Unbalanced weapons

[=XE=Grimm]

has anyone here ever fired a SAW or a C9 in real life? if so, you would know about the accuracy in it at 400-500m only thing the game doesnt have is wind to adjust your fire... i've been able to land an entire box of ammo on a target from 300m, maybe the marksman just needs to be smarter and not get spotted by the gunners?

I am aware of SAW capabilities and they are decently represented in PR. My post, despite how it reads, is not against that weapon. It's simply the lack the same capabilities for other kits.

Getting killed by a SAW gunner because he saw me is my mistake. Getting spotted by that same gunner after my first round didn't land where I aimed it is not. Being the first one to spot him and take a shoot at him only to miss him because of ridiculous deviation is the problem within the game.

[009783232]

The current AR is not overpowered. It has realistic capabilities - if a squad is caught unawares by an MG then it's perfectly reasonable that they will all get mown down.

All I want is for the sights to be useable when undeployed - these are modern infantry LMGs, they can be used without resting the bipod on something.

Stu.

The main problem at the moment is with people abusing the deployed stance in ways that it wasn't intended for.

For example, people going from prone ----> Stand with decent deviation or from prone ---->crouch ----> stand to be able to fire out of cover immediately with perfect deviation.

When an MG doesn't do this, it is exposed while firing from everyone it isn't firing at.

[Jigsaw]

My take on this is that you all need to wait until 0.9 where hopefully you will find your grievances addressed. As Motherdear has stated there are a massive number of tweaks coming for all weapons, meaning discussion on the current state of play is almost pointless.

Play 0.9 for a couple of weeks and then we can talk.

[=XE=Grimm]

My take on this is that you all need to wait until 0.9 where hopefully you will find your grievances addressed. As Motherdear has stated there are a massive number of tweaks coming for all weapons, meaning discussion on the current state of play is almost pointless.

Play 0.9 for a couple of weeks and then we can talk.

Just killing time until 0.9 comes out, m8.

[Truism]

of course there has great guys, how can shoot alot alot of magazines, but speaking about regular soldirs, that is what they up to, 7 shoots acuracy, after 10 shoot it go complety unacuracy.

From prone, yes.

From anything else, no.

From prone supported, you can pretty much just spray and get a 2m group at most at 100m if you're correctly holding the weapon.

[Artnez]

Fungwu, Google: I'm confused, why is this a big deal?

There are certain weapons that you hide from. One of those are light machine guns. A rifleman should be no match for an LMG.

You say that the LMG doesn't have to wait as long for the accuracy to stabilize because they have so many bullets -- drp drp hrp -- the whole advantage of LMGs in real life is that exact mechanic. They can put a lot of bullets down range, not worrying too much about accuracy.

An entrenched rifleman will easily take down an LMG that's on the move, unless the range is medium-long. In those cases, you need fire superiority.

[Herbiie]

In those cases, you need fire superiority.

Still don't work, a SAW gunner will beat riflemen at any range even if the riflemen outnumber the SAW gunner.

Anywho, might as well wait till 0.9

[Artnez]

Still don't work, a SAW gunner will beat riflemen at any range even if the riflemen outnumber the SAW gunner.

Anywho, might as well wait till 0.9

If 4 riflemen are 2 feet away from each other, of course not. If the riflemen are maintaining a 10+ meter spread, they will defeat the LMG -- either by fire superiority or flanking maneuvers.

Please don't ask gameplay to substitute your (or your squads) lack of tactical ability.

[Truism]

Fungwu, Google: I'm confused, why is this a big deal?

There are certain weapons that you hide from. One of those are light machine guns. A rifleman should be no match for an LMG.

You say that the LMG doesn't have to wait as long for the accuracy to stabilize because they have so many bullets -- drp drp hrp -- the whole advantage of LMGs in real life is that exact mechanic. They can put a lot of bullets down range, not worrying too much about accuracy.

An entrenched rifleman will easily take down an LMG that's on the move, unless the range is medium-long. In those cases, you need fire superiority.

If 4 riflemen are 2 feet away from each other, of course not. If the riflemen are maintaining a 10+ meter spread, they will defeat the LMG -- either by fire superiority or flanking maneuvers.

Please don't ask gameplay to substitute your (or your squads) lack of tactical ability.

Herp derp derp. We are well aware of the tactical considerations for fighting against LMGs. A fair proportion of this forum has military experience. Spacing is not the problem with a SAW ripping up 4 riflemen in cover, the fact that rifles cannot generate accurate fire is.

No one has an issue with how the SAW is modeled, besides the jack-in the box thing which is hardcoded.

What everyone has an issue with is the musket-like rifles that PR players kick around with. Children fire more accurately than these things do. Pistols in real life are nearly as accurate as these rifles. The deviation code only feels intuitive and right for about 50 meters between 25-75, any shorter and you're in the hell-hole that is PR CQB, any further and your musket can't be relied upon to consistantly hit.

[google]

If 4 riflemen are 2 feet away from each other, of course not. If the riflemen are maintaining a 10+ meter spread, they will defeat the LMG -- either by fire superiority or flanking maneuvers.

See, this is the problem. What you have said is completely untrue. Even if these 4 rifleman have the drop on the LMG, he can turn around prone dive and simply wipe everyone because rifle deviation is just so ridiculously innacurate. Thus my point about LMGs not having to worry about accuracy while rifleman do. This, combined with the fact the LMG gunners can abuse the engine through Jack-in-the-box and that they can use undeployed mode in unrealistic situations just breaks firefights.

[Herbiie]

Please don't ask gameplay to substitute your (or your squads) lack of tactical ability.

....

The Spacing hardly matters when he can drop you in 2 or 3 shots! By the time you've gotten into cover and started to lay down accurate suppressing fire, even with 10m+ spacings you'll all of been slaughtered.

[bosco_]

This thread repeats itsself and descends into the usual complaints, feel free to re-open a new one covering the topic once 0.9 is out and you still feel that there is an issue at hand.