Completely Removing the map with friendly positions for infantry

[DDS]

OMG!!!! NOoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Just kidding. Man look at the fear of this happening on display.

Okay this would create a shitload of small annoying scenarios. Imagine this :

You join a server, join a squad. Your mumble is derping, so you can't communicate with your squad untill you spawn, but you can't see them on the map, so you don't know where they are. You spawn at some random place, communicate with your squad now that mumble is synching and they say they're in G3 when you spawned in A4.. Suicide time yeaaaa.

Imagine playing medic lol.

You would type on the screen in squad chat BEFORE you spawn. "Hey squad leader, mumble appears to be down atm. Where should I spawn at?"

[M.Hart]

You would type on the screen in squad chat BEFORE you spawn. "Hey squad leader, mumble appears to be down atm. Where should I spawn at?"

Noone can see what you are writing as long as you are dead or wounded (as far as I remember).

[Tartantyco]

Okay this would create a shitload of small annoying scenarios. Imagine this :

You join a server, join a squad. Your mumble is derping, so you can't communicate with your squad untill you spawn, but you can't see them on the map, so you don't know where they are. You spawn at some random place, communicate with your squad now that mumble is synching and they say they're in G3 when you spawned in A4.. Suicide time yeaaaa.

Imagine playing medic lol.

How about instead of spawning at some random place you just spawn at main instead? Why the fuck are you spawning at some random location?

If the aim was to make the game inclusive to the mentally deficient people who just randomly spawn somewhere then you might have had a point.

[Kevokpo]

How about instead of spawning at some random place you just spawn at main instead? Why the fuck are you spawning at some random location?

If the aim was to make the game inclusive to the mentally deficient people who just randomly spawn somewhere then you might have had a point.

spawning on main spawning on a random place, it is exactly the same, it doesn't matter where you spawn as long as you can't communicate with your SL, if you spawn on main you will probably be more far away from you squad.

what you say is raight but it is not he point, as lheureux said, imagine being a medic you won't know where the guy is unless he speaks on local, or worst, imagine being the guys who needs medic, he won't be able to see where the medics are, unless he calls for medic, and he can only "call for medic" two times, I know you can right click on the give-up button to keep calling medic but most of the people don't know it.

Like I said before I find this idea interesting, and I like it but I don't want it to be implemented in the game. A lot of things needs to be changed for this system to work properlly, tactics, how you move through the map, it will practically like arma everyone together like a platoon going from flag to flag until they cap everything and the respawns should be removed to increase the value of the life of each player. I'm being exagerated but that's what I think that the mod might need, if all the players icons were removed from the minimap.

[DDS]

Mumble restarted.. crisis is over. Why the hyperventilating? I'll leave it to the developers to decide if something is feasible but I'm just seeing a lot of panic over change. There are different variants that could be tried. Just throwing this stuff out there.. relax.

[Arab]

Removing the Map and only limiting it for Officer in Squad Lead Position, Sniper and Spotter Classes and Commander.

Advantages:
-Forced Teamplay, Use of Mumble
-Don't have to constantly look at the map during combat, which distracts you, which increases your chance of dying and thus making you rage
-More awareness of environment
-Better appreciate the map
-Players cannot look at the map and give out contacts over the map unless they are squad leader, sniper/spotter and commander, which is realistic seeing as they probably in real-life have those
-Squad Leader has to tell squad to follow them to objective which only he has, and that forces the members to follow squad or else they get lost
-Use memory to find out locations
-Squad Leaders need to communicate more, but usually it's not that bad as long as the squad member follows the arrow. Which what I also would like to see are objectives and an increasing sized arrow marker updated to the compass as well as friendlies in the form of dots below the grid-lines, like Skyrim. Maybe it could be distracting, but it's a good alternative to maps.
-No more lonewolfing in insurgency. People have to work together as in real-life.
Disadvantages:
-Insurgents need a map too, seeing as they need to place grenade traps, mines, ambush tnt filled water plastic jug thingies, tnt/ied's. But like above, if insurgents actually join squads and team up with squad leader and communicate where mines should be on what location, then the game would be better. It's more so an Advantage than a disadvantage.
-Squad Leader's voice needs to be clearer and his directions precise, like 'Machine Gunner 100m NW 320 House'
-Squad Leader's role becomes more important, so he has to talk a little more than before.
-Could be somewhat hard-coded

[Gracler]

I think you misunderstood the concept a little Arab. Everyone still have maps... you just can't see friendly positions in real time....

[Arab]

I think you misunderstood the concept a little Arab. Everyone still have maps... you just can't see friendly positions in real time....

Well, then there's no point removing player positions then. How could it work for commander if he doesn't know where his troops are?

And again, experience is what reduces team-kills. People new to the game will sometimes team-kill, usually there has been times where it's been alot. But let's not get stingy about team-kills unless it's obviously a greifer.

When we are new to this game, we team-kill accidentally when trying out new features. It's a funny concept. You make a grenade trap, someone runs in, you warn them 'no no no no no, don't go there' and then *boom* 'Oooooh, damn he destroyed my trap'

What it's not likely to magically reduce team-killing. Removing the map altogether seems like a better idea and realistic, though maybe troops are issued with a map in the first place.

Everything is good in PR, but removing friendly positions is a rubbish idea.

[doop-de-doo]

The CO should be able to see his troops. Or at least where his SLs are located.

[DDS]

Well, then there's no point removing player positions then. How could it work for commander if he doesn't know where his troops are?

A very obvious point. The original idea has evolved somewhat. You have to have a squad leader with some idea where friendlies are (squad mates, other squads). This will slow the pace of the game somewhat and put people who just want to roam around squadless to a disadvantage. I really dislike starting a squad and having them wander around and not following directions. Better to rely on everyone else in your squad and help complete objectives. Then watch the greifers and lololol's howl themselves blue in the face and eventually go play something else.

[doop-de-doo]

Removing the Map and only limiting it for Officer in Squad Lead Position, Sniper and Spotter Classes and Commander.

Advantages:
-Forced Teamplay, Use of Mumble
-Don't have to constantly look at the map during combat, which distracts you, which increases your chance of dying and thus making you rage
-More awareness of environment
-Better appreciate the map
-Players cannot look at the map and give out contacts over the map unless they are squad leader, sniper/spotter and commander, which is realistic seeing as they probably in real-life have those
-Squad Leader has to tell squad to follow them to objective which only he has, and that forces the members to follow squad or else they get lost
-Use memory to find out locations
-Squad Leaders need to communicate more, but usually it's not that bad as long as the squad member follows the arrow. Which what I also would like to see are objectives and an increasing sized arrow marker updated to the compass as well as friendlies in the form of dots below the grid-lines, like Skyrim. Maybe it could be distracting, but it's a good alternative to maps.
-No more lonewolfing in insurgency. People have to work together as in real-life.
Disadvantages:
-Insurgents need a map too, seeing as they need to place grenade traps, mines, ambush tnt filled water plastic jug thingies, tnt/ied's. But like above, if insurgents actually join squads and team up with squad leader and communicate where mines should be on what location, then the game would be better. It's more so an Advantage than a disadvantage.
-Squad Leader's voice needs to be clearer and his directions precise, like 'Machine Gunner 100m NW 320 House'
-Squad Leader's role becomes more important, so he has to talk a little more than before.
-Could be somewhat hard-coded

A very obvious point. The original idea has evolved somewhat. You have to have a squad leader with some idea where friendlies are (squad mates, other squads). This will slow the pace of the game somewhat and put people who just want to roam around squadless to a disadvantage. I really dislike starting a squad and having them wander around and not following directions. Better to rely on everyone else in your squad and help complete objectives. Then watch the greifers and lololol's howl themselves blue in the face and eventually go play something else.

+1

People think that they NEED that kind of stuff just so they can play. No. You already have a gun, grenades, a medic, and an SL to tell you what's going to happen. It's the games that make you wade through a swamp of overlay this and that and here, have some red numbers flash in your face and some more shit on your screen that I can't stand. What was one of the first things that the PR team did? They got rid of all that shit on your screen. You never needed it.

[Arab]

A very obvious point. The original idea has evolved somewhat. You have to have a squad leader with some idea where friendlies are (squad mates, other squads). This will slow the pace of the game somewhat and put people who just want to roam around squadless to a disadvantage. I really dislike starting a squad and having them wander around and not following directions. Better to rely on everyone else in your squad and help complete objectives. Then watch the greifers and lololol's howl themselves blue in the face and eventually go play something else.

Only way to know is if it's included in the next update, maybe just hide all squad members and players except squad leaders, so that you can actually rely on sight rather than real-time map updates of people's positions.

Original Poster should setup a poll.

Example:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Poll
Would you like all squad members and people to be hidden from the map except the SL's (Squad Leaders) and Commander?

O Yes
O No
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Donatello]

Removing the map? Are you kidding me?

Should i sit in front of computer with pensil and paper to mark targets and frendlies?

Some people have gone too far with those "increasing teamplay" suggestions.

[Tartantyco]

Removing the map? Are you kidding me?

Should i sit in front of computer with pensil and paper to mark targets and frendlies?

Some people have gone too far with those "increasing teamplay" suggestions.

Maybe you should bother reading just a little bit of the thread?

[Tartantyco]

spawning on main spawning on a random place, it is exactly the same, it doesn't matter where you spawn as long as you can't communicate with your SL, if you spawn on main you will probably be more far away from you squad.

what you say is raight but it is not he point, as lheureux said, imagine being a medic you won't know where the guy is unless he speaks on local, or worst, imagine being the guys who needs medic, he won't be able to see where the medics are, unless he calls for medic, and he can only "call for medic" two times, I know you can right click on the give-up button to keep calling medic but most of the people don't know it.

Like I said before I find this idea interesting, and I like it but I don't want it to be implemented in the game. A lot of things needs to be changed for this system to work properlly, tactics, how you move through the map, it will practically like arma everyone together like a platoon going from flag to flag until they cap everything and the respawns should be removed to increase the value of the life of each player. I'm being exagerated but that's what I think that the mod might need, if all the players icons were removed from the minimap.

No, spawning at main is not spawning at a random place. It's the place where vehicles and chopper transport is. And if you need to sabotage an example to make it relevant(Not being able to communicate with SL) then you don't really have a point.

You can call for medic as much as you'd like, and if you can't guide your medic to you or the medic find you then you're incompetent, something that should not be rewarded.

You're just making up silly examples and situations that have really simply solutions or aren't actually problems at all.

[speedazz]

I don't think removing icons from a map is a good idea, because now in 1.0 beta you cant see player name above his head and I do see quite a lot teamkills, most of the times, when you go around some corner and you see someone right in front of you, you have to shoot or you have to take your time and identity your target and sometimes thats what get you killed and at long ranges its even harder to identify your targets. Lets say you see friendly and enemy squad fighting together at CQB from further away, how would you identify your targets correctly and quickly? Maybe some squad member try to flank around and gets shoot by friendlies, because he was in a wrong place at the wrong time?

[Gracler]

most of the times, when you go around some corner and you see someone right in front of you, you have to shoot or you have to take your time and identity your target and sometimes thats what get you killed

Now reverse your thinking and make yourself the enemy.

The enemy pause for a sec and you take him out because you already identified him as enemy by communication and a spotter earlier....

Lets say you see friendly and enemy squad fighting together at CQB from further away, how would you identify your targets correctly and quickly? Maybe some squad member try to flank around and gets shoot by friendlies, because he was in a wrong place at the wrong time?

Your the enemy fighting the squad at CQB and you can focus on the nearest enemy and the distant enemy's wouldn't take shot's at you with there iron sights or scoped rifles because they can't tell who is who. That is to your advantage.

btw the title of the thread is misleading people it seems:
Completely Removing the map with friendly positions for infantry
it should be:
Completely removing the friendly positions for infantry on the map.

[TheParadoX]

I am in favor for the map removal, or at least the removal of friendly units. Maybe only show squad leaders ?

[BroCop]

Now reverse your thinking and make yourself the enemy.

The enemy pause for a sec and you take him out because you already identified him as enemy by communication and a spotter earlier....


Your the enemy fighting the squad at CQB and you can focus on the nearest enemy and the distant enemy's wouldn't take shot's at you with there iron sights or scoped rifles because they can't tell who is who. That is to your advantage.

Aaand, then you wake up.

[Death!]

I even made a thread about those same suggestions before, but after experiencing the lack of friendly tags in 1.0, I don't know if I really support it anymore.

Playing as a medic, for example, in 1.0 without tags was really hard. I just could not see who was bleeding. Sometimes I had my entire squad looking at my face and one guy asking for healing. I was like "dude, fuck, I can't see who is hurt". Mumble was not really helping either as the 1.0's Mumble seemed to have a less precise local chat. I got kinda of lost sometimes too when I had my squad mixed out with another somewhere, I needed to check my map. Who are my squad mates? They got no tags!

But well, maybe it is just matter of communication and new procedures.