Suppression effect from helicopter rotors

[Startrekern]

I can see why the suggestion was made and it is an interesting one IMO, but i have had to get on and off helicopters of various shapes and sizes hundreds of times both slowly and quickly, standing and bent over and i have never been suppressed once. Just have to make sure if you're wearing a hat you stick it in your pocket or it blows away.

I don't believe the suggestion has to do, necessarily, with the suppression itself but more to do with simulating brownouts better without adding an incredibly bigger amount of particles to the mix. The suppression function, as far as I personally can think of, seems to be the best way to do it.

[Ninja2dan]

I can see why the suggestion was made and it is an interesting one IMO, but i have had to get on and off helicopters of various shapes and sizes hundreds of times both slowly and quickly, standing and bent over and i have never been suppressed once. Just have to make sure if you're wearing a hat you stick it in your pocket or it blows away.

I would have to agree. The only effect I've ever experienced during helicopter operations was getting my mouth full of sand and dirt, my face whipped with pebbles and debris, and the nasty feeling of mud stuck in your ear.

The down-wash of the rotors is going to cause some force, but not enough to knock a person down/over. Generally, you use a site that has been cleared of larger debris so there is minimal risk to the aircraft and ground forces. But even the smallest bit of grass or rocks the size of a pencil eraser can turn into mini-missiles.

While it can be an annoyance, it's in no way suppressive in the sense that is being suggested. I don't really feel that such as effect would really be needed, and if one was added it would be hard to limit it from being exploited at some point.


Having to code such an effect would also be a royal pain in the ***, because you would need to alter the effect based on the specific surface the aircraft was currently over, its altitude and speed over that terrain, the size of the aircraft, etc.

[DankE_SPB]

The down-wash of the rotors is going to cause some force, but not enough to knock a person down/over.

just to add to it, i've been standing next to Mi-8 few times, when it was on low throttle it wasn't a big problem, just very strong wind, the only moment when it was hard to stand is the moment it takes off on full throttle, but at that moment you should either be inside or already far away to not suffer from it

[Brummy]

That's cause the Mi-8 is one badass mofo

But yeah, I agree with the few above me, it really doesn't a surpression effect to be honest.

[terenz]

Thanks Ninja2dan. I stated in the suggestion that ive never stood up next to a warm helicopter and I havent experienced what youre explaining. I figure that there would be some sort of wind or yes stones/grass that would limit your combat abilities slightly, but as you say, its not worth making such an effect for that.

[Ninja2dan]

Here's an idea that can sort of suggest a home-cooked way to relive the experience of Air Assault or other rotor-wing troop transport operations:

1) Get a gas-powered lawn leaf-blower/vacuum, one that is capable of both sucking up the leaves and also blowing them away.

2) Suck up about 2 handfuls of dried leaves, 2-3 handfuls of fresh grass clippings, 1 handful of small pebbles (pencil-eraser sized), and about 2 handfuls of dirt.

3) Reverse the motor.

4) Put your face about 6 inches from the nozzle and turn on the blower.


While I don't literally suggest anyone perform the above, I'm sure you get the point. You will have some strong wind from the downwash, combined with all of the smaller loose debris zipping all around. Luckily, a large majority of this debris is swept away while the aircraft is touching down, and during that time everyone is generally looking away from the aircraft from a safe distance.

Once the aircraft has settled, the crew chief or similar will direct the soldiers when and where to enter the aircraft. By this time, the forces of the downwash and the number of debris is reduced enough to be of little risk or harm to the soldiers. Still, I've seen incidents where people had their front teeth broken from gravel or actually had cuts from grass blades.

If you are attempting to participate in a helicopter transport operation without wearing eye protection, you deserve any hell that comes your way. Same reason I will never board any aircraft with my sleeves up.

[killonsight95]

You have goggles + there's not much dust on board a carrier (well unless the crew are sloppy).

Uncomfortable - maybe if you don't have goggles, enough to make you unable to do anything, NO. It's a stupid idea - what happens when a helicopter goes over a squad's head? They get suppressed.... yeah nice and realistic.

the wind would be enough to piss you off as the person said it shouldn't be as bad as getting suppressed by a gun, less blurryness for the helicopters so you can still see where your going but bad enough so you don't want to get dropped in a hot LZ where u may recive shots straight away xD
i know hot LZ's shoudln't be used but sometimes they are needed

[Herbiie]

the wind would be enough to piss you off as the person said it shouldn't be as bad as getting suppressed by a gun, less blurryness for the helicopters so you can still see where your going but bad enough so you don't want to get dropped in a hot LZ where u may recive shots straight away xD
i know hot LZ's shoudln't be used but sometimes they are needed

Dude - these guys are SOLDIERS.

They have a job to do - the dust and dirt will mean nothing to them, they will carry on regardless, they, in fact, would not care about the effect of the Helicopter. Some even ENJOY the effect of the Helicopter around them.

Also what are you talking about with the LZs? First off troops IRl have been dropped in Hot LZs - do you know what they do? They return fire like a normal contact, almost oblivious to the Helicopter. That's been proved in situations such as Operation Mutnay.

There's already alot of confusion around a Helicopter landing in PR, with the noise and everyone running for cover if under fire, it's as much confusion as an air assault landing with well trained soldiers.

[Bringerof_D]

ok why does everyone keep thinking we want a full suppression effect? what most of us are getting at is like say the current suppression effect from a single bullet is 10, a helicopter near by would be 1. thats the idea, just a slight blurring to simulate a bit of dust without needing more particle effects. NOT to actually suppress anyone, the idea is to simply borrow a slight amount of that effect to simulate the slight amounts of debree that might obscure a bit of your vision.

i also fail to see how this will be a problem for enemies since choppers dont land near them anyways, soldiers getting on wont be affected because they'll still see the chopper and be rushing straight for it anyways. guys getting off wont have much of an issue either if they run far enough away (5 meters maybe?)

@herbiie: you're reading the posts, but i'm not feeling entirely sure your taking a moment to think about what we're talking about. what i get from your posts is that all you see from all our posts is "helicopter suppress enemy"

[Herbiie]

ok why does everyone keep thinking we want a full suppression effect? what most of us are getting at is like say the current suppression effect from a single bullet is 10, a helicopter near by would be 1. thats the idea, just a slight blurring to simulate a bit of dust without needing more particle effects. NOT to actually suppress anyone, the idea is to simply borrow a slight amount of that effect to simulate the slight amounts of debree that might obscure a bit of your vision.

i also fail to see how this will be a problem for enemies since choppers dont land near them anyways, soldiers getting on wont be affected because they'll still see the chopper and be rushing straight for it anyways. guys getting off wont have much of an issue either if they run far enough away (5 meters maybe?)

@herbiie: you're reading the posts, but i'm not feeling entirely sure your taking a moment to think about what we're talking about. what i get from your posts is that all you see from all our posts is "helicopter suppress enemy"

If the suppression doesn't do anything what's the point in doing it?

Also Brown Outs are really only a problem for the pilots - and tbh we already have an unrealistic amount of Helis crashing so to add anything MORE to hinder them is plain dumb.

It's a useless and unrealistic suggestion, which will add nothing to gameplay, realism, or immersion. Frankly - it's plain stupid.

[terenz]

If the suppression doesn't do anything what's the point in doing it?

Also Brown Outs are really only a problem for the pilots - and tbh we already have an unrealistic amount of Helis crashing so to add anything MORE to hinder them is plain dumb.

It's a useless and unrealistic suggestion, which will add nothing to gameplay, realism, or immersion. Frankly - it's plain stupid.

Lets all run ultra low graphics or even 2d, it doesnt do anything . I still happen to disagree that its stupid. I learned that the force i thought was there, is not and we wont really need a suppression effect. I dont think its stupid tho, this miinor suppression effect could similate the small wind and/or dust. Just like we have a stamina bar, we cant feel wind on our body while playing, but could be similated. Blurry vision isnt the only effect that could happen when under fire, but thats what they use in pr, because thats the best solution to suppressive fire. We wont need this suppression effect because theres probably no use putting in the time, but its not stupid or useless.

[Herbiie]

Just like we have a stamina bar, we cant feel wind on our body while playing, but could be similated.

Too what end? A mild annoyance? There's no point, and therefore it's stupid.

[Bringerof_D]

Too what end? A mild annoyance? There's no point, and therefore it's stupid.

it wont effect the pilot at all, only for troops around not in, it'll mostly just be for aesthetics but like i said, your not exactly bothering to read into these posts are you? my point is theres going to be bits of grass and a bit of dust, it wont suppress you but it will obscure your vision slightly. it could be done in a more realistic way but again to use particles would mean more strain on computers. it's only unrealistic to you because you keep thinking that what we want is a massive whirlwind that suppresses everyone while what we really want is just a slight blur to simulate a bit more dust.

if you think about it it will be another incentive for players to pick safe DZs as the players getting out will have a ever so slightly harder time of shooting enemies as soon as they get off the chopper but enemies will be perfectly fine shooting at the chopper

there's no stupidity in this suggestion herbiie, the point is that small annoyance. if slight change of effects is considered stupid and unnecessary then would not the same go for almost every change that's been made in PR, all the new models, the new textures the lighting effects, are all these things necessary for a realism mod?

this is the type of change can and should be tested before any real objections be put up. i dont see why you're so strongly against it anyways, it'll take maybe 5 minutes of a dev's time to put it in and maybe 20 seconds to take it out if it doesnt work out.

[Hunt3r]

In order to liek solve this let's put in fastropez!!!

Actually, why are we even talking about this at all? Why bother with this, when you'll be suppressed by the MGs that will inevitably fire on you if you land in a hot LZ?

[LUKE_NUKE_EM]

In my opinion if you haven't been in or around a helicopter, then you don't really have a right to comment on the amount of realism in this topic. I have been in/around helicopters, and the suppression/distraction/dust in your eyes isn't actually that bad, nothing a trained soldier should have a problem with. Soldiers would be wearing goggles anyway.

[Cpl. Mallard]

IMHO, I don't believe its very realistic anyway. Have you ever been near a chopper whilst the rotors are spooled up?

I've had experience in and around two helicopters in my life, theres a USCG base near my home, obviously because I live in Savannah, GA, one of the biggest ports on the East Coast.

HH-3F PelicanSikorsky S-61R - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

HH-65 DolphinHH-65 Dolphin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Obviously, the rotor sounds make a whomping sound that pounds your ears, its not completely deafening but you have to scream to hear. Other than that it doesn't affect your sight whatsoever, and if you are used to noise and trained for this sort of thing than your completely fine.

Theres nothing wrong with troops getting away from helicopters as fast as they do ingame.
Have you ever seen a tail rotor moving closeup? If you have you would know how fast soldiers want to GET THE HELL AWAY FROM THAT THING!

[Herbiie]

if you think about it it will be another incentive for players to pick safe DZs

You already have to be very Picky about LZs - more picky than you do IRL.

In PR, if you come under fire as you land, usually the Heli is shot down and the squad killed - in real life if you do the operation will probably still be a success.

Fyi I am reading into other people's posts - I still think it's stupid.

Oh no! Grass! Very painful when it hits you.... Oh no! Dust! I'm going to have to have a shower when I get back to base! How terrible!

It may obscure your vision - but get this: Soldiers Train. Soldiers know where they are going. Soldiers know what they are doing. Soldiers do this ALL the time. Soldiers can get off a Heli and get to their position with no trouble - in fact, the only time there may be a slight bit of trouble is on the desert, with this suggestion, then there could be a brown out for the Soldiers on the ground (....) ON GRASS - where's there's NO obstruction, believe me I've ridden in a Chinook and run off the back ramp a couple of times, the only thing that annoyed me slightly was the hot exhaust, but even then I still just ran to my position and threw myself down. OR what about on concrete? How much dust/small pebbles do you think there would be flying around on Muttrah? Virtually none.

Stupid suggestion by people who only know what happens via films.

[terenz]

Easy now Mr soldier, no need to offend people, you would think you had learned something about common respect and communication.

[terenz]

As mentioned before, apparently its a resuggestion, so unless you want a fairly pointless discussion that could easily just be done in general discussion, lock it up

[Cpl. Mallard]

Easy now Mr soldier, no need to offend people, you would think you had learned something about common respect and communication.

I think Santa gave him coal for christmas terenz, he's not very respectful, you'd think someone would mature a bit by age 16, tsk tsk