Make .50 cals WAYYY less effective. seriously.

[[=TC=]nuetron]

Today in Yamalia my helo got shot down in only a few bursts by a .50 cal(aggrivating). Then about an hour ago on Asad, 4 of my squad's APC( ARMORED-Personal Carriers) got blown up because the Technical's .50cal was so powerful.

For the love of realism, tone down the .50 cal's effectivness!

[Rhino]

50cal is one of the biggest threats to helicopters. A single well placed 50cal bullet can take out the engine of a helicopter with ease.

As for your I take it BRDM-2 getting taken out by 50cal fire, for a start its a "Combat Reconnaissance/Patrol Vehicle", not an APC and it has pretty damn thin armour, reports of 7.62 GPMG rounds being able to penetrating it let alone 50cal.

[[=TC=]nuetron]

You mean when i prove that a .50 cal cannot somehow make an armored vehicle explode out of nowhere after a burst of less than 10 seconds?

Listen, it's not like the 50 was at my rear hatch(which though more vulnerable, still wouldnt be realistic) it was fired RIGHT at my front armor plate- supposidly and literally(ingame and real life) the most armored, hardest to get through, toughest part of the entire APC.

And a 50 gets throught it. There's something wrong...

*Edit* my vehicle was the M113 APC on Asad Khal, and my team lost 5 of them in what game i was there for

[wookimonsta]

does the armor on that vehicle stop .50 cal bullets?
if not then yes, the vehicle should be destructable by a .50 cal

[Spartan0189]

Last time I checked, you CAN destroy armor with a .50, just after prolonged fire.. So either you are taking a lot of damage from travel and then getting ambushed by a .50 which in turn kills you, or ambushed by multiple HMGs.

[killonsight95]

the armour in made of 5083 Aluminum and is 1.5 inches thick or about 3.8 cm
source:
APC M113

i'm pretty sure 50.cal bullets can penitrate 3.8 cm of 5083 aluminum armour

but i'm also sure that most helicopters use the same armour

[Jaymz]

12.7mm is a huge threat to helicopters irl.

Like the BTR-60, the M113's protection is limited to small arms.

Unfortunately, as the welded armored plating used on the M113 has a maximum thickness of 35mm, it can only serve as protection against shell splinters and small calibre projectiles.

source : Army Guide - M113, Tracked armoured personnel carrier

[anglomanii]

neutron did you ever consider the blokes driving the APC's might have been being a little stupid, a .50cal is a insanely powerful piece of kit, ask any of the blokes on this forum that have actually shot them.
any HMG can damage light armour and thats what a gavin is. remember this is a game and the balance of a .50 has as far as i know been tested for a hell of a long time.

[Bob_Marley]

nuetron;1281317']You mean when i prove that a .50 cal cannot somehow make an armored vehicle explode out of nowhere after a burst of less than 10 seconds?

Say it with me now - engine limitations.

Older APCs (such as the M113 and BTR-60) are not really designed for direct combat but rather to protect troops from artillery and air attack (or rather, from near miss artillery and air attack, because if they suffer a direct hit, they're boned) as they are brought up to the line. They can be rendered ineffective by riddling them with bullets, but unfortuneately this cannot be entirely realistically represented ingame - so they blow up. If it helps you can imagine that your and your friends all got killed when those 12.7mm rounds ripped through the crew compartment and shredded your soft, squishy bodies.

[wookimonsta]

If it helps you can imagine that your and your friends all got killed when those 12.7mm rounds ripped through the crew compartment and shredded your soft, squishy bodies.

That gives me a warm fuzzy feeling

[General Fuct]

.50 cal cartridge can break through 1 Inch of steel with ease - It states it in the M2's manual.

Only touch you could do to it I think is make is less accurate with sustained fire. I've watched one go full auto and it goes all over the place the longer it sustains firerate.

[HAAN4]

MEN, .50 is a really good weopow, and Yamalia is close by the heavem of .50, since it is autmost only plains and plains dificult Infantry warfare, (of course it will turn easy to flak a .50), and yeah .50 is bad *** agaist infantry.

[AquaticPenguin]

.50 cal cartridge can break through 1 Inch of steel with ease - It states it in the M2's manual.

Only touch you could do to it I think is make is less accurate with sustained fire. I've watched one go full auto and it goes all over the place the longer it sustains firerate.

I quite like this idea, do the same thing to the .50s as was done to the LMGs - Don't make them less accurate, but make them shake some more. Not sure on the realism of it, but it might stop some players from charging up to the front and then trying to snipe people 50m away with the .50.

[Skull]

destroying helos is absolutly realistic and okay for balance and realism. destroying apcs (i didnt check which model is meant) is a bit hard though. especially when the armor is angular (is that the right word?) the bullets should just bounce off and dont do any damage.

[Drunkenup]

destroying helos is absolutly realistic and okay for balance and realism. destroying apcs (i didnt check which model is meant) is a bit hard though. especially when the armor is angular (is that the right word?) the bullets should just bounce off and dont do any damage.

Yes, but he was talking about the .50 Caliber HMG's against the M113, which in comparison is a very light APC. And if you're getting owned in the BRDM-2 as well, the thickest armor is wields 11mm of Steel. A .50 goes straight through those kind of materials and thinness. Most vehicles can sustain these sort of calibers now, the Armored-up Humvee is even designed to protect those sort of calibers, and the same with most personnel carriers. The M113 and BRDM-2 are outdated vehicles in a game beyond its time.

[Mongolian_dude]

Actually, I would say its arguable that 12.7 doesn't do enough damage to allot of unarmoured vehicles. Where it usually takes some prolonged, sustained fire, in actuality a few rounds to anything important would cause a mobility kill.
Not to mention, as Bob said, those within would likely be very dead before the vehicle is fully disbled.


...mongol...

[DankE_SPB]

but there are also parts, where it will do nothing and just go through, so, since we cant have realistic mobility kill/damage values depending on material/importance of area, the system where it lasts longer but blows up in the end seems to be the only way

[Outlawz7]

but there are also parts, where it will do nothing and just go through, so, since we cant have realistic mobility kill/damage values depending on material/importance of area, the system where it lasts longer but blows up in the end seems to be the only way

We can, but need someone to reexport all aircraft with different materials on different parts (like armor), problem is that we can only do this for the PR assets (Chinook, Huey, Apache, Littlebird) but not for BF2 (Mi-17, H8, Blackhawk, Z10, Havok, Cobra, Z11, Eurocopter), IIRC.

[ludwag]

"The scissor is way overpowered, the stone is fine" - Paper