fuse on LAT

[karambaitos]

I think the LAT desperately needs a fuse like the GL grenade and HAT because people have started to use the LAT unrealistically of sorts they use the LAT in CQC at distances less than 20 meters, it's being used to clear a staircase from inside the building, things like that, its basically becoming a noob tube, if because of some miracle this suggestion gets considered let it be only on conventional forces.

P.S. search showed nothing.

gameplay>reality
IRL the SRAW is a fire and forger weapon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVXXpP2DXIk
and it fuse is 17 meters?

for Mr.Imchicken

[Imchicken1]

Is there a source that there's a fuse on an AT4 rocket or a SRAW?

[DevilDog812]

Is there a source that there's a fuse on an AT4 rocket or a SRAW?

not really a fuse, but it says that the minimum training distance for AT4 is 30m
M136 AT4

[Ninja2dan]

The minimum arming range of the M136 is 10m, which is also the minimum engangement distance in combat conditions. Bear in mind that the minimum range is not the "safe" range, as 10m is also well within blast/frag radius. Unless you're firing from behind cover and wearing full BA, you're toast too. The term of 30m minimum for training is because that is just barely outside of the max effective blast/frag radius (25m).

I've only fired a couple of the CS rounds myself, and to be honest I'm still not fully comfortable firing them indoors without a full-sized room behind me to accept the BB. I've fire hundreds of live M136 in my career, and a few times I have been caught in the BB. Trust me if fuckin hurts, enough to probably make you combat non-effective for a few minutes. Think of it being like a huge as flashbang going off in your face.


For CQB/MOUT use, I would never try using such a weapon system in room clearing drills. The weapon is large, heavy, bulky, tricky to move around, slow to bring it up for sight picture, multi-step firing process that take a couple extra seconds, single-shot only, and if someone just up from behind a closet or hiding behind a chair, you're fucked because how you're too close to engage.

In most CQB and MOUT combat where the M136 is used, it's intended to blowing open loopholes for alternate means to enter a building, bypassing barriers and defenses or traps. It also works as a medium-ranged standoff weapon if you're pinned down. You might not get a full kill, but you'll like fuck someone up good or make them fill their diaper real fast. That's just enough time to rush in with a security element or thump in some 40mm.

But I wouldn't be caught dead doing room-clearing drills with an M136 in my hand. Even the M203/320 has limited use indoords, unless you've managed to score some LTL rounds, ferrets, barricade penetrators, CS/CN/OC, etc. And places like DEF-Tech are usually dealing those only with LEO. Military is stuck with a 40mm canister round (rare) or a simply shotgun. Sort of like being point man in 'Nam. My custom Mossberg 500SP with breecher and a rainbow of shells would tear some shit up much better than M67 or 40mm.

The training distance if shown further away because in training they expect you to be firing safely at all times, with almost zero risk of injury. In combat you are willing to take some risk, and are often weapon some good protection yourself. In combat, you're also like to be firing from cover.

[Teek]

I think Dan forgot his illustration

[goguapsy]

Well, since I don't think we can mimic backblast in the game, I think the only solution is making a fuse, since adding a bigger blast radius would turn it into a close-range grenade... Which could deeply annoy insurgents - that would get just a little bit hurt and then bleed to death...

But I haven't seen this happen actually...

[TheOldBreed]

"noob tube" hate that phrase with a passion. i've never witnessed people using an AT4 for room clearance haha

[goguapsy]

"noob tube" hate that phrase with a passion. i've never witnessed people using an AT4 for room clearance haha

Back at I think .5 I saw a guy wasting a HAT to take out one guy (rifleman!) hiding behind cover on EJOD... He got congratulated by the SL.

I'd have personally strangled him if he did that...

[ryan d ale]

I don't like the suggestion.

It is my belief that you are thinking too 'ideally'.

War is certainly not an ideal circumstance...

There's already compromise for using AT weapons at short range - possibly of injuring one's self or squad mates, deployment time, 'settle time' and it's not super effective anyway. It's easier to shoot your rifle.

Plus, I don't know how much you know about military doctrine but don't some militaries believe in projecting MAXIMUM firepower upon the enemy in order to improve their own survivability and then await resupply?

Javellin has been used on Infantry targets in real life but that's besides the poitn because you're mentioning only an arming distance.

Insurgents with RPG.... come on?

They may as well spawn six ft underground if the fuse got implemented.

Edit:- I know....it might make Insurgent RPG kit users stick close to their squad but ....

[Rissien]

"noob tube" hate that phrase with a passion. i've never witnessed people using an AT4 for room clearance haha

Play mw2 and youl see it alot.

[goguapsy]

H[=Rissien;1371204']Play mw2 and youl see it alot.

They use AT4 in it?

Anyhow, DEVs, a light pl0x?

[Dev1200]

I think the LAT desperately needs a fuse like the GL grenade and HAT because people have started to use the LAT unrealistically of sorts they use the LAT in CQC at distances less than 20 meters, it's being used to clear a staircase from inside the building, things like that, its basically becoming a noob tube, if because of some miracle this suggestion gets considered let it be only on conventional forces.

P.S. search showed nothing.

gameplay>reality
IRL the SRAW is a fire and forger weapon
YouTube - SRAW Information Video
and it fuse is 17 meters?

for Mr.Imchicken

Noob toob, I lol'd.

If the LAT has a fuse in real life, sure. Otherwise, sometimes Light AT weapons are used against infantry in buildings, almost like the grenadier. Think insurgents. =P


Also, the video shows the PREDATOR version, which is fire and forget..

[Ninja2dan]

If the LAT has a fuse in real life, sure. Otherwise, sometimes Light AT weapons are used against infantry in buildings, almost like the grenadier.

The M136 AT-4 does have a fuze in the warhead, and so should any other similar types of munitions. As I mentioned above, the minimum arming distance for the M136 is 10m, but that is much closer than you'd ever want to actually engage a target.


I don't understand what you mean by "they are used against infantry in buildings like the grenadier". Do you mean people are using both the AT-4 and M203 while indoors, such as during room clearing?

[karambaitos]

I don't like the suggestion.

It is my belief that you are thinking too 'ideally'.

War is certainly not an ideal circumstance...

There's already compromise for using AT weapons at short range - possibly of injuring one's self or squad mates, deployment time, 'settle time' and it's not super effective anyway. It's easier to shoot your rifle.

Plus, I don't know how much you know about military doctrine but don't some militaries believe in projecting MAXIMUM firepower upon the enemy in order to improve their own survivability and then await resupply?

Javellin has been used on Infantry targets in real life but that's besides the poitn because you're mentioning only an arming distance.

Insurgents with RPG.... come on?

They may as well spawn six ft underground if the fuse got implemented.

Edit:- I know....it might make Insurgent RPG kit users stick close to their squad but ....

you didnt read it carefully
and i have yet to hear someone use a javelin to clear a building while being inside it
also please dont compare WAR with a game depicting it.

[Murkey]

I dunno about this. I've never seen people clearing a room using a LAT.

But what I see ALL THE TIME is people trying to run hostiles over in jeeps, trucks and apcs. It's nice to know that in a pinch you can get the guy in your squad to pull out his LAT and put an end to that sillyness. For that reason alone I'd say keep things the way they are.

[Web_cole]

Yeah, I've never seen anyone use a LAT for CQB, and I can't imagine it being very effective...

[Nitneuc]

Yeah, I've never seen anyone use a LAT for CQB, and I can't imagine it being very effective...

Back in PR 0.5 that was a very popular (noobish) tactic, people spawning as rifleman AT, instantly deploying AT4 and running with it for a "guaranteed" kill, no matter the distance and even if that involved being killed themselves with the explosion (settling time for deviation min was really short).

[anglomanii]

sorry to say but i have used LATS, rpg's and i think it was the Israeli LAT to clear rooms, i used it several times in the larger 'T' shaped buildings firing down the corridors or doing pop ups on stairs. it was 50/50, i did blow myself up a couple of times but also used it effectively too. don't know about HATs but that might be kinda crazy

[ryan d ale]

you didnt read it carefully
and i have yet to hear someone use a javelin to clear a building while being inside it
also please dont compare WAR with a game depicting it.

I didn't actually miss anything.

I read it again to make sure.

Fair point on using Javelin IN a building ...

You also mention don't compare war with a game though

On other notes I agree about people using trucks to run people over. That's something that should be stopped. Yesterday on Asad Khal the IDF were raping our inf with the APC that doesn't have a gun...quite amusing but very pathetic.