A small rant about some Players

[sparks50]

Your T***ing C***ing what?! That's a proper load of B****** Go to the North of England/Scotland/Ireland/ pretty much anywhere in the British Isles actually really to be fair to the Southerners (everyone else is worse though ) and you'll find that's very much not the case, especially down the pub...

Ive been to GB twice, and in media/tv/everyday the culture around swearing is all different and much more "bad". the same goes for the US and probably other English speaking countries..

[snooggums]

I'm posting as a player witness, I'm not an admin.

Okay, just spent another day playing PR... and I've been playing a while now...

And I have a few quick, simple complaints.... About players.... Not PR. The game itself and the guys who made it are awesome.

Please Note: This is a rant. Take it or leave it. I'm just blowing steam here. THESE IN NO WAY apply only to Project Reality... they pop up elsewhere, this is just the game I was playing when I ran into a crapload today.


1) Bossy commanders:
But today, I had an awesome experience where my 2 man squad was HOUNDED by the commander and another squad on the tactical gaming server because we did not want to defend a point that had literally the whole team, minus us, at it, after being told to build a firebase across the map and losing our ride back.

First, on TG the commander is always right unless he is ordering you to break the rules. Your squad and another squad were trying to assault a useless flag. For some reason your squad thought that capping the third flag on Koselsk as Chechyn was going to cause a bleed, which it doesn't, so you were giving the enemy points. We didn't blame you for the loss, we blamed you for not working with the team, and then being disrespectful when we told you to do so.

2) Strict server rules:
...Seriously... language filter?

Pay for your own server and you can set your own rules

3) "Read our forums or quit."
I was told by a wonderfully awesome player today to "read the forums or quit".

If you have TOO MANY RULES to scroll in game, you have TOO MANY RULES.

None of the TG rules are beyond sporting play, they consist of not TKing, not doing unrealistic things like suicide runs by normal armies and following orders. When you said you wouldn't follow orders you were told to read the rules posted on the forums since you seemed to think they did not apply to you.

About 15 minutes into the first match on a server, I've already forgotten what server I'm playing on. This is because:

4) I play a LOT of other games. I play MMOs, I play vBF2, I play Jedi Academy, I play HL Mods, I play 2142, etc etc etc. If you put a gun to my head, I couldn't name the last 2 servers I played on. No offense, I appreciate the servers, but, I don't sit around after I close PR thinking "man, I should go to the forums for that server I just joined"... nor do I look at the server list in-game, alt-tab, and start googling for server rules and forums. If you think "most" people do, you are sadly mistaken.

I cruise servers in all games without reading their rules, and I have never had an issue with administration since the vast majority of rules are the same, and the few exceptions are generally game specific like no baseraping in PR. I follow the odd rules when I am made aware of them (like squad names for assets, which TG does not use). When you were made aware, you refused to comply, that was the only issue.

Flame on.
-JX

We would love to have you play at TG again as long as you follow the rules when an admin notifies you. In this case you refused the orders, belittled the commander's plan and didn't work as a part of the team because you thought you were doing something helpful that ended up not being important at all instead of helping out with the commander's plan. We probably would have lost anyway, but at least the resources would have been put towards a good use instead of spreading the resources out to a flag that had no use to the team.

[Snook]

Your T***ing C***ing what?! That's a proper load of B****** Go to the North of England/Scotland/Ireland/ pretty much anywhere in the British Isles actually really to be fair to the Southerners (everyone else is worse though ) and you'll find that's very much not the case, especially down the pub...

Kind to keep us in there Us younger southern generation are just as bad as you york boys, just with a slightly posher accent We like to be creative with our swearing. When we can be bothered.

[gazzthompson]

I find the "They pay"-reason always such a lame excuse.

and whys that?

[JKJudgeX]

and whys that?

Illustrated example:
"They paid" to have slaves. That didn't turn out right or fair, either, did it?

Logical derivation:
Even though it is morally acceptable for a person or group to assume control and rule setting abilities for that which they monetarily pay for, being that they have chosen to share it with other humans, taking away that "shared" privilege simply on a whim due to "ownership" and without any other specified justification is generally frowned upon by those people that make your server worth having to begin with by actually playing on it.

On Human Rights:
The right to freedom of speech may be shut down by any server admin, but, those who do it too frequently often find themselves with empty forums, or consumed by the next competitor completely, as the stragglers who are holding on quickly jump ship.

Essentially, you have to choose a methodology for the decision-engine of your site, server, or country, and, an authoritarian dictatorship is generally not the best method to assure success. Your non-paying members would really be more loyal and happy on/in your site/server/country if they had a voice and were assured they would not be muzzled/blackbagged/banned/imprisoned based on some mutually agreed upon rules besides "I paid for it, so my rules are my rules".

Too often those who "paid for it" and who "own" it forget that the success or failure of the investment (site, server, country) is 100% dependent upon those who "use it" (Visitors, players, citizens)... and while you may only choose to consider MONETARY currency in the creation and success of your server, the free time that we donate to play a game on your server is another form of currency altogether, which is equally important.


I remind: Nobody is saying that rules are unnecessary or that you have no right to set them based on paying for the server... I'm simply reminding that the rules are subject to judgement by those who they are enforced upon.

Bottom Line:
If you mandate rules because you pay for the server, and those rules come into question, or your server population dries up, there might be a connection.

I hope that's helped clear that up. If you think it's a load of ****, I invite you to enjoy the pages of the nearest history book or newspaper to see how people tend to react to despotism, regardless of how it was achieved.


"If you don't like the rules, play somewhere else" is a hilarious cry of the burned server admin. You might as well say "if you are hungry, eat something"... that's what people are going to do whether you ban them or they leave by their own volition. Or worse, your bad attitude as a server admin might be 1/10th of the reason that Project Reality as a whole takes a bad hit to player population... there aren't that many servers.

Bye~

[nilloc93]

I totally agree with you 1st poster guy.

and yeah thats TG, its the only server where you can get a perma ban with no warnings for "anti amiericanism".

if your looking for a good server group try virginia or the chicago servers they are by far the best english servers.

and to that commander guy, the ENTIRE TEAM ON DEFENCE? can i get details on the map and how the game progressed? also if 2 squads could not hold a flag agaist 3 they are not the best defenders and you should have givin them a FB, also an entire team on defence is the DREAM of the other team cause they never have to worry about loosing ground and your team will always be in the same spot.

you should be luckey they even took thte flag and did not just bypass it and build FB's behind you.

[Wicca]

I think were all abit to spoiled.. And when someone tells us to do something, we cant stand it... Were like kids with no discipline, and we cry when someone tells us to do some chours..

OMG! GROW UP! You all suck!

Im going to vacuume now..

So, eat that sucker!


And btw, grow up

Judge? Did you go to school? I mean, seriously the only way you can think of a server in terms of a society is we, the players are immigrants, and we enjoy all the goodies from that country. Whilst the Citizens have to pay for it. In my oppinion they have the right to kick any immigrant who misbehaves.

[MrSh@vid]

I think were all abit to spoiled.. And when someone tells us to do something, we cant stand it... Were like kids with no discipline, and we cry when someone tells us to do some chours..

This is so true.

[JKJudgeX]

And btw, grow up

Judge? Did you go to school? I mean, seriously the only way you can think of a server in terms of a society is we, the players are immigrants, and we enjoy all the goodies from that country. Whilst the Citizens have to pay for it. In my oppinion they have the right to kick any immigrant who misbehaves.

Actually, your analysis is flawed.

Show me a country where 80+% of the population is immigrant, and I will cede this point, otherwise, thanks for asking if I'm educated and telling me to grow up.

[sparks50]

I find the "They pay"-reason always such a lame excuse.

and whys that?

Illustrated example:
"They paid" to have slaves. That didn't turn out right or fair, either, did it?

You must be joking. You are completely free to play at any server you like, or even take money from your own wallet and start your own.

[JKJudgeX]

I totally agree with you 1st poster guy.

and yeah thats TG, its the only server where you can get a perma ban with no warnings for "anti amiericanism".

if your looking for a good server group try virginia or the chicago servers they are by far the best english servers.

and to that commander guy, the ENTIRE TEAM ON DEFENCE? can i get details on the map and how the game progressed? also if 2 squads could not hold a flag agaist 3 they are not the best defenders and you should have givin them a FB, also an entire team on defence is the DREAM of the other team cause they never have to worry about loosing ground and your team will always be in the same spot.

you should be luckey they even took thte flag and did not just bypass it and build FB's behind you.

This is exactly how I feel about the strategy therein. If no one applies pressure to another part of the map, it invites the other team to apply all pressure to one point of the map. Attack is equally important to defense.

His response above where he indicates that there were people he saw on "UAV" attacking the base was wrong. For one, WE WERE SQUAD 5. There were 2 people in it. Everyone has access to the map. Why did I question the order? I hit the map, and saw a giant blob of blue dots and numbers on Hill 163. There were no other dots, anywhere, on the map, for several minutes and during the time at which I was originally asked to defend (people did gradually abandon it, and too many of them, true... this is AFTER there were 5-7 people attacking Hill Objective)

I think this commander needs to spend a month or two more in the squad leader chair before trying to command in the future. That's not a dig. I don't command... but, I also have a lot to learn about the individual maps and nuances thereof.




BY THE WAY... if you admit that digging a few people out of an objective is very difficult, don't you see the benefit of securing that objective?

I'm just saying... I shouldn't have to spell that out for you on VOIP. Barricaded fortress = good defensive point. Hill 163 ... notsomuch. Way too many angles of attack.

[snooggums]

...snipped out useless irrelevant text, a game server is a private location, just like my back yard. You have no right to free speech in my house's back yard if I don't want you there, businesses can have you removed if disruptive etc. Same thing with a game server/internet site.

I'm guessing you are in middle/high school since you have the concept of rights but don't know how they actually work.

I remind: Nobody is saying that rules are unnecessary or that you have no right to set them based on paying for the server... I'm simply reminding that the rules are subject to judgement by those who they are enforced upon.

The server owners have all the rights, they can restrict players to names that start with Q if we want to. The public players don't have direct input in the system, they can either appeal their opinion to the server administration (through the forums), simply obey the rules or go elsewhere.

Bottom Line:
If you mandate rules because you pay for the server, and those rules come into question, or your server population dries up, there might be a connection.

TG has been around before I joined, I had no input on the rules or policies. I did however find them to be a good fit for my playstyle. A lot pf players feel the same way, and like I, contribute money to support the continued existence of the server with the rules and policies we enjoy. Although I pay money for the server I don't get to make up rules, I still have to suggest changes like anyone can on the forums. The population at TG only grows, and players like you who want to fight authority wander off elsewhere.

I hope that's helped clear that up. If you think it's a load of ****, I invite you to enjoy the pages of the nearest history book or newspaper to see how people tend to react to despotism, regardless of how it was achieved.

I laughed at this. Maybe you haven't reached middle school age yet.

"If you don't like the rules, play somewhere else" is a hilarious cry of the burned server admin. You might as well say "if you are hungry, eat something"... that's what people are going to do whether you ban them or they leave by their own volition. Or worse, your bad attitude as a server admin might be 1/10th of the reason that Project Reality as a whole takes a bad hit to player population... there aren't that many servers.

Bye~

When there are plenty of server options to choose from with a wide variety of rule sets we are actually encouraging you to find one that suits your style when we tell you to play elsewhere. I find it hard to believe that this was the experience that made you aware of servers with rules you don't like being enforced by admins who were obviously in the favor of the majority of the players.

[Wicca]

Id say lock this server down for .... Ignorance

Edit: ... I completly miswrote... OMG! I meant Thread... Soz

[Nox.]

if your looking for a good server group try virginia or the chicago servers they are by far the best english servers.

Actually, this statement can be true if we consider US servers only. For European players UKWF servers are way better just for the pings. And I somehow it happens that I always happen to find UKWF gameplay level way higher than any of American servers but it may be that I don't play there in american prime-time too.

[JKJudgeX]

When there are plenty of server options to choose from with a wide variety of rule sets we are actually encouraging you to find one that suits your style when we tell you to play elsewhere. I find it hard to believe that this was the experience that made you aware of servers with rules you don't like being enforced by admins who were obviously in the favor of the majority of the players.

While I appreciate your repeated dig that my "playstyle" isn't team-oriented, you're completely wrong.

As I said before, I generally do follow orders. Good ones. I enjoy the teamplay aspect of PR. That's the whole reason I play it and RUN A SQUAD.

However, if my whole squad vetoes your order, I'm gonna go with the knowledge of 5 others over 1 other. If I, as a squad leader, think your order is bad, because I can see the math of the situation on the ground, I'm going to question it, and if the order is unreasonable or shortsighted, yes, there are times when I will ignore it. I did not blatantly ignore your order more than anyone else on that server. I just happened to be halfway across the map, between Hill 163 and tons of enemies/tanks/APCs when I got it, and the times that I died were when the firebase there was down or non-existant, while my firebase closer to the enemy position was still alive.

If you want to have a server with rules that state you must follow CO orders, maybe another rule to add to that hilariously gigantic list (which I just looked at) would be one that requires a certain amount of experience before assuming the command chair. That just makes sense.

[Rudd]

Come on...

this thread is quite simple

if you want to play on a server, it is their house and you are visiting.

You play by their rules or you leave the server

if you don't like the people/leaders on the server, you leave the server if admins do not support you

If you don't like that, get some buddies together and pay for and admin a server.

There is no need for personal attacks here, everyone has a different way of playing.

if you don't like how one or more servers play, don't play there. It really is that simple.

[Wicca]

Follow Squadleaders orders or Kick... Follow commander orders or be a *********... Simple yet effective... I mean people follow my orders all the time... And im a retard! So why wouldnt they follow you?

Seriously this is not a debate on the server rules anymore, your just rowing your self out of a mess. You know your wrong! Just admit it! I just cant stand looking at this stubborn acting. Lets get on with it!

Respect the server rules, or be kicked, there is no " But i am le tired!" There is no "There is a bunch of tanks between me and you" Its only "YES!" With a loud bang!

I seriously understand you! But your wrong... Stop this madness

[nilloc93]

Actually, this statement can be true if we consider US servers only. For European players UKWF servers are way better just for the pings. And I somehow it happens that I always happen to find UKWF gameplay level way higher than any of American servers but it may be that I don't play there in american prime-time too.

your right sorry bout that

although i in turn NEVER play on a euro server cause of ping times


@Wicca

so if the commander is an idiot leave the server? and for serriously i have had heated arguments with a commander trying to explain that THATS 40m AWAY FROM THE MOUSQE WE WILL GET SLAUGHTERED!!! but I should leave the server? i am commanding a good squad but I should leave the server cause the COMMANDER is an idiot? should the COMMANDER not leave the server?