"Sniper" squads and why I hate them

[Duckmeister]

So, recently I've been playing all my games on the Chicago Insurgency server. Almost every game, I try to lead my own squad, which usually goes quite well on this server.

However, there's always that one squad named "sniper". It's composed of one guy with a long, unpronounceable name, and by the time the round starts it's composed of four other guys with short, unintelligible names of the kind you find in vanilla BF2.

The squad "leader" grabs a sniper kit, hitches a ride on the first helicopter available (usually taking the seat of the last guy in the squad who's actually using it, which is VERY frustrating in itself), and asks to be dropped in the most contested area of the map, regardless of where the other players want to go.

Then there's the one guy who grabs the marksman, the rest who just mess around the rest of the game (sometimes asking why they can't get the sniper themselves), and finally the rest of the team who watches as the "leader" gets dropped off, killed immediately, and then respawns to take the second sniper kit, thus depriving the rest of the team from ever using the asset.

Usually by the middle of the round all the squads are either full or locked, and then a "sniper 2" squad is created, which is filled with more short, unintelligible names, and a squad leader who spams the chat asking why he can't get a sniper even when he's in his own squad.


I think all people who make a "sniper" squad in the same vein should be kicked immediately.

It's so painfully obvious that they don't know what they are doing, and are depriving the rest of the team from using an asset, that I don't know why they aren't already getting kicked at every available opportunity.

This also goes for that guy who is part of your squad, and seems like a good squad member until you tell him to take the marksman. Whereby he then goes off somewhere without asking for your permission, or even telling you for that matter, and claims it's your fault for telling him to "go marksman", as if being a marksman itself implies that you can no longer use any form of teamwork at all.


Some people might say "hey, it's not really hurting you, just let them do their thing". That may be true, but what about the guy who wants to make a proper sniper squad, where the leader sticks with his officer kit so he can spot for the actual sniper, what's he supposed to do when the kit is being hogged (and then wasted) by some noob who refuses to listen to anyone?


I absolutely hate this kind of "lol ima leet snipah" behavior, and was wondering what the rest of the community thinks about it.

[Rudd]

I think all people who make a "sniper" squad in the same vein should be kicked immediately.

I would agree. However there are only 32 people per team. There is a case to be made that a spotter isn't as important as an extra rifleman, a pilot or vehicle crewman.

All I ask is that the sniper talk to the commander directly, laze targets for air assets and if possible join a 3rd party VOIP application to pass intel etc.

[Lemon]

There's always people who waste the sniper kit in the beginning. Sometimes because of bad luck and sometimes because of stupidity.

There's quite often good sniper squads as well though. So be kicked for making a sniper squad's just wrong.

[talkinBEERmug]

I understand why you hate them, but I think it is worse when Infantry squad has a sniper in it. First thing is a sniper is about giving Intel not killing. So by having a sniper in your Infantry squad he cannot talk to the commander, and if he is moving up with them he is way too close to do any good. When I make sniper squads it’s always a two man sniper spotter team. We give Intel to commander, Mumble, and Text Chat first then we go for high priority targets, Sniper, Hat, AA, and Officer. I do feel any 1 man sniper squad is a joke, any 2+ sniper squad is a joke and admins should crack down. Also feel there has to be a stop to the squad joining grab a weapon leaving going on. I have had people who listen to me for 3 mins as I lay out the plan then grab sniper and leave.

[mat552]

I think all people who make a "sniper" squad in the same vein should be kicked immediately.

[...]but what about the guy who wants to make a proper sniper squad, where the leader sticks with his officer kit so he can spot for the actual sniper, what's he supposed to do when the kit is being hogged (and then wasted) by some noob who refuses to listen to anyone?

How do you tell who the good ones are then, if you kick them as soon as they grab the rifle?

I'm never in favor of kicking someone just because they made a certain squad type or name, because that says you live by assumptions. Chicago Hardcore servers are not the kind of places I go looking for actual teamwork and sometimes all you want to do is kick back, grab the rifle and grab some shots at range.

It's part of the learning process. Almost every good player I've ever talked at length with (not that many, but so few exceptions from the ones I have) have done this once or twice before being set straight on the purpose of the kit and what they're doing wrong.

When you want the ability to reach out and touch someone with just infantry, you need a sniper or marksman. When designating someone to grab it, just be sure to make it VERY clear that dicking about for personal gain will not be tolerated, and kick them from the squad if they do. Those of us who know how to use the kit for the good of the team will have already made that pact mentally.

It's just so frustrating because it's a loop. Players and SLs expect snipers to be stuck up, tk'ing, lonewolfing useless bags of meat. So SUPRISE SUPRISE when they fulfill that expectation.

Hold us to a higher standard. Give us a chance. Most squad members who are with it can make the transition to using that just fine.

PS. Sorry for any incoherence, I'm just tired of threads like "Pilots r teh suk" or "REMOVE SNIPER KIT" Don't flush all of us with those who can't read or perform teamwork.

[superhunty123]

Your description sounds remarkable similar to pretty much ever PR round I play!
You can always tell a n00b squad when the leader of "Sniper" squad take sniper or marksman. The SL should be the spotter!

[Duckmeister]

@mat552 & Lemon

Read much?

Mat, you even quoted me and you still didn't read it!

Let's look at what I actually said:

I think all people who make a "sniper" squad in the same vein should be kicked immediately.

I wasn't saying "kick anyone who makes a squad called sniper or picks up the sniper kit", I was saying anyone who uses the sniper in the same way I described in that entire novella I wrote to explain my position should be kicked.


Thank you, Rudd, for actually reading what I said. You obviously understood me, and I totally understand where you are coming from, so thank you for actually reading what I said before you posted your disagreement.

[ankyle62]

Your description sounds remarkable similar to pretty much ever PR round I play!
You can always tell a n00b squad when the leader of "Sniper" squad take sniper or marksman. The SL should be the spotter!

yep, i have had pretty good matchs with me either being the sl and spotting or having the sl spot for me. much more productive.
i hate when i see a sniper squad with the full 5 people in it running around aimlessly in the hills when they could be helping cap flags.

[X1 Spriggan]

I like sniper squads. Its fun playing them, and its fun encountering them when leading a squad.

[Sabre_tooth_tigger]

Sniper should be recon first, aggressive second I reckon. Sniper is generally bad in forest or jungle but somewhere like Muttrah its one of the most important squads


In theory the kits or assets should graduate to those who use them best, dying with the kit obviously denys its usage. Problem occurs when its the same person using and losing the kit or asset throughout a game, only then would I agree with the OP because everyone has their own method of attack but maybe the game isnt hard enough on failure.
I dont think its possible to regulate, I liked it when pb would kick for negative score but that wasnt perfectly fair either

[burghUK]

rant thread. Someone close it.

[BogusBoo]

I hate it when they join your sq and steal a sniper kit, then quit your sq and make a "sniper" or "Echo" sq..

[Mad-Mike]

lol yet another thread on snipers

[Snazz]

I think 'who should get what asset' in your opinion doesn't matter in a public server unless you're the admin.

I prefer that people are left to play their own way, as the alternative is stereotypically a control freak admin that makes hasty judgments on how other people 'should play'.

BTW in advance, just because I disagree with you does not mean I didn't read your OP.

[Big Lebowski]

Rant threads about bad snipers annoy me alot more then the bad snipers themselves..

[Double Doppler]

The 'Sniper Guys' are an embaressment to the serious snipers ingame; a snipers main job is to report info to the commander (if avalible (usually not) or the team. They are a recon unit, not a bunch of schoolkids/n00bs looking for a quick getaway (finding a sniper rifle then being frustrated that it is too hard to handle and needs concentration and patience (which most of them lack) and it isnt the regular COD4/VBF2 rifle for the simple-minded). If all else fails, they grap the AR kit and do a rambo (they probably fail at that as well because of the deviation).

[ralfidude]

this is yet another thread composed of sniper problems. Sorry to say, but theres nothing you can do about it. Id like to see some better usage of the kit and all, but its all server side rules about everything, so yes, we know, we read all the other 59 threads about this, one of which was mine as well some time back. At this point its not even worth arguing about, but i feel u.