Adding an SVD pickup kit to caches on Iraqi Insurgent maps.

[dtacs]

Situation:
In current conflicts, the SVD and its cousins (Romanian PSL, Iraqi Al Kadesiah) are feared weapons in Iraq and Afghanistan. The weapon fires the same round as the PKM (7.62x54mmR) and is responsible for hundreds of coalition deaths. The famous sniper in Baghdad, 'Juba', claimed to have shot at 645 soldiers with the Tabuk rifle, which the SVD could fill in for as a 'placeholders' of sorts.

In PR, without having access to the main the only long range combat options for the Insurgents are the PKM, and to a lesser extent, the RPK. The RPG has been significantly nerfed for anti infantry purposes, leaving rifle fire the only option to kill advancing enemy infantry, or kill stragglers in an ambush.

Proposal:
Add an SVD pickup kit on the current known, and unknown, caches in addition to the kits (or replacing) the ones at main. This kit would not re-spawn on the caches, and MAXIMUM one will be available. (Bayonet, SVD undeployed, deployed, stone, binoculars)

Reasons for:

• Gives the Insurgents a means to eliminate enemy infantry/light vehicle crews from afar, without having to wait for them to get closer.
• Presents more of a reason to defend the cache, by stopping the enemy from getting within firing range.
• Mimics the current real life situation (reality), where Coalition troops are killed or wounded daily from sniper fire, often from in secluded and ingenious locations such as car bumpers, or market stalls.
• Presents a more psychological situation in PR, a sniper could be watching you any time, anywhere.
• Even if the kit is lost, there is little chance the BLUFOR would stuff around looking for the kit after a cache destruction when they could request their own marksman kit.
• Who doesn't want to see the new badass awesome SVD model displayed a bit more?

Reasons against:

• Could present the 'leet sniper' mentality: running away from the cache for your own little funtimes.
• Getting into the wrong hands, IE BLUFOR, giving them even MORE killing power than the current situation. (then again...)
• Currently the SVD is a very, VERY accurate and effective weapon. This could make it very very frustrating for the BLUFOR when in a stationary position.

As always, please keep the discussion civil, and yes, I searched. I'll ask mods to delete any non-constructive posts, lets keep it like the sniper removal discussion thread: good.

Further Reading:
Quotes on Baghdad's professional snipers
Baghdad sniper 'Juba' - Reuters
Baghdad sniper 'Juba' - Wikipedia
Dragunov.net

[Psyrus]

Hmm... not sure how to feel about it. My gut feeling says yes, because it would be rather limited (1 per cache and then maybe 1? at main base?). As you said I'm guessing that you'll end up with a fair few people grabbing it then taking a bike and sitting ages away from the cache and not helping, but hey that happens with any kit in any mode so we should kinda ignore the 'idiot player' aspect.

Upon skimming some of your material, it does seem like it would be a somewhat realistic threat that the blufor would be dealing with. In addition to that, I don't think it would change the battlefield too much because within the first 20-40 minutes of the game, any insurgent that wants a scoped kit has scavenged one off a dead blufor anyway.

I'd like to see it trialled and if it was game breaking then removed... but more than anything I want buckshot intel gathering shotguns removed asap plzzzzzzzzzz... insurgency is super broken with 50 intel in 5 shots

[samogon100500]

Insurgents must have that cuz they no have long range weapon(MG without opticks sux) vs BLUFOR,on main base thats guns can't help for solders cuz way from MB to Cache so long and dangerous =)

[Amir]

Yessssss pleasssseeee.
Really hate the fact there are no scoped weapons or sniper rifles available ( except Lee Enfield ) for the insurgents.
Would be cool shooting these at Karbala,etc..

[HAAN4]

Hmm... not sure how to feel about it. My gut feeling says yes, because it would be rather limited (1 per cache and then maybe 1? at main base?). As you said I'm guessing that you'll end up with a fair few people grabbing it then taking a bike and sitting ages away from the cache and not helping, but hey that happens with any kit in any mode so we should kinda ignore the 'idiot player' aspect.

Upon skimming some of your material, it does seem like it would be a somewhat realistic threat that the blufor would be dealing with. In addition to that, I don't think it would change the battlefield too much because within the first 20-40 minutes of the game, any insurgent that wants a scoped kit has scavenged one off a dead blufor anyway.

I'd like to see it trialled and if it was game breaking then removed... but more than anything I want buckshot intel gathering shotguns removed asap plzzzzzzzzzz... insurgency is super broken with 50 intel in 5 shots

you get the exactly point of what i has thicking about.

[rampo]

just make it more effective, its ridiculous to have to shoot someone in the chest whit a 7,62 and not have him fall on the first shot whit out a headshot ...

[ryan d ale]

just make it more effective, its ridiculous to have to shoot someone in the chest whit a 7,62 and not have him fall on the first shot whit out a headshot ...

I find the Dragunov is super effective anyway

I'm not saying I have skills... I'm saying it's really good at knocking people down (in my experience).

[boilerrat]

I agree with your suggestion, this would be helpful.

Lets take for example the situation my squad was in today.

Ramiel, blackhawk drops a squad in the mountains east of the cache we were protecting... we had no scopes to attack them from 300m so we all just shot as much as we could hoping we would kill something... I don't think we did.

On a second note, I like your organization for the thread.

[rampo]

I find the Dragunov is super effective anyway

I'm not saying I have skills... I'm saying it's really good at knocking people down (in my experience).

Well i must be using the wrong SVD then because i can never insta-kill someone unless it was a headshot or im shooting at someone after being revived

[Psyrus]

Well i must be using the wrong SVD then because i can never insta-kill someone unless it was a headshot or im shooting at someone after being revived

Doesn't that mean the G3 would be a 1 shot kill as well?

[Trooper909]

Would solve the annoying habbit of blufor players Just sitting on a hill all game with no fear of counter fire.

[rushn]

i thought this was a ressugestion i guess not

awesome idea because of a scope issue but dragunov does shoot faster then bolt rifles so maybe it was nerfed because of that

[boilerrat]

Would solve the annoying habbit of blufor players Just sitting on a hill all game with no fear of counter fire.

This brings up a really good point, I have noticed blufor never really attacks... they sit back and shoot with scopes for kills instead of actually taking objectives.

If they weren't able to do this anymore, they would start getting closer instead and going for objectives.

WHICH!... would promote moving in with teamwork.

[Psyrus]

This brings up a really good point, I have noticed blufor never really attacks... they sit back and shoot with scopes for kills instead of actually taking objectives.

If they weren't able to do this anymore, they would start getting closer instead and going for objectives.

WHICH!... would promote moving in with teamwork.

For sure! One of the strangest things coming from the Australian bigD server then trying the ]H[ insurgency server is the shift from 2 to 4 hour round times. With 7 caches to kill, the 2 hour round time dictates that we on bigD must average a cache kill every 17 minutes which means you don't really have time to sit back and snipe from a hill for 20 mins... you gotta get in there and destroy that cache!!! I really enjoy the tempo that it gives the game, and I do find it preferable to the 4 hour times in the sense that the insurgents at least have a small chance of winning if they hold the bluforce up at several caches... rather than the only real way of winning in a 4 hour round being bleeding the blurforce of all their tickets.

I think this change would certainly help a lot on servers that exhibit that very behaviour that you speak of boilerrat.

Nice one dtacs.... pretty simple addition that seemingly everyone agrees with

[Dev1200]

I think insurgents should be request, not pickup.

[badmojo420]

Question, do the kits on the caches re-spawn based on the kit? Or is it like the kits in the main bases, that respawn X minutes after they've been picked up?

For example, the SA7 kit on Karbala, if you pick up the kit, run around for half an hour, and then go back to main, there will be another kit waiting there. So now there is 2 SA7 kits.

If this could create unlimited amounts of SVD kits, I don't like it. RPG, and LMGs are one thing, but if everyone had an SVD, it would ruin gameplay.

[Psyrus]

Question, do the kits on the caches re-spawn based on the kit? Or is it like the kits in the main bases, that respawn X minutes after they've been picked up?

For example, the SA7 kit on Karbala, if you pick up the kit, run around for half an hour, and then go back to main, there will be another kit waiting there. So now there is 2 SA7 kits.

If this could create unlimited amounts of SVD kits, I don't like it. RPG, and LMGs are one thing, but if everyone had an SVD, it would ruin gameplay.

As per the original suggestion:

Proposal:
Add an SVD pickup kit on the current known, and unknown, caches in addition to the kits (or replacing) the ones at main. This kit would not re-spawn on the caches, and MAXIMUM one will be available. (Bayonet, SVD undeployed, deployed, stone, binoculars)

So what I can gather, you'd have a maximum of 8 (8 caches * 1SVD per cache) + however many at main (1-2?) in a game of insurgency.

[badmojo420]

Ahh, thanks I missed that sentence.

Hopefully it can be implemented that way.

[dtacs]

As per the original suggestion:So what I can gather, you'd have a maximum of 8 (8 caches * 1SVD per cache) + however many at main (1-2?) in a game of insurgency.

Correct. Plus its my expectation that there wouldn't be 8 on the field at any one time, I mean really there is virtually no way that the guy who got the first one of the first cache would be able to keep it up for the whole round.

Ramiel, blackhawk drops a squad in the mountains east of the cache we were protecting... we had no scopes to attack them from 300m so we all just shot as much as we could hoping we would kill something... I don't think we did.

This is also the problem which I think this addition would counter: stopping snipers and HMG positions out in the desert (IE Karbala) from killing until they get intel, which is wholeheartedly unrealistic since you can't interrogate a dead man 500m away from you.

[myles]

Yessssss pleasssseeee.
Really hate the fact there are no scoped weapons or sniper rifles available ( except Lee Enfield ) for the insurgents.
Would be cool shooting these at Karbala,etc..

These are alrady ingame just not at a caches