Missile Performance should be revised.

Hunt3r · Post by **Hunt3r** » 2010-03-21 07:20

To be honest, I've never really seen any real discussion about this for PR, but I think that something should be said about it.

Quite simply put, missiles in PR are just TOO fast. If you look at a game like Lock On, in general, the missile is fired, and it can take enough time for the missile to hit you that you can outrun it, locate the firing site, and, if equipped, do a SEAD run.

Same with the TOW. I realize that it's realistic to have a very fast flying missile, but in PR, it simply does not fit with the scale of the game, with the view distance of 1 km, it should take a good 10 seconds to have to go past the view distance. In reality, it's very possible that you can spot the person firing the TOW and kill him with a tank shell before the TOW hits.

Bugger, it's late and I'm not paying attention. Can a mod move this to suggestions?

Wicca · Post by **Wicca** » 2010-03-21 07:22

Have you fired a real TOW or any other Anti tank missile of any sorts?

Hunt3r · Post by **Hunt3r** » 2010-03-21 07:23

Wicca wrote:Have you fired a real TOW or any other Anti tank missile of any sorts?

No, but it takes 24-25 seconds to reach maximum range. The TOW is a SLOW missile, and in PR it really feels faster then it should.

Post by **Rhino** » 2010-03-21 08:06

Missiles seem faster ingame than what they are because of the limited view distance...

dtacs · Post by **dtacs** » 2010-03-21 08:26

Slow missile?

Nah.

Killer-Ape · Post by **Killer-Ape** » 2010-03-21 08:39

Hunt3r wrote:No, but it takes 24-25 seconds to reach maximum range. The TOW is a SLOW missile, and in PR it really feels faster then it should.

20 seconds actually, giving an average speed of 187.5 m/s.
Source PDF See under pdf page 19.

Max speed is about 278 -300m/s
Source 1
Source 2 wiki

The speed is right considering the short view distance in project reality.

Titan · Post by **Titan** » 2010-03-21 14:10

I Agree

... to a certain extent. Speed is maybe ok, in game its around 285 m/s atm (according to Killer-Apes dates it is nearly at max speed) thus could be lowered a litttlebit (especially considering shorter engagemend ranges in this Game). But the reason why the inGame TOW outperformes the RL one is imho, because of the strait flight path of the missile

I would like to see this "tottering" of the missile

seeing how the TOW missed at the end of the video.

i dont know if this would be possible to code (maybe somehow like the topdown missiles of CA are working), but this would reduce the effectiveness agains infantry.

dtacs · Post by **dtacs** » 2010-03-21 14:15

You mean the erratic sort of behavior from the missile, Titan? Don't think that can be coded in unfortunately.

Alex6714 · Post by **Alex6714** » 2010-03-21 14:23

[R-DEV]Rhino wrote:Missiles seem faster ingame than what they are because of the limited view distance...

I think thats what he means, that due to very low view distance, speed should also be lower.

I don´t know, i like the speed of these things, but after playing alot of BC2 I can also see how a slower projectiles are more inmersive, for me at least. Either a view distance of 2500m or a little bit proportional speeds I think its best.

Sgt. Mahi · Post by **Sgt. Mahi** » 2010-03-21 14:24

Titan wrote: ...
i dont know if this would be possible to code (maybe somehow like the topdown missiles of CA are working), but this would reduce the effectiveness agains infantry.

Not many people fires a TOW at a moving target (at high speed) in PR anyway. In my experience people shoot at something when they know they don't have adjust the missile's direction.

Drunkenup · Post by **Drunkenup** » 2010-03-21 14:42

ALL guided missiles should be slowed down in one way or another. SAMs and air to air missiles should be changed awfully too. In what way I mean is how much they can turn and bank, their speed, etc. They should be nerfed to better air to air combat, and increase the use of a gun. They should be slowed down for one, to 3/4s of their current speed, short range missiles should be able to bank a little less than the planes it chases, long range missiles the same as well.

Spinkyone · Post by **Spinkyone** » 2010-03-21 15:39

Pretty realistic given that you're only allowed one acceleration. Slightly slower in reality due to there being a smaller charge to clear the warhead before the rocket starts on some launchers.

The only issue I have with missiles in PR is that some have a damage drop off with range and this is highly unrealistic. Explosive / charge effect is far, far greater than initial kinetic effects; this is not some WW2 recoilless rifle type thing with a solid projectile. The shaped charge cone formed travels in the hypersonic region and is in the region of 10+ times that of the initial missile velocity, damage drop off due to range is none existent in reality.

Hunt3r · Post by **Hunt3r** » 2010-03-21 19:47

Sgt. Mahi wrote:Not many people fires a TOW at a moving target (at high speed) in PR anyway. In my experience people shoot at something when they know they don't have adjust the missile's direction.

..You don't know how many people use the TOW to shoot down helicopters.

Post by **Rudd** » 2010-03-21 19:52

Alex6714 wrote:I think thats what he means, that due to very low view distance, speed should also be lower.

I don´t know, i like the speed of these things, but after playing alot of BC2 I can also see how a slower projectiles are more inmersive, for me at least. Either a view distance of 2500m or a little bit proportional speeds I think its best.

the speed is fine but I do think the missles should be changed a bit, I would suggest a delay click would balance it nicely, so you'd have to hold down click for 1.5/2 seconds before the weapon actually fires

Hunt3r · Post by **Hunt3r** » 2010-03-21 20:03

[R-CON]Rudd wrote:the speed is fine but I do think the missles should be changed a bit, I would suggest a delay click would balance it nicely, so you'd have to hold down click for 1.5/2 seconds before the weapon actually fires

It's still a problem when you are shooting down helos that are, in theory, supposed to be flying at 120 knots. With a TOW. I regularly use the TOW as my favorite AA weapon. No lock, no alarm.

Mind you, I'm not in favor of nerfing missile's turning and tracking capabilities, but I think that the speed of them should be revised.

Cp · Post by Cp » 2010-03-21 20:28

Hunt3r wrote:Mind you, I'm not in favor of nerfing missile's turning and tracking capabilities, but I think that the speed of them should be revised.

Then you wouldn't mind reducing the hellfire's speed to reflect its real life time to max range?

Hunt3r · Post by **Hunt3r** » 2010-03-21 20:32

Cp wrote:Then you wouldn't mind reducing the hellfire's speed to reflect its real life time to max range?

Sure.

I think that scaling should be done for missiles, because right now it's a bit strange to have it go at real-life speeds, with only 1 km for it to cover to max range.

Missile Performance should be revised.

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