HAT's used for AA

[Bluedrake42]

Is this realistic? cause frankly I'm getting pretty ridiculously annoyed with how often our big warbirds are getting shot down by tows and hats off the hip!!!

[Ford_Jam]

Don't give the ground troops the opportunity to be able to destroy you.

I've destroyed air assets a few times and I've only been able to because the Attack Helicopter in questions gave me a chance by just hovering in the air.

[gazzthompson]

Of course its not overly realistic, but to be honest what can we do about it? you give players explosives and they will fire them at any target possible, even if it wasn't designed to hit that specific target .

[Psyrus]

Hah... I would love to see some fraps footage of these shots. The only times I ever see helicopters get shot down by hand held AT is when:
- They're coming in to land slowly (very vulnerable)
- They're up there in the sky hovering like a genius.

The TOW's fast flight speed allows them to also reliably shoot helicopters that are flying directly towards or directly away from the TOW emplacement at no diagonal angle.

[Rudd]

Of course its not overly realistic, but to be honest what can we do about it? you give players explosives and they will fire them at any target possible, even if it wasn't designed to hit that specific target .

could always assign a material to the choppers that took minimal damage from HATs

but that would be a bit wierd.

Just fly fast when possible, slow only when landing, pick your LZs.

When flying CAS, don't hover slow, Go FAST! you might not hit your target, but you won't get pwned.

[Sirex[SWE][MoW]]

Yes it is realistic, in the since if you were to be deployed whit 3 infantry squad, 2 tanks, 4 IFV, no anti-aircraft vehicle, one commander with battalion leading equipment and you only have infantry based anti-aircraft weapons available to you if you don't entranche in one area and deploy stationary AA-weapons, then it would be realistic to try to kill aircraft with HAT.

You see what i am getting at? In real life you would have one entire anti-aircraft battalion covering you ***. Also it is realistic to kill atleast choppers with LAT, HAT is more preserved to kill tanks but a LAt you can afforc to "waste" on a chopper.

[Jaymz]

I'm assuming your talking primarily about Attack Helicopters here.

It's a bit of a pickle, because the problem is that, in many cases, Attack Helicopters have to stay slow/still to allow for accurate fire which makes them H-AT bait. IRL, they don't do this at all because they all have extremely advanced stabilisation systems that allow them to be on the move when engaging with minimal accuracy loss. We can't portray that in PR though.....

[Sirex[SWE][MoW]]

I'm assuming your talking primarily about Attack Helicopters here.

It's a bit of a pickle, because the problem is that, in many cases, Attack Helicopters have to stay slow/still to allow for accurate fire which makes them H-AT bait. IRL, they don't do this at all because they all have extremely advanced stabilisation systems that allow them to be on the move when engaging with minimal accuracy loss. We can't portray that in PR though.....

Hmm what i know the minimod Combind arms simulated this with tanks with giving lock on ability to it? Couldn't similar solution for autocannons work, if you made it an ability that the player could shift on and off?

Or is combined arms tabu here?

[boilerrat]

There really isn't much you can do with the HAT in this situation, this is the pilot's problem.

[Andy[EEF]]

I'm assuming your talking primarily about Attack Helicopters here.

It's a bit of a pickle, because the problem is that, in many cases, Attack Helicopters have to stay slow/still to allow for accurate fire which makes them H-AT bait. IRL, they don't do this at all because they all have extremely advanced stabilisation systems that allow them to be on the move when engaging with minimal accuracy loss. We can't portray that in PR though.....

You're right in the sense that there is no way of implementing FCS, but it is possible to hit targets whilst moving, the gunner just has to know how to do it, and the pilot needs to be flying at a constant speed and level flight. Yes you can still be shot by HATs since you're flying in straight lines, but its a lot harder than hovering to hit you.

[Imchicken1]

I've taken out a Lynx with an RPG once. It was going slowly and right over me so yeah. Easy target

If you've got it, use it. If you have an easy target, of course you're gonna shoot it

[Rudd]

I've taken out a Lynx with an RPG once. It was going slowly and right over me so yeah. Easy target

RPG is a bit different mate its not a guided missle, so fair dos

[thedare]

anybody ever tried taking out a little bird with a grenadier? only ever managed to do it once but it was pretty funny.

if you dont want to be shot by a hat then dont stay in 1 place too long and dont go where you know there are hats....simples

[Stoic Sentinel]

I've taken out a Lynx with an RPG once. It was going slowly and right over me so yeah. Easy target

If you've got it, use it. If you have an easy target, of course you're gonna shoot it

I've had one of my squad-mates shoot down a moving Littlebird, it was moving fairly fast, I might add. It was absolutely awesome, he won the game for the insurgents

[blaat123]

Hah... I would love to see some fraps footage of these shots. The only times I ever see helicopters get shot down by hand held AT is when:
- They're coming in to land slowly (very vulnerable)
- They're up there in the sky hovering like a genius.

The TOW's fast flight speed allows them to also reliably shoot helicopters that are flying directly towards or directly away from the TOW emplacement at no diagonal angle.

[XFIRE]http://www.xfire.com/video/22bf95/[/XFIRE]
http://www.xfire.com/video/22bf95/
[XFIRE]http://www.xfire.com/video/1afdc5/[/XFIRE]
http://www.xfire.com/video/1afdc5/

[Psyrus]

LAT attack huey hit - Xfire Video
Cobra taken down with LAT - Xfire Video

Um both of those videos confirm exactly what I was saying, so thank you

Oh and congrats on those shots as well, the LAT kit isn't awesome at that sort of stuff and they weren't exactly still, so good shot for both!

Here's a video for you:


Fall.au & Tempest... pretty much the only attack chopper pair that I implicitly trust, as I've seen them follow the proper operating proc over and over again, rather than your usual 'hover and get shot down' tactics employed by 99% of attack choppers.

Notice throughout the video the pilot pops flares, provides the gunner a stable platform to shoot from until they have obliterated the target then takes at least a 45 degree turn and jinks almost all the way back. Even when they do have to stop to hover & take out a target, look especially that as soon as the target they've been called in for is taken care of, the pilot banks quickly while popping flares and they are out of there. Their total time hovering is generally under 35 seconds, which increases their survivability tremendously. You'll also see that each attack run has an attack or move marker placed, which means they have been called in and are executing a specific target, not just sitting up there in the sky like nufties 'looking' for targets. Guess what: While you're looking for targets, they're looking at you too.

If you'd like to point out some parts where you'd have been able to whip out that HAT and kill their chopper, I'm happy to listen (not just you blaat, anyone complaining about getting HATed in choppers)

[Uthric]

if some one would like why dont we take a look at VBF2 and the way the bomber jets have a 2nd seat auto lock on missile, could you not apply that to the 2nd seat gunner on the attack choppers. you no longer have to hover and attack helos now work like real ones mostly

[Total_Overkill]

Well... RPG's have been used as craptacular AA weapons... the HATs just a big, beefy, guided RPG, being shot at a bigger, heavily armed helo, that has enough muntions to wipe out an entire servers worth of armor columns.

I'd say its fair and balanced!

[blaat123]

If you'd like to point out some parts where you'd have been able to whip out that HAT and kill their chopper, I'm happy to listen (not just you blaat, anyone complaining about getting HATed in choppers)

It's easy not to get shot by a HAT only the really stupid pilots get shot by it. but there are some parts in the video where he is hovering at docks and some low flying there it would have been an easy shot for a good HAT or TOW.

Oh and i would not trust these pilots, a well defending team would take em down easily.

[Psyrus]

It's easy not to get shot by a HAT only the really stupid pilots get shot by it. but there are some parts in the video where he is hovering at docks and some low flying there it would have been an easy shot for a good HAT or TOW.

Oh and i would not trust these pilots, a well defending team would take em down easily.

Ah well, their multiple rounds of staying up >45 mins at a time is proof enough for me. Of course you don't have to believe me but with experience trying to FAC for multiple 'regular' combos, these two are shining gems in a world of rather bland and lacklustre quality.