Thoughts on the Squad Leader

[Bringerof_D]

i ALWAYS lead a squad. whether i'm actually in the SL position and have the kit or not. Even just as a SM leadership is important. I find many players are the same way. As you're asking specifically of the importance of the SL kit i will say it gives negligible abilities to the player.

With the new mumble system it is far more effective and convenient to verbally give instructions for CAS than to pull out the radio and do all that tedious clicking and right clicking to get markers up. It is quicker and clearer in every respect.

If i have no intentions of building a FOB immediately, then i have little to no use for the officer kit, lets face it that kit is obsolete.

as for the importance of leadership as i said above, i lead from any position, and i find many others are the same way. If the SL is giving instructions to particular members i am directing the others accordingly. If even for a moment my SL stutters while giving commands in a tough situation, i interpret the situation and act accordingly giving quick instructions to the guys near me to lessen the load on the SL.

this is Project Reality, play like a real soldier. real soldiers are not completely reliant on the person with the highest rank, take the initiative.

[dtacs]

this is Project Reality, play like a real soldier

Oh my god.

[Brainlaag]

Oh my god.

2nd that, who ever applies RL tactics and thinks they actually work in PR should get slapped across his face.

[Strepto]

I find my self regularly squadleading. I am not the best squadleader out there and I find that I often have a lacking experience on many maps that are not in the regular server rotation. Im usually the guy that makes squads at the 30 sec mark, because losing the start of a round by fooling around in main hurts the team immensely.

The officer kit has one big advantage. The RADIO. Its the kit that glues the team together, mark contacts and call in lazes. A squad without squadleader is in no good use to the team on any map bigger then skirmish in my opinion.

MAP MARKERS
I use the map markers to mark any enemy FOBS, squads, snipers, tanks - things I think my squad will have a problem taking out, or would like other squads to take in to the consideration of their approach. My experience is that the mapmarkers are under used. You have no reason to not mark incoming enemy squads. Enemy FOBs that are marked in chat once have much more use if they are marked on the map for 5 minutes too. If I pick up the wrong kit or lose the officer kit I would often like to retreat instead of attack, because the attack will probably do nothing good for the team. You need to have an awesome teamwork round with tight communication on mumble to replace map markers.

PS: The current max of 3 map markers/squad is a little tight for me. I would like to mark the FOB, the tow and the AA on Kashan. Then I cant mark the tank thats approaching without removing a mark or two.

PPS: no need to offend Bringerof_D because of a out of context quote.

[Oskar]

PPS: no need to offend Bringerof_D because of a out of context quote.

Yeah. Even though the "real soldier" reference is a bit lulsy, I still agree. Initiative is good.

[Trooper909]

Started playing again this last week and to be honest its the same as when I stopped playing.

You don't even need a squad let alone a SL.Once you needed a squad to be effective because you could never hope to kill 6 guys solo because deviation made that impossible,now I can kill a full squad on my own with ease.You know wile your SL is discussing tactics I've mowed down your shit for example

On to the officer subject.What use is he? none what so ever,Rally points don't exist,he don't need to organize a squad to do such tasks as building FOB's because its more effective to take a truck and go build it solo.
When you do get one that actually leads hes normally new/bad and you spend more time starring at a black screen or walking from main all round because he is suicidal.

Or worst case scenario he don't even have a mic or he is on mumble,cant work out witch sometimes.

[SGT.Ice]

2nd that, who ever applies RL tactics and thinks they actually work in PR should get slapped across his face.

Gentlemen, we have the technology.

[SGT.Ice]

The officer kit dosen't give you the divine ability to set squad markers, just the ones from the radio which can be done by the commander and 90% of the time when I place em they are ignored.

[Murphy]

Started playing again this last week and to be honest its the same as when I stopped playing.

You don't even need a squad let alone a SL.Once you needed a squad to be effective because you could never hope to kill 6 guys solo because deviation made that impossible,now I can kill a full squad on my own with ease.You know wile your SL is discussing tactics I've mowed down your shit for example

On to the officer subject.What use is he? none what so ever,Rally points don't exist,he don't need to organize a squad to do such tasks as building FOB's because its more effective to take a truck and go build it solo.
When you do get one that actually leads hes normally new/bad and you spend more time starring at a black screen or walking from main all round because he is suicidal.

Or worst case scenario he don't even have a mic or he is on mumble,cant work out witch sometimes.

Most of these points are basically due to bad players which doesn't have much relevancy concerning the use of the kit. I'd suggest looking for better servers to play on if you can wipe whole squads because they are busy planning/looking the other way or since you're so pro try leading the helpless masses yourself.

As for Bringers quote of playing like a "real soldier" I believe he was pointing out the whole concept of doing what needs to be done when it needs to be done instead of waiting to be told and lead by the hand. An SL isn't supposed to micromanage his squad, he gives the squad a focus and keeps them on task, and for this he doesn't need a kit.

[Kain888]

Started playing again this last week and to be honest its the same as when I stopped playing.

You don't even need a squad let alone a SL.Once you needed a squad to be effective because you could never hope to kill 6 guys solo because deviation made that impossible,now I can kill a full squad on my own with ease.You know wile your SL is discussing tactics I've mowed down your shit for example

On to the officer subject.What use is he? none what so ever,Rally points don't exist,he don't need to organize a squad to do such tasks as building FOB's because its more effective to take a truck and go build it solo.
When you do get one that actually leads hes normally new/bad and you spend more time starring at a black screen or walking from main all round because he is suicidal.

Or worst case scenario he don't even have a mic or he is on mumble,cant work out witch sometimes.

You sure you haven't been playing on Coop servers?

[Bringerof_D]

Oh my god.

Dtacs, i'm not talking the tactics, i'm not even talking the strategies. i'm talking about behavior. Basic real life behaviors in a model designed to the best of it's ability to simulate reality, leads to success. Yes there are limitations which change what the tactics and strategies will be, but the basic behaviors remain the same.

example:
success in an environment where there are multiple options to approach a problem requires that a decision is made. If time is a relevant factor in this environment, it is in your best interest to make that decision quickly. these basic principles still apply in PR, when i say be like a real soldier i don't mean fight like one. i mean just be like one. Act with the basic principles of a real soldier.

Initiative, leadership, and adaptability will be the what leads to success both in the real world and a model based on the real world no matter how limited or modified that model is. As long as PR remains a game about live player interactions in a varying environment of three dimensional space, to act accordingly simply makes sense.

i mean how often do soldiers in real life get blown up by mines simply placed in the middle of a paved road, not hidden at all? how often does that happen in PR? why is there such a difference in the statistics? the difference is simply due to the difference in behavior. I'm talking about behaviors like: checking a bridge before speeding over it with a truck, dismounting a single infantry to round a blind corner before the vehicle does. yeah you might lose the one guy to an SPG, but now you know there's an SPG there and you saved the vehicle and the rest of the squad.

@BrainLaaag: well evidently it works for me in game. gamey tactics would work in real life too if you had the ability to use them. if you had enough grenades i'm sure nade spamming would work great. If you could jump infinitely while running at top speed over and over again with little delay between each jump, i'm sure bunny hopping would be fantastic against a marksman or sniper too.

[illidur]

The SL is the most teamwork kit in the game, bar none. It's not just rallys, which are hella useful and you should be able to drop at all times, but also spotting, patching other people and yourself, requesting using radio, and lazing.
Whenever I see a squad over 4 members where the squad leader has something other than an officer kit, like a marksman, I think "yup, that guy's not gonna talk to me"
Or it's an Od-s squad, which is probably worse. Please don't copy them.

firstly dont confuse SL with SL kit. rallys wont be possible when im next to the cache building. what will be possible is c4. if a lase/CAS was going to be used it would have been before i assaulted.

i would still talk to you as teamwork isn't decided by a kit.

[saXoni]

It all depends on your squad-mates, really. If you know you can trust them, and you know they will do stuff properly without even having to tell them about it, it's all so much easier. This is probably the main reason why I don't lead pubbers - I don't trust them.

[Arc_Shielder]

WOW
My original point was based in the fact that the OFFICER kit is just not valuable to the general population in PR. Meaning, there is nothing about the Squad Leader/officer kit that is critical to game play.

I'm not sure what is worse: the pro l33t players that don't need a SL; the uber intelectual tacticians going off-topic; or the OP's Hardcorish view about the SL kit.