Co-op servers aren't grab-ass screw around time

[80HD]

(This is something I have noticed in my short (so far, not planning on leaving soon) time with this mod, and I want to soapbox about it. Flammenwerfer at will.)

When I got into this game, got some pointers before I ever started, read the manuals, etc... mainly because I knew enough through researching BF2 mods that this game was for serious(ish) - okay, people capable of being serious for brief periods of time - people wanting to play a more realistic game that relies upon teamwork and tactics.

I would say that better than 50% of the time, this is the case. That's amazing for ANY online game, let alone an FPS.

When I got in, I considered going right to deployment... but only because I felt like Co-op would be a waste of time. It really does not have to be. I am by no means a good player... when I am in Deployment, I tend to take a supporting role because I am intimidated by some of the amazing infantry squads/squad leaders out there. Honestly, I have not run into many outright bungrifles, and having served in the Marine Corps Infantry, I was actually impressed by the legit squad leaders who carpet eff-bomb when the situation is appropriate. Feels like home.

Anyway, newbography aside, I went into Co-op because I KNEW that jumping into Deployment right away would be a disaster. I spent the first week or two playing on VG and a couple of the other Co-op servers (VG admins are superb). And, all of the obvious non-hardcore option differences aside, while I did learn invaluable information on the gameplay mechanics, as a training tool (AND as a gameplay tool for those who like co-op) it could be so much more.

The biggest issue is the derogatory view that some Deployment players take toward Co-op. People who know better get on servers, lonewolf, try to learn to fly, grief, etc. Even worse, the overall attitude a lot of individuals who are clearly skilled is that this is just grab-*** time... taking commander to mess with the UAV only, being a squad leader with absolutely no intention of actually leading the squad, playing Waverace 64 in the zodiacs, throwing smoke when admins aren't around, spamming the in-game voice commo rose, etc.

Basically everything their little griefer hearts yearn for but would never fly on Deployment. And after playing Deployment, I totally get it on the level that yeah... Co-op is like Coke and Deployment is like Cocaine. A hell of a drug. (That would make PRT Crack I suppose)

So, I think everyone can agree that even the 5% of new players that do read any of the documentation (apparently some cannot even read the license key screen and then make raeg posts about what a **** mod this is) should start off in Co-op at least until they know about deviation, medics, hopefully supply crates, the importance of not losing heavy assets/not taking heavy assets not allocated to their squad, some semblance of squad operations, and other core functions.

So why then, when a newb crashes a chopper, are they told to go to Co-op? Co-op players don't want someone who literally does not have a clue on how to even get a chopper off the ground smashing every Huey on the Essex into the bridge like some NFL wide out on a bender.

Coming to co-op and taking a dump in the duck pond to get your rocks off when you are 2 bottles past Deployment effective is counter productive.

I am not saying that every salt dog who has been around since PR had muskets needs to volunteer to do newb orientation (I mean, taking your clan to a Co-op server once in awhile to lead squads and command would be AWESOME for everyone) but at least don't treat it like it's a circus free for all lamerfest.

It would be like Fleet Marines going on leave, getting laced, and then piling into a Festiva to go to MCRD San Diego and throw empty bottles of Milwaukees Best at recruits while they drill, pissing on the flower beds, and setting fire to the barracks. Then going back to their unit and complaining about the turd untrained boots they get deployed to their units.

Keeping the Co-op servers pristine will pay off across the board. More people will want to keep playing, and you will have less special-needs squad mates.

Simply follow the same rules you do on Deployment servers, at the very least. (Equipment rules notwithstanding, of course)

Co-op servers already have to deal with the SLEW of players who are either too scared to play against the big boys, too rage-competitive to play against ANY human opponents, have been kicked off of every Deployment server for being dbags, or simply can't hack it with the Deployment rule-set.


Okay, </rant>

[Doc.Pock]

- okay, people capable of being serious for brief periods of time -

which means me and wicca are out?

[80HD]

which means me and wicca are out?

"Brief" is left ambiguous for those of us that are... challenged... by maintaining a professional military demeanor...

[killonsight95]

i use co-op for training aircraft and having a bit of spammy rocket fun time against bots xD, i wouldn't even try to play a real game on a co-op server ever.

[Vista]

Agree 100%

[JeffCole]

Alright, you sound like someone who has understood that new players willing to learn the game (specifically NOT saying "noobs" here) might be frightened by the sheer dimensions PR is able to deliver.
For a start, back in 0.75 there was no such thing as Training Mode or Co-Op as it is available nowadays. I had to jump into the cold water but luckily some understanding squadleader took care of me. Otherwise I might not be here today, playing PR and really enjoying it every second. So i really apreciate our R-DEVs, MODs and CONs giving new players the chance to try something out in a training-like environment.

I would not consider myself as a pro player but I play PR for the teamwork - so if you want, just hit me up on PM and we can talk about the "Crack" as you nicely put it and the coop-stuff.

[80HD]

Alright, you sound like someone who has understood that new players willing to learn the game (specifically NOT saying "noobs" here) might be frightened by the sheer dimensions PR is able to deliver.
For a start, back in 0.75 there was no such thing as Training Mode or Co-Op as it is available nowadays. I had to jump into the cold water but luckily some understanding squadleader took care of me. Otherwise I might not be here today, playing PR and really enjoying it every second. So i really apreciate our R-DEVs, MODs and CONs giving new players the chance to try something out in a training-like environment.

I would not consider myself as a pro player but I play PR for the teamwork - so if you want, just hit me up on PM and we can talk about the "Crack" as you nicely put it and the coop-stuff.

Wow, I took for granted that co-op was available... that must have been a rough go indeed! My first foray into a real Deployment game, I was going to just man AA on MEC-side Mutt City, but a squad sent out that they needed another player with some funny message about being awesome if you were on their squad, and I am all about free awesome. So I join up, and it was intense... TOTALLY the lost puppy, which is tough when guys 15 years younger than you are having to hold your hand. But they were ultimately very cool, and although I did not get any kills, I DID stop at least 3 sets of bullets and a grenade that could easily have injured one of them!!! I also learned about bounding in PR (which I have yet to join a another squad that does this right - AceMantura, where do you play? I want to run with your squad again!) and it was my first exposure to the fact that Limited Kits really ARE Limited in Deployment vs. Co-op hahahaa... I was respawning once, and saw that the M249 was available, so I grabbed it - not knowing that the AR (which to ME meant either assault rifle or Armalite - a simple thing, but soooo confusing that night hahaha) had grabbed a medic bag right before he died... and he got a little torqued... I said hey, it was available so I grabbed it, you can have it back anytime! He was cool after that. Through no fault of my own, we rolled the map and were top squad... so, even with a boat anchor these guys were excellent.

Even though I was pretty embarrassed, that run is probably what hooked me on PR.


I will definitely hit you up sometime, I live in the Central US, but I get a good ping to NwA, so I tend to play there now. I am Central time, so we might have to do it to it on the weekend.

(Traveling on business, but I will be back Wednesday and staying up waaay too late playing PR again)

[Shovel]

I always thought of coop as the place where you go when you are tired of dieing in Deployment. If you put together a real squad on coop you can be kickass. Also, you never lose, so it's a good morale booster

[Lacrosse4Life17]

For certain reason, I do not play Co-Op very often unless I want to train myself in piloting. Every time I join a Co Op server for fun, I have a 99.9999% chance of getting banned. And I rather not get banned.

[K4on]

[irony]coop was and is a "get crazy and have a good time in vanillastyle" gamemode ... nothing more. bots are silly, why dont get down on their level?[/irony]

seriously, deplyoment is the real challenge... singleplayer is good for getting retarded. thats why i dont play this.

[2akurate]

I also played coop just for training, bots are totally retarded and a bit of effort can win you the game everyone knows that and so there is no need to play serious, there is no challenge and so people use it as practice period.

I have tried to practice on local games but most of the maps I can't even fly the damn helicopter because the devs thought it would be a swell Idea to make helicopters innaccesible only for bots. Anyway devs you guys are great but the whole way you guys have structured the local games is beyond me.

Why wouldn't I be able to fly kiowa in al basrah on my own local server, doesn't make any sense, sorry for the off-topic.

[saXoni]

In my opinion, Co-op is for those who are not capable of playing on the "real" servers(except those who are learning to fly). This is why we find all the douchbags on these servers.

[Stealthgato]

In my opinion, Co-op is for those who are not capable of playing on the "real" servers(except those who are learning to fly). This is why we find all the douchbags on these servers.

^ This. I used to join them only to mess around in vehicles with no consequences, but then I found the joy of editing the asset layouts on local server. I just don't see how it's fun seriously fighting dumb BOTs that always do the same thing, just shoot them in the same spot x times, cap flag, repeat until inevitable map win. To each it's own I guess.

[Murphy]

As I see it co-op is fun for asset whoring, which inevitably leads to attempting retarded things you wouldn't even have a chance to try in deployment. Last time I got banned we maneuvered 6 or so choppers into a huge plus shaped formation, then we got bored and started to troll each other kamikaze style and the ban hammer ensued. I think the problem is a lot of deployment players see anything that happens in coop as inconsequential, and it's true.

Also PRT is def crack.

[80HD]

When the first thing a new player sees when they log in to this vaunted reality mod that is supposed to be all about teamwork is a bunch of wankers doing exactly the opposite of that, it's sure to make them want to stay and learn the game.

I thank all of you for repeatedly solidifying my point.

[Bringerof_D]

unfortunately due to the way bots act, that's really all it's good for. I personally hop on just for some less serious game time though i dont grief and **** around.

I use Coop mostly to try out and practice weapons and vehicles i seldom get to use on deployment, and work on my IAs (like when and where to switch something or whether or not to sight in/best situations for a tactical reload)

Like you i feel right at home when i find a good SL leading me who isnt afraid to swear a little or yell at someone when they're being stupid. Though i guess we get accustomed to that once we sign the papers. I remember having a few bad SLs in game who caught helmet fire real quick every time we were engaged.

PR is definitely drugs. anybody who's easily absorbed into something should not play this, it will destroy their lives Almost had a few friends set up an intervention on me but i managed to pull away long enough to accompany them on a few rounds of Halo. So that shut them up. THEY"LL NEVER UNDERSTAAAAAND!

[L1ghtKillah]

If you want the real answer, it lies in the ancient history books of ye olde PR. When i first fired up this mod, .64 was in full swing, or was it .67? I cant remember, its been too long ago. At that time, the mod was smaller, there were only say, 2-3 servers that stayed populated during the day, and at night, literally no body was online. There was no coop mode. Instead, the first menu option said "Training". When whatever patch came out, it introduced AI into PR, and because of that we had BF2 like control over the aircraft for the bots (this was fixed so that they spawn outside the base now, and you die if you chill in a bot-specific aircraft now.

Back when training mode was out, everybody went there to learn how to play PR, the old fashioned way. Respawns were near instant, if not instant on most training servers. There were no bots. Bases had TONS of vehicles, which had very high spawn limits and almost no respawn time (on the order of 2-5 seconds, IIRC). So, deployment was for people who new how to play the game, and training was for people to learn how to play, everyone flying on training servers BLEW, and it was expected. You didnt join a training server to play PR, you joined it to learn about teh game, and get opportunities to fly aircraft you would feel too embarrased to fly in deployment. Training was there for you to hone your skills, and get some solid practice in without disturbing other players in deployment mode.

In my opinion, this mod went downhill when they took training mode out. It created a hole where new players must fill coop servers to learn, and people expect this new training mode to be full of good players. Sorry, doesnt work like that. I resurrected this account just to post this reply. So now you know, thank you for partaking in this mod, and as you can see, i still play it even after they took training mode out.

My 2 cents, and some solid facts.

[saXoni]

I just don't see how it's fun seriously fighting dumb BOTs that always do the same thing, just shoot them in the same spot x times, cap flag, repeat until inevitable map win.

Because these players want to kill. They see a BOT, shoot him, kill him. YEAH! AWESOME!
They keep doing this, while bragging about their score. "Haha, look at my score! 45-0!"
Go back to COD.

[80HD]

L1ightKilla: Thank you so much for the information, that definitely sounds like it would be a GREAT thing to have available.

As far as the general opinion from veteran players, I completely get you, and I am not saying that Co-op is remotely close to Deployment (and like I said, I played ONE Deployment match and cannot play against bots again, it's just pathetic).

What I am saying is, if all you use Co-op for is screwing around, that's great, and that is why there is an offline mode. There are also plenty of empty co-op servers around.

That is why the title is "Co-op servers". There is no valid excuse for laming on a public server with players actually playing on it.

[Bob of Mage]

Two issues:

1) Co-op does NOT = Training Mode
PRSP was a mod for PR before 0.9 (I don't know when it started but I played it back in 0.8 when I first started playing), when they removed Training there was a spot for Co-op. Training was removed because of all the BS that went on there. The stay BS is what this topic is talking about.

2) There are 2 kinds of Co-op severs
Some are turly a new type of training with 2 second respawns and 8000+ tickets. Others are for those who want to play Co-op. The VG sever is a good example of the second kind, while the RW sever is a good example of a training one. The issue is that people like many of those who posted here go to the training severs to be asshats just like the old days. That I have less of an issue with, but remember that Training was REMOVED for a reason. The issue is when the BS spills over into a Co-op sever like VG. I and a few others (yes there are people who like Co-op and no we aren't crazy or bad players) who play Co-op for Co-op have to deal with as 80HD said "people pissing in our duck poad" becuase they have fun doing it.

Now for those of you who say there is no way in hell Co-op can be fun, remember somoe simple facts. Not everyone has the same tastes when it comes to fun. Some people will find that playing the Medic is awsome. Others on the other hand will not touch the kit with a 39 1/2 foot pole. So please stop PISSING IN MY DUCK POAD! You don't like it when others do it so don't do it yourself.