugged. So bugged infact, that when testing out a firebase on Barracuda, it lasted through 4 missiles before even starting to smoke.

What people have got to realise is the 90% of the time the missile dosent directly hit you it hits the flares that are deployed when ever i get hit square on it normally either kills me and the chopper plumbetts to the ground or cripples the chopper and its unable to fly also hitting the ground, so for me the choppers is good as it is.

[AquaticPenguin]

AA missiles can be air-burst or impact, I think PR's missiles are air-burst to improve the hit chance, else flares would be very overpowered since bf2's aa missiles will nearly always drift towards a decoy flare instead of an aircraft. Iirc most AA missiles work by firing a lot of small fragments into the aircraft in the hope it hits something vital like a fuel tank or the gearbox. So even if a missile does air-burst near you it should still do a lot of damage.

[snooggums]

Also, if you shoot a couple of dozens of RPGs in the vague direction of a hovering BH, you're bound to hit -something- eventually.

Ah, the days of Basrah with the A-10, insurgents on the roofs around mosque firing 10+ RPGs like a big old RPG shotgun in the hopes of taking it down. I'm so glad that play style is gone.

I'm not sure about the Huey's pilot protection from RPGs but I've 'killed' little birds by having the RPG hit inside the cockpit without even killing the chopper. Is the huey pilot vulnerable to the AA explosive radius?

[TF6049]

every chopper has its fail safes. The thing is with the Chinook its such a large chopper, most of it is simply fuselage just to hold its cargo where its engines are tucked away. If an RPG hit it in the fuselage it might kill the guys in the back and blow a hole though it but doing more than that would very much depend on where it hit. If it hit a vital component then it could easily take it down.

The thing is a RPG-7 is not an Anti-Aircraft weapon. It is anything but even then Black Hawk Down might make you think otherwise. IIRC RPGs are soo inaccurate in r/l that hitting any kind of air target with them is pretty much luck and iirc again the main reason why they lost a bunch of blackhawks in the real BHD was because the militia used special RPG warheads to take them out. I'm not 100% sure what type they where you would need to ask a MA but I might be talking utter BS here I'm just going on what some one told me ages ago

An Anti-Aircraft missile, epically advanced ones fired from ADVs etc would most likley easily destroy a chinook since most of them are designed to target the engines and take them out etc.

Actually, it was because they went in during the day where they had previously operated at night, and the insurgents didn't have night vision equipment.

[McBumLuv]

What people have got to realise is the 90% of the time the missile dosent directly hit you it hits the flares that are deployed when ever i get hit square on it normally either kills me and the chopper plumbetts to the ground or cripples the chopper and its unable to fly also hitting the ground, so for me the choppers is good as it is.

I realize this, and I understand it. I personally find that AA is way too underpowered in PR, or at least that flares are unrealistically overeffective and modeled. However, in this context I was refering to what the OP seemed to want, which was the ability to bear the grunt of the force of a supposed direct hit.

[Nemus]

The thing is a RPG-7 is not an Anti-Aircraft weapon. It is anything but even then Black Hawk Down might make you think otherwise. IIRC RPGs are soo inaccurate in r/l that hitting any kind of air target with them is pretty much luck and iirc again the main reason why they lost a bunch of blackhawks in the real BHD was because the militia used special RPG warheads to take them out. I'm not 100% sure what type they where you would need to ask a MA but I might be talking utter BS here I'm just going on what some one told me ages ago

In TRADOC Bulletin 1 (United States Army Training And Doctrine Command 30 Sept 1975) we can see about RPG - 7's Hit Probability when firing at a moving target 7,5 x 15ft ,crossing at 9 miles per hour.




And here is first hit probability:




Black Hawk's tail rotor has a diameter of 11ft.
When hovering at about 20m (It was the altitude of fastroping the troops) the hit probability is very high.

[Dev1200]

The attack huey is bugged and much tougher than it should be, Devs have noted that this should be fixed in future versions.

Attack choppers generally take one AA hit and live to make it back for repairs in my experience, does this happen on a regular basis for you?

1 hit takes out the cobra on muttrah.. with an AA missile. I've only survived 1 hit with an AA missile, but thats when I dropped a flare, the AA hit the flare, and exploded near my chopper. rotor failed just as I landed to safety.

[Sidewinder Zulu]

Interesting discussion, here are my thoughts:

In real life, the AH-64 Apache has a great deal of high-end armor in conjuction with it's ECM systems and Chaff, so it's fairly hard to take one down unless you have some adavnced AA weaponry.

Plus, the Apache, along with several other American and European helicopters (including the Chinook as someone mentioned earlier) are designed with redundant systems built into either side of the helicopter.
So if, for example, a Stinger hits an Apache and disables the targeting computer, the second one will kick in and the heliopter will still be able to function.

In my opinion, a direct AA hit to the tail or rear fuselage of an attack chopper in PR should cause it to have reduced engine power and sluggish rudder control, simulating damage to these components of the helicopter. (this already exists with the LB and Huey, as far as I know)

If the chopper takes a direct hit to the center, front, or engine, it should suffer an engine failure and be forced to crash land, although not killing the crew if the pilot is able to crash land correctly. (in real life the Apache has advanced shock-absorbers and systems that give the crew a 95% chance of survival if the helicopter makes an emergency landing.)

Most of these features already seem to exist in the game to some extent, but it would be nice to see them fully integrated in a future patch.

Overall, though, I think the attack helicopter is quite well designed in Project Reality.
Not too overpowered and still quite vulnerable to AA, but very deadly if put in the hands of a skilled crew.

[Dev1200]

Agree with post just under me.

Also, maybe increase the "environmental" damage while the engines are failing. Crash landings usually end in the heli blowing up on impact.. would be cool if you could do a real crash landing.. land on the ground, then jump out to safety instead of just delaying your death.

[goguapsy]

conclusion: damage system sshould be like ARMA2: the back fan (or wtv its called) is disabled (or taken off if possible with BF2 engine) - thats the place the AA missiles usually hit (considering ur using heat seeking and not a .50 cal) - plz realism check? ---> what i mean is exactly what happens in BLACK HAWK DOWN


ok so the pilot then has to decrease throttle (so the helo doesnt go out of frigen control) and when hes close to the ground increases it to lower the impact damage for blowing up or injuring anyone inside of the chopper). of course, Pilots are issued a MP5.

now i understand the problems of issuing a gun to a pilot (yes, paratroopers!) BUT its deff realistic.

this last statement though may not be necessary in PR due to the fact that the chances of a helo falling in enemy area is almost impossible.


ALSO make pilots lose about 6 tickets when they die, + the tickets for losing a helo!
this will prevent those bloody noobs from suiciding with the chopper than having to walk unarmed to the nearest supply create to be an infantryman. hopefully this will also increase the chances of having mini-missions inside the game (pilot rescue).