[Code] Deployable Mortar (M252 81mm)

[The Iron Dreamer]

just lower the range or put Missile Shield over the Main bases... its simple. The arty will be able to hit anywhere on the map and there wont be any base raping since there will be a missile shield.

[AnimalMother.]

that horn needs to be added to the game!


oh and erm... good work with the mortars

[Zimmer]

Artillery just doesn't seem necessary or even plausible due to the ranges, and I don't believe the devs would tweak real life ranges just so they could have player manned artillery in-game.

Real life ranges is already tweaked on several vehicles, like tanks, helis, jets, different sort of rifles, apc's.

In RL life Apache can engage upto 8km away with the hellfire afaik, now you are really skilled if you hit anything 500-1000meters away.

Every weapon is tweaked for the limits the engine and mod already gives us, I dont see any reasons why artillery should not. Some maps already have missile shields like jabal and I would guess you can use them in the same manner for artillery.

The reality word in Project reality should not be taken litteraly. The name was meant as a working title in the starter but got stuck in the community

[BroCop]

and besides whats the reasoning behind comparing a Mortar to a Howitzer...

[Ninja2dan]

I'd like to clear something up for those suggesting that player-operated artillery units above mortars be in game.

There is a huge difference between mortars and howitzers or rocket artillery. All forms of indirect fire are designed for a specific purpose, each complementing each other on the battlefield. An example of how the different systems might be used is below:

1) Squad-based indirect fire, such as M203 and Mk 19 (or similar).
2) Mortars (60mm, 81mm, 120mm)
3) Light howitzer (105mm)
4) Heavy howitzer (155mm)
5) Rocket (M270, HIMARS, etc)

That doesn't mean those systems are required to be employed in that order, you could easily find an MLRS engaging targets at the ranges normally attacked with mortars, and you might see 105mm being used to hit targets at extended ranges (via RAP). The above list is the suggested order of use.


If you look at the maps in PR, the "Main Base" is not supposed to actually represent an HQ. Even the airfields are not supposed to simulate a real "air field", but instead more like a forward air strip or FARP. Real HQ's are located many miles behind the lines, with layers of defenses in between them and the front.

The map you see in PR is more like a small crop of the overall AO, just the section of the area that is currently under direct conflict. And in real life, regular field artillery units would never deploy in such an area. Howitzer crews have minimal defenses and are not designed or intended to hold their own against a possible attack, they stay to the far rear using their range to the advantage. And on top of that, we "Shoot and Scoot", avoiding possible CB fire when possible. Unless you're in a combat zone where the enemy 110% has no CB capability, you DO NOT stay in the same place after firing.


Now I'll explain how (at least in the USA) artillery teams as mentioned above are composed. The mortar teams are light, and are trained and operate almost identical to regular Infantry. In fact, mortar teams ARE classified as Infantry soldiers, but with mortar gunnery as their specialty. Just like we have Scouts, Rangers, Airborne, etc they operate in the field like nearly any other infantry unit. In the US Army the Infantry carry the 11-series MOS code, 11B for regular Infantryman and 11C being mortar crews.

Field Artillery on the other hand are totally separate in their classification. They are the 13-series. You have the 13B (Cannon Crewmember) which operate the towed and self-propelled (SP) howitzers like the M119, M198, and M109. You also have the 13M who operate missile/rocket systems such as the M270 MLRS. Field artillery soldiers do NOT operate in the field like an infantryman does. They are usually to the rear, rarely if ever seeing hostile fire. Their weapon systems are capable of killing groups of enemies far beyond visual range, and if the enemy has come within attack range then someone really messed up.


In the world of PR, field artillery units (other than mortars) would be well off the range of the maps. We're talking several kilometers behind the edges of the known map, where it's impossible to attack without your own CB (Counter-Battery) systems. The old idea of having towed howitzers on the map from vanilla was retarded, but it was done to allow players the option of destroying the artillery of the opposing team (in a very unrealistic manner no less).

I'm sure there might be ways to simulate CB fire, but with the game engine and gameplay options I just don't think CB fire is going to work well. I have some ideas about it, but unless it can be worked out perfectly, it's useless to add into the game.



The point I'm trying to make here is that player-operated field artillery is simply not realistic, no matter what suggestions are made. Even with a reduced scale on the maps, reduced weapon ranges, etc it's just not realistic to see such artillery systems within the AO covered by the playable map limits.

On the other hand, mortar systems are carried and used by Infantry soldiers in the field and within the ranges that we might see on the PR playable maps. Although it's rare to fire mortars at a target <1km it's still possible in an emergency. By using a decent minimum range on the PR mortars, you can allow dynamic placement with restrictions and not present an "unrealistic" feeling. I think that generally we'll see mortars in PR used at a realistic range.


So if you don't see a Paladin parked at the main base, or a pair of M119's sitting near an airfield, you'll hopefully understand why.

[Dougalachi]

^^sounds good

[Sniperdog]

Main post is updated with new info

[Darkcloak2]

Screw the mortars, give me that car!

Nice work on the mortars though, they make a good consolation prize if I can't have the car.

[Durkie]

Good Job on the mortars its awesome

[DevilDog812]

nice! will you be able to adjust elevation too? will you just have to estimate? id like to be able to call in an airburst on a sniper

[Sniperdog]

nice! will you be able to adjust elevation too? will you just have to estimate? id like to be able to call in an airburst on a sniper

yes, but the spotter will have to estimate the change in elevation.

[Adriaan]

Looks awesome Sniper, can't wait to see this ingame!

[Tarantula]

One idea would be to give the fire-er the ablility to fire 3 rounds in quick succession before needing a long reload, very random - just popped into my head just thought i shoudl write it down. But honestly this work is amazing

[McBumLuv]

One idea would be to give the fire-er the ablility to fire 3 rounds in quick succession before needing a long reload, very random - just popped into my head just thought i shoudl write it down. But honestly this work is amazing

3 sounds a wee bit low, 5 would be cool

But yeah, having a different magazine and clip size as well as ROF would be awesome.

[MCI]

Who cares about the mortar, I want that flying car! LOL, very awesome progress mate!

[mockingbird0901]

Just wondering, what will the reload time be on the mortar?

[MisterCole]

Forget the damn car, I want that Mortar!

Excellent work Sniper! This kind of stuff is exactly why I love playing this mod. I expect these mortars will have a huge and positive impact on the way we play PR, and I can't wait to see them in game. It'll give the Commander a bit more to do, coordinating Squad Leader's requests for mortar fire with the mortar troops, or even using the UAV to spot personally.

It'll also be kind of nice for the Insurgents to have a longer range capability to soften up Anti Insurgent Super FOBs that might not ordinarily be easy to attack by bomb cars. Of course, you might want to consider adding heavier, covered defensive positions to give Anti Insurgent infantry a nice place to hide during a mortar bombardment, like this sort:

YouTube - Defensive Firing Position SANGAR made from HESCO Concertainer

Anyway, keep up the good work guys! And Sniper, if you ever need a guinea pig for target practice, let me know.

[unrealalex]

Wow that looks amazing. Cannot wait for that to be in PR.

[Hulabi]

<snip> Of course, you might want to consider adding heavier, covered defensive positions to give Anti Insurgent infantry a nice place to hide during a mortar bombardment, like this sort:

YouTube - Defensive Firing Position SANGAR made from HESCO Concertainer

<snip>

Thats a great idea! I can see it already a squad manning the FOB and someone yelling "Incoming!!!" People leaving their exposed positions and diving in to cover

[Gore]

how many of these will be deployable at a time? how many per fob? whats the rate of fire?