HAT kits while prone

godfather_596 · Post by **godfather_596** » 2012-10-29 20:56

Why can't we use HAT while prone. Can't they do it in real life. If I'm not mistaken the Metis can as indicated by this picture:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... _Metys.jpg

saXoni · Post by **saXoni** » 2012-10-29 21:17

Doesn't it have a bi-/tripod?

paul161616 · Post by **paul161616** » 2012-10-30 06:05

i think its on a tripod in that picture. i cant say for how it is in real life, although i seem to recall a previous thread about this, the verdict i believe, was that when fired from prone the projectile hits the ground right in front of you before it has time to arm, although i may be wrong on that one.

Edit: https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f26-pr ... prone.html
there we go

Predator.v2 · Post by **Predator.v2** » 2012-10-30 11:45

As i stated on another thread, you can fire the german, russian and israel hat from prone. I suppose the others can't, as in real life there would be problems with the guidance or the missile eject system.

godfather_596 · Post by **godfather_596** » 2012-10-30 13:04

saXoni wrote:Doesn't it have a bi-/tripod?

It is still reaaaaallllllllyyyy low to the ground at least when compared to crouching (the user is prone)

Heavy Death · Post by **Heavy Death** » 2012-10-30 13:13

Its awkward to wield these things in prone without support. You cant really shoulder it like when crouching... think a little.

Post by **M42 Zwilling** » 2012-10-30 20:28

Also, I would think that at least some of the backblast would hit the shooter's legs anyway. Sounds like a very bad idea.

godfather_596 · Post by **godfather_596** » 2012-10-30 21:39

M42 Zwilling wrote:Also, I would think that at least some of the backblast would hit the shooter's legs anyway. Sounds like a very bad idea.

I don't think it hurts the guy in the picture above though. I also thought the backblast would be a problem but apparently it isn't at least in the Metis. Also RPGs have significant backblast and we can fire them while prone

saXoni · Post by **saXoni** » 2012-10-30 21:49

godfather_596 wrote:It is still reaaaaallllllllyyyy low to the ground at least when compared to crouching (the user is prone)

I'd assume it's easier to fire the missile from a crouched position. I don't even know if it's possible to handle it while bein prone unless you've got i bi-/tripod.

paul161616 · Post by **paul161616** » 2012-10-30 21:50

the tripod is low to the ground as its called a mini-triopod used for firing a hat from a prone position. all your questions are most likely answered if you look through the linked thread

Stealthgato · Post by **Stealthgato** » 2012-10-30 22:18

M42 Zwilling wrote:Also, I would think that at least some of the backblast would hit the shooter's legs anyway. Sounds like a very bad idea.

The launchers are fired from a position with the legs of the shooter to the side of the launcher.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_60FEhz_4Bf0/T ... F+Eryx.JPG

From Arma but good enough (although the guy next to the RPG guy on this pic would eat backblast):

Recent image by tpM91 on Photobucket

godfather_596 · Post by **godfather_596** » 2012-10-30 22:47

I think I have a solution for the bipod thing. A HAT kit can have a bipod version (deployable) similar to those on LMGs that only works while prone. It'll take longer to setup and has a limited firing arc but has better concealment. What do you guys think?

lucky.BOY · Post by **lucky.BOY** » 2012-10-31 00:47

FH2 has this MG (probabaly MG42?) that deploys bipod when you go prone. The same thing could be implemeted here with HATs, maybe?
Somebody would have to actually model and animate these things, though.

PricelineNegotiator · Post by **PricelineNegotiator** » 2012-10-31 00:51

godfather_596 wrote:Why can't we use HAT while prone. Can't they do it in real life. If I'm not mistaken the Metis can as indicated by this picture:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... _Metys.jpg

The guy in the picture isn't "proning". He's in a ditch. Notice the overturned soil and how his back would have to be angled if he was in fact proning and sitting that far above the ground.

But I think your main point is regarding the bipod and how low it is to the ground. I'd say no, no one would ever fire it in the prone position unless it was absolute life or death as it would be extremely dangerous and difficult to make the shot.

Mouthpiece · Post by **Mouthpiece** » 2012-10-31 02:17

PricelineNegotiator wrote:The guy in the picture isn't "proning". He's in a ditch. Notice the overturned soil and how his back would have to be angled if he was in fact proning and sitting that far above the ground.

But I think your main point is regarding the bipod and how low it is to the ground. I'd say no, no one would ever fire it in the prone position unless it was absolute life or death as it would be extremely dangerous and difficult to make the shot.

True.

And also truth about that shooting prone is not necessary. Why? The (in)famous jack in the box technique (get prone behind a object in full cover -> dont move and wait for HAT deviation to settle -> get up [the deviation won't reset] but dont move -> aim and fire).
It really should be covered in PR Manual. This kind of knowledge decides the outcome of battle.

Somewhat offtopic. But if we think about the jack in the box in terms of realism, we could say that it's more of an exploit of deviation system than a legit tactic. Sure it's been there forever and people (actually not that many - mostly the ones that have been playing in clans or have a deeper knowledge of the game) don't consider it an exploit. It would be much nicer if deviation would at least slightly reset when HAT would get up from his prone position (same as other kits that can be used in deployed mode). No more ghost rockets from nowhere.

40mmrain · Post by **40mmrain** » 2012-10-31 05:20

not all AT weapons have mounts for prone firing, secondly, the tube itself is massive enough, lugging around a big mount with your rifle is not feasible, the METIS itself is supposed to be stationary. In fact the ERYX and Javelin are barely single man portable too.

Yes the jack in the box tactic is basically half the use of the HAT kit, anyways, if deviation were to at least go off a bit when you stood up that would fix it. Its uncounterable, really.

Conman51 · Post by **Conman51** » 2012-10-31 05:23

40mmrain wrote:not all AT weapons have mounts for prone firing, secondly, the tube itself is massive enough, lugging around a big mount with your rifle is not feasible, the METIS itself is supposed to be stationary.

Yes the jack in the box tactic is basically half the use of the HAT kit, anyways, if deviation were to at least go off a bit when you stood up that would fix it. Its uncounterable, really.

YES!! this should happen.

Predator.v2 · Post by **Predator.v2** » 2012-10-31 13:38

If you know anyway to implement a "crouchmiscdev" or "standmiscdev" or "changestancemiscdev" please let me know. Currently we only have the "miscdev" which applies at jumping and prone and really fucks your aiming for about 3-4 seconds.

BF2 does have some delays to play with, but nothing which prevents crouch/standing behind cover. But if you find something, tell me.

40mmrain · Post by **40mmrain** » 2012-10-31 19:17

then disallow crouching while wielding a guide-able. Something, I dont care, its fucking broken right now.

Mouthpiece · Post by **Mouthpiece** » 2012-10-31 22:10

I made a suggestion about changes in deviation when getting up from prone position. Hope they will let it through.

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