Possible Insurgent Strategy

[TheOldBreed]

I haven't posted this in the ingame tactics/strategy category, mainly due to the fact that they are all tried and tested strategies.

Anywho, while on the place of infinite epiphanies known as the crapper, I had an idea that may not have been tested before. On insurgency maps, it is quite possible for the the insurgent teams to just hole-up inside buildings, not coming out except with the intention of conducting ambushes, and then vanishing once again. Buildings would provide adequate cover from mortars and most other ordnance. I imagine this would only work effectively in urban type maps (Fallujah, Basra, Gaza).

Obviously the first cache that is automatically unveiled will be subject to more concentrated BLUFOR effort, but if the insurgents stay inside buildings, this would hypothetically:

a) Lessen the chance of insurgents being killed in open battle (in which they have little chance), which would in turn-
b) Lessen the 'points' gained by BLUFOR that are needed to reveal a new cache location.

It would eventually render the game to a 'how long can the insurgents hold out'-type scenario, with BLUFOR drastically needing to clear each building and area one by one in order to discover new caches (much more than it already is). Emphasis will be centred much more on close-quarters battle.

On the BLUFOR side, this would entail the need for more close cooperation between squads and supporting arms (namely AAVs for use of their Mk. 19) in order to support infantry. The map would also seem very empty, with the added danger of not knowing what lies in each building and each room within its interior.

This is, however, a very hypothetical method of gameplay. No doubt the close cooperation needed on both sides will be hard to accomplish.

Thoughts are welcome

[Truism]

Yes, it would work, to take it one step further, everyone could just not spawn, unless there's something about INS vehicle's interraction with intelligence I'm not up to date on.

As I've pointed out in the past, INSY is a race against time for Coalition, Insurgents really just provide an embuggerance that can slow them down. In practice, it insurgents defending that actually makes the coalition's job easier and faster, since their movements give away cache position, and the only ways for Coalition to learn cache locations is to frag the **** out of insurgents (which is dead easy because of the incredible overmatch they have in nearly every area). The only exception to this rule is IEDs.

It'd be a viable tactic. Let's say a round is set for 3 hours, that's 180 minutes. 30 people have to search half the map on average for each cache... You do the math, but it's reasonable to assume they'd lose a lot of rounds.

I suspect they'd lose more rounds than they do now unless they just wrote learned the cache locations and shortlisted a search pattern.

Like I've always said, Coalition is competing with the clock in Insurgency. They don't actually need to do much to outplay the Insurgents, just play in a disciplined, organised way, and they'll control anywhere they want to. Their only real opponent is the clock.

[goguapsy]

If everybody bunched up inside 1 building, it would be ridiculously easy for the BLUFOR to clear it.

If you mean to hole up inside several buildings in the area... makes more sense. (Emphasis on the inside because outside is plain stupid.)

Could work.

[badmojo420]

It works great, if you can get the whole insurgent team to hide and wait rather than run around the streets getting killed.

Personally this is how I play insurgency 90% of the time. I value my life, and I value the cache. Everything else isn't important. And usually my life is more important than the cache. I retreat from every firefight, I camp doorways, I never sit outside cover when mortars might start falling. I just try to play it how a real insurgent would.

And while there might be less action and less kills from playing this way, I enjoy the game more when I can go hours with only a couple deaths. Especially when I kill or wound lots of coalition forces in the process. And usually the kills I do get, are people who were close to finding the cache.

Sadly, I think a lot of people want to play PR like COD with bigger maps. Where you start moving the second you spawn in, and only stop moving when a bullet is put in your head. They want ACTION and epic rambo battles where they try to take on a full coalition squad, just outside an unknown cache they've been using as a spawn point. After all, it's closer to the enemies, which means more chances to die/pwn them.

I blame the misconception that "deaths don't count against insurgents" for this zombie-like tendency. Sure, we won't lose from the deaths alone, but indirectly we will, from having all our caches exposed and under attack. Really, the only ones who shouldn't care about dying(outside ROE) are collaborators. And of course there is the few times when both caches are revealed and we lose no intelligence, but even then, your worth more alive defending a cache than dead waiting to respawn.

If everybody bunched up inside 1 building, it would be ridiculously easy for the BLUFOR to clear it.

If you mean to hole up inside several buildings in the area... makes more sense. (Emphasis on the inside because outside is plain stupid.)

Could work.

The idea is to use buildings as cover and wait for the enemy to get to the building before engaging. Forcing them into close quarters combat, and catching them by surprise because you haven't been firing from that building the whole time.

Of course you wouldn't want the whole team in one building. Nor would you want the whole team in only one area, you'd want to spread out around the city in random buildings. Because using this strategy it would be very difficult for the coalition to gain intelligence and uncover caches. So when they start clearing random buildings because they're seeing no contacts, you're there to ambush them.

Stop taking the fight to them, instead let them walk into your killzone.

[badmojo420]

[double posted please delete]

[Spec]

Not spawning is not an option. If there's no insurgents, there's no insurgency. It renders the entire round useless. The coalition win by default, because there is no enemy. Only the round end screen would show it as victory for the insurgents, but common sense dictates that that is wrong, and in fact, the coalition troops have claimed "victory", as they did merely patrol around a peaceful town for three hours.

Hiding however is an option that makes sense from a realism point of view, and is underused. Insurgents often forget about intel points and simply go out and act as cannon fodder because there's no directly visible consequences of it, as in, no ticket loss. It wouldn't need to be limited to camping random buildings for the entire round. Actually being on the move and trying to avoid contact would also be an option (especially on the non-urban maps). Especially with a relatively large amount of civilians, so that the enemy needs to get close to deal with them, and they can quickly set up an ambush if they have been spotted. If the enemy just attacks them at range, the intel gained by killing them is nothing compared to the huge intel loss of killing the civilians.

[goguapsy]

The idea is to use buildings as cover and wait for the enemy to get to the building before engaging. Forcing them into close quarters combat, and catching them by surprise because you haven't been firing from that building the whole time.

I can only see that working in caves/tunnels.

Because normal buildings are easy to get dominated...

[badmojo420]

Sigh.... the idea is to get them to come into the building or compound and then ambush them. Unless they have a squad sitting back waiting to see if they get ambushed, I don't see how they're going to dominate the building.

The whole idea is for them to think "gee, wonder if there is a cache in this building" and then walk in and get lit up by hajis. Not "Well, i bet that building is crawling with enemies, lets run in and find out!" because we both know they'd sit back and throw a million frags.

The day i see infantry in PR clearing EVERY building they enter with frags, i'll stop pushing this strategy. But right now, the way the game is played, this works 95% of the time. Even if you down a whole squad and their medic happens to kill you and then revive them, that's still a bunch of tickets lost. It's a win for you even if you only wound 1 guy.

[Cassius]

Its the weapon system. Snipers are hated by allies and foes alike in many games and RL

[Bringerof_D]

I ALWAYS leave the pocket of buildings where the cache is pawned on is, however i always do so without being spotted or in a way that does not raise suspicion if i am spotted.

Usually if i get a marksman or RPG kit i find a good building with over watch of the grouping of buildings where the cache is, hide, and wait. there a rounds where i never get a kill, because the blufor didnt come in where i thought they would, but i know that it was a likely entry route. In cases where it was used by blufor i bring devastating results. particularly with the SVD.

problem with INS mode as that when they do try to ambush, it's only a small group participating. In an ambush you have to strike Hard and Fast. In game other squads i see just RPG a vehicle from a distance and move on. When i organize i ambush on the larger scale, i'd organize PKMs and RPGs to strike at a distance, the moment those hit closer mates with AKs will push in for the kill. even if the RPGs missed the confusion will often allow my troops to deal some serious damage with just the AKs and RKGs.

@gogaupsy: it's ahrder but not impossible, i once held a building with three entrances with only myself and another surviving blue guy against US on Kokan for almost 10 minutes. in that time we fought off 1 wave of 2 squads and 2 waves of 3 squads being supported by a crows humvee where the INF were spawning on a near by FOB