Who Else Thinks that the RP Changes (being beta tested) will Destroy PR?

[DaKillerFox]

Statement by OP:The rallypoint changes will lead to troubles for newbies

Answer: Your wrong. No rallies is newbie friendly, not the other way around. Just click on the spawnpoint (fob) and you spawn there. Whats so difficult about it? When i first joined a training server it was the rallies I didnt figure out at first, why cant I spawn at squads 3 rally etc. Now that rallies are drastically reduced (beta D), that confusion is almost gone. All this stuff will be in the manual anyway, so you have gotten the issue around the back of your foot (swedish expression; basically your statement is wrong.).

Ps. FOBs are everywhere in the BETA so the amount of walking will not increase that much.

I agree with this statement. I am new to PR and have been playing a couple of hours for the past few days and when I die and have to respawn, I am confused as heck about where to spawn and be near my team. I think in one game I spawned at the RP and no one was there. I couldn't find my SL, found some other squad mates who were running around willy nilly and got us all killed. Instead I just spawned back at the Carrier, I think this was on Muttrah?

In another instance, I spawned on the rally point and didn't know what the heck was going on and ran out with two other squad mates to this corner of a wall and got sniped, all three of us. As a new player getting used to the differences in PR from vBF2, I much appreciate the slower pace of starting out back farther and getting transported via Heli or APC to a point near the front lines so I can gauge what's going on and use the VOIP to chat with my SL and see what he wants or needs.

Plus it's kinda weird when I huff it all the way from the base with my SL to a point near the front lines, place a RP and then a bunch of guys out of no where just spring up. That's kinda weird IMO.

Just my 2 cents, I know I'm new here...

[R.J.Travis]

Oh really?

hacke xD

you need to show proof it was the beta xD and also 22 was pure luck or someone killed there own cache with a ied xD

I think this system works great for AAS but is really bad for Insurgent mode

[DaKillerFox]

Which is why this change is terrible. It destroys one of the main reasons why people join squads (RPs) and tries to force them into working as a team by all spawning together on FOBs. As you just said, people will play the way they want to play, so if there isn't teamwork (or at least teamwide teamwork) already in PR as some of the people here (who are clueless IMO) are arguing, then how is this going to change it as you just said?

I said they were essentially forced into squads because of the benefits and rewards they get from it which are very important to surviving ingame such as spawning closer, more weapon choices, etc. There need to be incentives for people to join squads. The new Beta FOB spawn system does nothing to add to the reward/incentive system already in PR. Without incentives, there is no reason for anyone to do anything ingame really. People aren't just working out of kindness. Think of it like a job. People need to be paid or else they wouldn't be working there. Its no different with video games.

To the first point, if there already isn't teamwork, what would you have the dev's do? What you're saying is they should just accept it, instead of trying to fix it. Even if this doesn't fix that problem, at least they are trying to fix it or find some way to fix it, which is better than not doing anything right?

Again, I am new to PR, so don't bash me if I sound naive here, but I dl'd PR and installed it because I want to play a game with teamwork, which it sounds like many of you here want the same thing. So I think it's safe to say (although I will concede that a lot of players on the servers don't echo this desire, but you have to admit there are also plenty of team players too) that many people join squads because they want to, not because they have to. I join a squad because I like playing alongside a team and knowing that I'm part of the team and the team needs me. And I disagree, that last part of your argument is way off base, some people work because they enjoy their work, but what you said doesn't translate to video games. I play video games for the personal joy and entertainment of it, you make it sound like it's a chore where people only play video games because they will get something out of it. If people are only playing PR because they have to, like they have to go to work, or they are in a squad because they have to be, again like having to go to work, then maybe I'm playing the wrong game... But my experiences, however short lived seem to support the opposite.

[stealth420]

Everyone thinks that without the RPs you will have to walk to the front. The solution to this is to add a couple more helicopters to the game for both sides ( 2 Blackhawks on Ramiel and 2 LBs) . This would give the chopper pilots more missions to fly and make the helicopters more useful overall.

[SilentWarrior]

Everyone thinks that without the RPs you will have to walk to the front. The solution to this is to add a couple more helicopters to the game for both sides ( 2 Blackhawks on Ramiel and 2 LBs) . This would give the chopper pilots more missions to fly and make the helicopters more useful overall.

By the amount of negative comments I have when I ask for more vehicles to counter this RP change, I think that we are gona start walking ALOT! (not that we dont walk alot anyways on current version)

I beleave ppl will just hang out near the FOBs the rest of the round, pretty much killing anything regarding to flag captures and wat not, why adventure out and get killed when u can pretty much hang out at FOB trying to snipe enemies? Talk about trying to bore enemies to death! But... then again, I dont think enemies will get borred of spawn killing. Just a question of how many ppl admins are willing to kick to stop the spawn kill.

Or you will see ppl trying to actually leave the FOB and getting shot over and over and over and over running away from FOB because some retard "Logistics" squad made the FOB in the center of a planar area. YAY!

Or the typical ... so much protection that you have to get hurt just to exit the FOB

[Sgt. Mahi]

hacke xD

you need to show proof it was the beta xD and also 22 was pure luck or someone killed there own cache with a ied xD

I think this system works great for AAS but is really bad for Insurgent mode

I think I can say that this round was won fair and square. It was seriously the most well coordinated teamwork I've ever seen on Karbala (I don't play tournaments). It was great fun and it really took the tacticts to a whole new level. First time I've seen an insurgency map been won by blueforces since the changes though and it took over 2 hours (I think) to finish the map so I'm not sure how much fun the guys on the insurgent team were having. It was proven to me that it can be done but I think it also proved that blueforces never will win insurgency maps unless the blueforces really, really work together. So it really depends on how much teamwork you want in PR (and really isn't teamwork the key word in PR?).
I have to admit though I might have been bored if I was on the insurgent team in that round...

[mr.cuddelywuddely]

in reference to the title: not me.
i did not play the D beta yet but i played the version in wich the rally was completely removed i think it was the C beta.
i loved it.
For these reasons:
planning acutally gets you somewhere now and without it you will fail and have to walk alot.
To succeed now, a more teamoriented mentality is required instead of just you and your squad.
(*note, this might s%ck at first because everyone is still thinking that their squad is the only one they need to get the job done, but people will found out soon enough that alone they cannot win)
Less spammy: when you are defending (or attacking for that matter) when you manage to fight the enemy off they wont be back for a while giving you time to regroup and think about your next move.

about the new player thing: imo when someone from bf2 vanilla comes to pr they should be interested in a more slow, strategic game instead of rush rush powpow. (if you want that go play mw2, its awesome for that)

and last. it has happend before with changes in PR there are always people saying this will DESTROY pr, but pr only got better. the main thing its mostley not the changes in pr made by the devs that destroy the game because most of the time these are thought out well, just look at the different beta's to figure out how pr is gonna evolve, but the willingness of the players to adapt to the changes and work together as a team to get the job done.

[Threedroogs]

By the amount of negative comments I have when I ask for more vehicles to counter this RP change, I think that we are gona start walking ALOT! (not that we dont walk alot anyways on current version)

I beleave ppl will just hang out near the FOBs the rest of the round, pretty much killing anything regarding to flag captures and wat not, why adventure out and get killed when u can pretty much hang out at FOB trying to snipe enemies? Talk about trying to bore enemies to death! But... then again, I dont think enemies will get borred of spawn killing. Just a question of how many ppl admins are willing to kick to stop the spawn kill.

Or you will see ppl trying to actually leave the FOB and getting shot over and over and over and over running away from FOB because some retard "Logistics" squad made the FOB in the center of a planar area. YAY!

Or the typical ... so much protection that you have to get hurt just to exit the FOB

in the current version, squads just attack attack attack. it's rare to get a squad to defend an objective, even if the fight for the objective took 20+ minutes. most squad leaders just put their heads down and charge forward. this is why my squads are almost always having to defend round after round. it's a hell of a lot harder to attack in the no-RP version, which has lead to more defense. i think this is a good thing, especially since it has freed up my squad to do more attacking. in part 1 and 3 of the beta, going on attacks has been epic.

people being spawn killed on an FO is not an issue because there's always an alternate spawn. people who spawn in the same warzone over and over deserve to die over and over.

as far as the adding vehicles...i agree. i think that transport vehicles will definitely be needed on a lot of maps if RPs are taken away for good (remove them. please! please! please!).

[Herb-in-Fighter]

Woo, Big thread.

Anyway, not a huge fan of the beta D rally changes either. Shit worked well for the last how many patches? 10 or so.

[Garmax]

Everyone thinks that without the RPs you will have to walk to the front. The solution to this is to add a couple more helicopters to the game for both sides ( 2 Blackhawks on Ramiel and 2 LBs) . This would give the chopper pilots more missions to fly and make the helicopters more useful overall.

no not the solution.. this means less people playing and more noob pilots running for the choppers and dying and wasting assests and forcing people who actually play to walk..

[goguapsy]

Are players here really ready to sacrifice semi-quick gameplay but tactic/squad based gameplay for long walks in order to face 1 or 2 squads gameplay?

Just played DEF in qwai river.

16 kills, 6 deaths. One of the highest K/D as INF for me. Also, loads of action: killed 14INF, defended 2 flags, capped the final flag, blew up a stryker and hit many others.

[R.J.Travis]

Please remember I am not asking for the RP to stay I liked it the best in BETA C when it was 100% removed!.

But you cant allow the insurgents to keep there massive spawning on the cache and bluefour forced to need 100% best team play in the world with 100% of the players working together to win with only 22 tickets rwally?

the bluefour will need more tickets or the insurgents will need to only be allowed to spawn on a cache that has NOT been spotted and keep pawning on it when bluefour cant.

that being said the insurgent game mode spawn system need to be worked out.

[00SoldierofFortune00]

To the first point, if there already isn't teamwork, what would you have the dev's do? What you're saying is they should just accept it, instead of trying to fix it. Even if this doesn't fix that problem, at least they are trying to fix it or find some way to fix it, which is better than not doing anything right?

There is already a lot of teamwork in PR. What I was responding to was the guys who always whine and make up the notion that there is no squadteamwork or team level teamwork in PR which is just false. But if there isn't (according to the guys who always want something nerfed or changed), than how exactly will this change prove any different or change anything?

Again, I am new to PR, so don't bash me if I sound naive here, but I dl'd PR and installed it because I want to play a game with teamwork, which it sounds like many of you here want the same thing. So I think it's safe to say (although I will concede that a lot of players on the servers don't echo this desire, but you have to admit there are also plenty of team players too) that many people join squads because they want to, not because they have to. I join a squad because I like playing alongside a team and knowing that I'm part of the team and the team needs me. And I disagree, that last part of your argument is way off base, some people work because they enjoy their work, but what you said doesn't translate to video games. I play video games for the personal joy and entertainment of it, you make it sound like it's a chore where people only play video games because they will get something out of it. If people are only playing PR because they have to, like they have to go to work, or they are in a squad because they have to be, again like having to go to work, then maybe I'm playing the wrong game... But my experiences, however short lived seem to support the opposite.

No doubt that people join squads because of good SLs and wanting to teamplay. But you have to admit that the RP is also a major reason why people join squads. Look at PR vs. BF2. Both have squads. What makes PR have so much more people join squads over those in BF2? RPs is a major reason. Even if you go on a noobie server and eliminate the "veteran" argument, you still have more people joining squads over vanilla BF2.

A lot of people get frustrated too and leave squads for one reason or another. When they have no other spawn but the RP, it makes it hard for them to just bug out like that and makes them have to stick/dedicate time to the squad.

[00SoldierofFortune00]

in the current version, squads just attack attack attack. it's rare to get a squad to defend an objective, even if the fight for the objective took 20+ minutes. most squad leaders just put their heads down and charge forward. this is why my squads are almost always having to defend round after round. it's a hell of a lot harder to attack in the no-RP version, which has lead to more defense. i think this is a good thing, especially since it has freed up my squad to do more attacking. in part 1 and 3 of the beta, going on attacks has been epic.

And with the Beta, you are either going to have squads just defend, defend, defend, or still attack, attack, attack. You will never be satisfied and I gurantee you that it will play out one of these two ways. There are already plenty of people who defend in PR, so what you said is false. Second, yes, it maybe more easy to attack in the non-RP version (you sound like you want the flag given to you IMO), but it also increases camping a certain spot, hence stalemates. What most likely will happen is that a majority of the team will stay back and defend the FOBs and set up defenses on them while 1 or 2 squads go off alone and go after seperate flags and get slaughtered since they are up against more enemies.

people being spawn killed on an FO is not an issue because there's always an alternate spawn. people who spawn in the same warzone over and over deserve to die over and over.

Not when the first FOB being overrun is the only one on the map, which is a high probability on some assault maps like Barracuda or Muttrah where the enemy can get to you very fast. Where will they spawn then? O yea, back at main.....

[boilerrat]

The game isn't going to be ruined, it is going to evolve into something better.

[R.J.Travis]

The game isn't going to be ruined, it is going to evolve into something better.

That's what they said about wolfs Extreme deviation "That I loved and really wish was re added about in a much better forum.

As I said before I love the PR changes in AAS it really makes caping a point much more real you don't feel like your kill the same squad over and over you feel like your really Killing them off not just caping and re fighting the same squad intell you are over run getting that first kill does not matter whewn hes back in a few secs.

The only problem I see is Insurgent mode I really Hope to see the "DEV team put out a "BETA I" and have it look into Insurgent mode strictly I would find it more responsible of them if they do chose so.

[LithiumFox]

The idea with insurgency is it's SUPPOSED to be tough for Blufor. Just the Blufor team never seems to think they'll win so they just kind of go "Whatever"

I seem to lose in insurgency no matter what. xD i have no idea what ANY of you guys are talking about "unfair advantages" xD

[SilentWarrior]

in the current version, squads just attack attack attack. it's rare to get a squad to defend an objective, even if the fight for the objective took 20+ minutes. most squad leaders just put their heads down and charge forward. this is why my squads are almost always having to defend round after round. it's a hell of a lot harder to attack in the no-RP version, which has lead to more defense. i think this is a good thing, especially since it has freed up my squad to do more attacking. in part 1 and 3 of the beta, going on attacks has been epic.

people being spawn killed on an FO is not an issue because there's always an alternate spawn. people who spawn in the same warzone over and over deserve to die over and over.

as far as the adding vehicles...i agree. i think that transport vehicles will definitely be needed on a lot of maps if RPs are taken away for good (remove them. please! please! please!).

The problem with defense is that when charged, the RPs and FOBs stop working. So basically, theres no need to defense! If the attacking force is big, retreat, pick them off one by one, or even divide them, neutralize them, and move in to rebuild... thats how it works right now.

Taking RPs off wont fix this, period.

If you could actually spawn while under attack on a FOB, ppl would make every efford to defend the FOB at all costs, this would actually mean building FOBs in good areas where the spawn itself is protected from direct fire. And barbwire was in places where enemy could be easily killed when approaching it... much like in real world (barbwire is made for keeping infantry away, but if they try and charge in they get stuck, and its put on open areas protected by machine gun fire)

Devs should try this in a beta E version imho. But also put in ways to disable the placement of barbwire so close to the FOB... squads build ton of stuff near it to get more points since they are useless if enemy is close anyways.


PS: i am up for RP removal if they put good alternatives. Plain RP removal will damage the game.

[Rudd]

That's what they said about wolfs Extreme deviation "That I loved and really wish was re added about in a much better forum.

there was no open beta for wolfs deviation

[Jarryd_455495]

i reckon it will disrupt it for a short while but everyone will get used to it or face the long walk back to combat.

i was playin in the bigD server today and i was in a average squad compared to the others in our team (others were clan members though) and it took some time till they built some fowardbases but it got there.