Commanders Spot Hot Zones (For Helis)

[nk87]

I see all the Heli Pilots going yeah!!! what about the opposition, who rely on placing a member on these aa's all round. Its not the most exciting job. All those mountains to deploy Sniper to shoot the AA gunners? The power of the BLUFOR's attack is on most maps strong as anything, with a well used Cobra, LAV's, Attack Huey, M16's, Scoped LMG's, Fast Heli deployment what more do you want?

I disagree with the suggested idea, it will deffer the idea of making AA a valued item to the MEC/PLA/INSUR/TALIB.

And Give the BLURFOR another powerful weapon

Believe me for one, this is for all the clueless pilots out there... Last night on muttrah I got shot down in a LB, asked commander to mark the area from where the AA came from, and still, 3 hueys fly right in there and get shot down. Regardless - If theese guys saw a big red circle, they would of known it was a bad place to fly into.

[killonsight95]

agree with above post ^
but its often not Sl's fault that they fly there often poeple don't listen to SL's in flying squads, once i was in an LB squad on muttrah the SL of one squad destroyed two heli's by touhcing them on takeoff with his heli and putting the blame on the other person including me when he crashed inot me on the carrier saying that i just faceplanted the carrier often SL's in squads don'r relay infop to squad member in air asset squads and this is annoying like.
anyway a big red thing would be good warning

[mat552]

Regardless - If theese guys saw a big red circle, they would of known it was a bad place to fly into.

...and gleefully landed directly in the middle of the circle.

Automarking won't solve or help anything, the system works if you coordinate and pay attention.

[nk87]

...and gleefully landed directly in the middle of the circle.

Automarking won't solve or help anything, the system works if you coordinate and pay attention.

Thats idioty, ofcourse it wont solve everything, some people are too stupid to realize, but atleast this will give them a chance of seeing whats going on, taking they dont listen to whats going on. You for one should know that most newcomers arent really paying attention, it's vanilla all over.

Edit; What do you think is bad about this, that would change the coordination and attention span? I can tell you already, absolutely nothing. Its the same, just with handicap handles.

[Herbiie]

I've found another problem - Hand held AA move around, so the circle will be useless & will just annoy people who don't need to know.

What's bad about this is that it's automated - that means there's even less of a reason to have or be a CO.

[nk87]

Ive been thinking about that one aswell, and I came to a conclusion that even tho perhaps automated, fades away after 30sec/1min? So that its not permanent, like the stuff the commander puts on map, but just a temporary "hot zone". And then the commander can use this info to put up the real markers. And if its handheld AA, he will know pretty fast from either UAV or brains

[Truism]

I disagree with the bulk of the discourse in this thread. If the ability to spot AA on the map isn't good enough, and verbal indications aren't either, I cannot for the life of me see how a seperate indicator to show that AA is operating in an area is going to help clueless pilots. The red circle is no less ambiguous than the AA symbol anyway in that neither are likely to be placed by a person with any solid knowledge of where the AA is and how far it can reach.

[Tim270]

Would it be possible for this only to show on the minimap for choppers?

[mangeface]

I think the idea is genius, plus you did a great job implementing a design on the map.

But then eventually, everyone will want the same thing for tanks and helicopters, so they'll know to avoid those areas. Then before you know it, the whole map is going to be red.

[killonsight95]

I think the idea is genius, plus you did a great job implementing a design on the map.

But then eventually, everyone will want the same thing for tanks and helicopters, so they'll know to avoid those areas. Then before you know it, the whole map is going to be red.

how about the red circle dissappear after 5 mins so you can only place 4 or is it 5? on the map at any time

[Garmax]

dude awesome idea!

[Sinn_Ah_Taggh]

I can see both the pros and the cons of this idea.

Pros are that it would become easier to spot the hot zones due to the lack of teamwork/communication (although that is the very nature this mod was founded on) and that it would give a visiual marker for the flyboys to navigate after (in a perfect world).

The cons would be that communication and teamwork between squads (when CO is not pressent) would decrease and become obsolete in a way.
As stated manny times before; Players are hardcoded and we do not wish to make a game based on idiots,that will produce a "idiot-game".

However,there could be a way to actually implement this IF it is possible given the engine limitations.
If only the CO can plase this marker and its not atoumated at all, it could work.
Much as the marker system allready in-game would work,this sircle would disapear after a given amount of time, and the appearance of the marker itself is a cosmetic issue!
The sircle doesnt need to represent the actuall size of the AA range,but only the fact that it is an AA within the sircle paramaters,much like the icon for area/JDAM attack.

Arguing that there already is a symbol for the AA is valid,but that symbol is much less vissible than this suggestion and given the stress of flying when in combat it is easy to miss something like that on the fly.
And if the map is already clutterd with symbols then the task of making a quick look on the map even harder when on the move.

I also like the thought of only heli/jets beeing able to see these symbols as there should be no need for infantry to know the aproximent range of an AA.
I am also very shure of when pilots IRL are briefed before flight they have maps containing areas of importance such as possible AA implasements or other types of threats that need to be taken in to account when on the fly,and i also belive that these maps are easely avaliable when piloting their aircraft.

I dont have anny sources on this so please dont hate me for it

[Dev1200]

This would be veryhelpful so, PLease.

[alberto_di_gio]

I've found another problem - Hand held AA move around, so the circle will be useless & will just annoy people who don't need to know.

What's bad about this is that it's automated - that means there's even less of a reason to have or be a CO.

Totally opposite I think. It will be an guide/warning for pilots, ground squads and also commander to coordiante the team. Moving AAs will courage CO to track its trace and re-coordinate the hot zone. It will be an another useful asset for COs and rather than taking it will give people another reason to apply for commander. (which I guess needed because there are no much commanders around)

[mangeface]

how about the red circle dissappear after 5 mins so you can only place 4 or is it 5? on the map at any time

5 minutes is still quite a bit of time. If they were up for 1, 2 minutes max and have the ability to lay 1 at a time, with equal time to reload and place another then yeah, it wouldn't be a bad idea. But like I said earlier, everyone will want it for armor and aircraft.

[Truism]

This is a level of unnecessary redundancy. There is already a map symbol for this - the AA symbol. If there is an AA symbol, you can surmise that there is a red circle.

PR is not a mod for creating tools to help people who won't help themselves. Read the quotes on the banner at the top of the page "... ruthelessly demanding..." and "... harsher..." are the bits that always stuck out to me as the things that made PR so good, and unique.

If this redundant map marker is added, I vote a Care Bear shaped map marker or Teddy Bear deployable be added. It may be deployed by Commanders or Pilots who have been downed by AA to make them feel better about it.

[McBumLuv]

I find it funny that people think this'll be 'yet another game mechanic exploited by those damned heli pilots'

Most Helicopter squads are actually already on top of this, and reports of where they've been locked onto and engaged are not going to help a pilot's job in any way. The real problem is that most AA sites are spotted by infantry and not reported (usually because of a game wide commander deficiency), and so pilots can't properly predict battlefield trends with inconsistant danger areas.

Unfortunately all that it comes down to is that all air support relies on an extremely tight web of communications between all infantry SLs and to a single air controller (usually a designated FAC, you don't know how much they are a god send). Without extrenal SL VoiP programs (such as TS, Vent, or mumble), then coordinating goes out the window most of the time and air squads loose their only asset, team coordination and help. As for antiair duties, they at least don't need any teamwide coordination at all in order to use. It's extremely easy to set up a 2 or 3 man squad and go helicopter hunting with a MANPAD if you know when and how to engage, or to just set up a firebase anywhere and get instant AA up.

On public games and maps like Muttrah (as depicted in the OP's pic), you have many small AA groups everywhere that don't ever become known to the pilots until they're engaged from them because communication is at very reduced efficiency and it's not a requirement to use AA. Even with mumble, it's bugged so that pilots get Force centered and hear absolutely everyone on the server at the same time when they reach a certain distance along the z-plane.

In other words, peripherals like this are already in place (by lieu of commander markers), it's just that the communication needed to get it coordinated is missing from 99% of PR games and thus AA will almost always reign supreme due to their lack of the same communication requirements to operate at full efficiency. Oddly enough, it also translates into all the infantry blaming the individual pilots 99% of the time

You can't mod players, you can only see an adaptation in their strategies based on the most efficient way to do anything ingame. My personal convictions are just that gameplay should be the end product of modeling realism, not the otherway around.

[Hunt3r]

We need it to be easier to perform SEAD or evasion of SHORAD?

[alberto_di_gio]

Can't believe how people think that this could be an new powerful weapon for BLURFOR or a new feature to be exploited.

This is only a suggestion of an addition commander's spot ability which can help coordination among pilots and squads.

• First of all its not smthng automated. You still need commander which have to search and scan the area and spot the AA.( So it is a + to be a CO)
• Marking already pinpoints everything on map. So this circle won't expose the AAs more than a normal spot.
• It'll be fixed as the rest of the markers. Commanders should track and trace AAs to update the hot zone. So it can also be an disadvantage for the team if AA moves and CO do not update the zone. So another reason for opposite team to be more tactical and relocate their AAs frequently.
• There are lots of people in game who cant, don't like or hate talking/communicating. This can push especially pilots to communicate with commander.
• It will help pilots to navigate easily on. (For people who may say why we should make it easy; I don't think in a battle heli pilots are flying without a co-pilot or commander navigation) It will be much more easy to check the circle on the map with a quick map glimpse while everyone shouts/writes for different locations for you to fly.

I think rather than killing it will support the team-play and tactics.

[Sgt.Heine]

i like that idea,especialy now that i will start flying.