Al Basrah INS problems

[Bringerof_D]

This map needs an update. I'm sure cache locations and the general openness of the the map has been complained about before in previous versions. however now with the latest features it has become all the more problematic.

As i'm sure has been mentioned plenty of times before the amount of open ground vs the small cityscape allows the blufor team to essentially trap insurgents in the city with the use of their armour and other long range capable weapons. this was less a problem prior to 100p where there wasn't enough boots on the ground to keep the insurgents locked in, however now with more players on both teams, the insurgents are now locked in the city essentially fish in a barrel, while Blufor now has more men behind scoped rifles firing into the barrel from more angles.

- possible solution: enlarge the city, or break down the open spaces by having city like buildings in mid sized groupings beyond the city itself to facilitate insurgent ambush points, or remove challenger tank

bad cache locations in open ground or the village by the river. in previous versions there were only enough players to man the armour and then have one or two squads of 6 players assault those caches. what little defense the INS could pull together out at those caches could hold them off for a while. however now with 100 player servers, those caches are now under constant armour bombardment as soon as they become known whilst also having more infantry pushing through the location. For the INS team however having more men in the area does not help in it's defense and only equates to more people being blown up by the armor and giving away intel points.

- possible solution: make more of the buildings in river side village non destructible so as to provide better cover for defending insurgents, and remove all caches which spawn north of the river in territory that is 90% of the time being occupied by Blufor

there is currently no need for CSBs or even a fording site on Al Basrah, with a few only minor exceptions. the main river/stream separating the airbase and the city is too narrow. As i've done before on barracuda by mistake, if the banks are shallow enough vehicles can cross a river simply by running at it full speed. the forward momentum and the slowed decent in the Y axis upon hitting the water will often allow a player to "skip" their vehicle across the river if it's narrow enough. This is the case at most points on the separating river west of the VCP. The banks are currently steep enough however the sort of "bouncing" action gives the vehicle's wheels contact at a higher point where it is shallower allowing it to climb out.

- Solution: add a few meters in width to the river, the current steepness of the bank is enough so it wont have to be much.

[saamohod]

Played on Al Basrah yesterday as INS. Surprisingly we managed to win the round 20-0. Such a rare occurrence nowadays that the Insurgents win. I'm yet to participate in Al Basrah round v1.0 with winning Insurgents though; looking forward to it.

[Pronck]

With a good order of cache locations it is possible to win on this map. But then you also need at least 4 proper squads whom are communicating well, and that is a rare occasion. When 3 to 4 caches are positioned in the city / palace / island you make a chance of winning but when 2 are positioned in the village area you are basically f***ed.

Solutions to balance this more out are;

Making the city bigger, aka Al Basrah V3

Making the village more complicated with more indestructible buildings and maybe more cellars.

Lowering the amount of APCs and adding more Rovers with guns and Mk.19s instead.

In the .098 I already said this all but it got ignored and nothing got changed.

[samebutdifferent]

Yeah, Al Basrah v3 would be nice! Never played it but some people say its amazing...
The new cache north of the village sucks since the brits mostly build a firebase there.

[Nybble]

I agree.

Played as INS on Basrah last night. Before the first cache went down we were boxed into the city. The first cache spawned in one of the fenced off areas to the west of the city, and as INS we couldn't even get to the cache as it was so exposed. And blufor knew full well where it was but left it so they could kill us trying to defend it so they could get more intel.

[SterrUwe321]

All maps need an update.
The whole INS mode needs an update.
The unbalance has reached a new peak.

[KneeHiGh]

All maps need an update.
The whole INS mode needs an update.
The unbalance has reached a new peak.

+1

Tweak the kits I think. Bring back grenades and mines

[dtacs]

I don't think its going to be updated dude. I've posted about Basrah a number of times, primarily the issue with the 'land bridges'.

Two years later and they're still there.

I forgot who it was, but someone had a beautifully reworked Basrah out there, including the addition of new buildings, adding foliage to the desert outskirts and adding boats. There was an official developer response to it but unfortunately none of the positive changes were implemented in the next build.

[DesmoLocke]

Al Basrah v2 was run by a server that has since come and gone. I miss it. There was a longer view distance and it was sunnier.

[TeRR0R]

I once made that Al Basrah v2 map for some events at "The Battlearena" server (R.I.P.):

Al Basrah v2 released


But there was never any interest to merge something.

Anyway.
Like dtacs said, I would like to see the landbridges fixed.
These improved CSB's should be used more.

[Murphy]

First off CSB use on this map is really odd, a lot of times the first CSB will deploy into the water then deploying the second one is pretty sketchy. After you have two CSBs layed out across the smaller rivers driving across is again, fairly risky as you have to be in the right spot to get across the V (angle is only slightly less drastic then the letter).

That isn't really an issue if you know the map from previous versions as Dtacs has said, most of the water crossings can be done via the invisible land bridges that weren't properly removed.

To top it all off 1.0 has introduced even more Blufor love and once again has reduced INS capabilities, furthering the trend that has been a part of INS mode since the beginning. I shudder when most INS maps come on because the cumulative effect of all these updates has essentially made Insurgency maps shooting fish in a barrel. There are exceptions to the rule here, but those maps goes mostly unplayed (Dragon Fly/Iron Ridge ins are balanced pretty nicely) as maps like Archer and Karbala are still in demand.

This map offers some cool toys for Insurgents to **** around with but the assets available to Blufor are very overwhelming when we take terrain into consideration. With BUIS the INS team no longer rules the urban areas as they once did, and with the "recoil and deviation adjustments" British weapons have become superior to INS gear in every way.

[Lange]

Map is very outdated and has become even more apparent with the added gameplay changes over the years, the map was introduced very early in the mod correct me on the version but v.03 or something? It would be nice to have updated reworked ins maps to fit current PR and improve realism and gameplay but problem is people have to step up to the task to do it, and unless that happens not much can be done.

I thought a new map based on the actual Basrah providence to simulate a Iraq War engagement would be nice but would take a lot of work to make.

In the shortterm maybe a community map like Al Basrah v2 with some updates and changes could help out?

[Mikemonster]

Play the Infantry only layer (if it exists) and I think it'd be a fairly fair game.

Main problem at the moment is that the APC's just steam all over the map and close it down. Which is realistic, and I enjoy seeing them cover the Infantry as they advance (APC's on view distance shelling the **** out of everything as they did in 'Real Life').

It may be realistic but in real life the Insurgents got stomped as well!

I do think that the tank is redundant now, and doesn't fit in well at all with the other units (nor IMHO does the Scimitar). Much better just IFV's (Warriors) and infantry.


If the APC's are to be retained it'd be good to have some map changes I think, trenches, ruined defences, to provide a bit of solid cover near caches.


Although personally I think the Insurgents get an easy ride. The terrain on Basrah ISN'T flat. There is so much dead ground to use if you crouch or crawl. The lack of hills helps, as it reduces Blufor's view of you when you creep towards them.

Although most insurgents take the trusty AK and just sprint at the enemy, then complain about imbalance because they get shot a bit [facepalms].

[Solid Knight]

The real issue with the map is when a cache spawns anywhere outside of the city. If it spawns in the village, it cannot be defended as armor will just murder the entire area then infantry will move in close enough to kill all the spawns then it's pretty much game over for that cache.

[Lange]

If I can learn to map effectively in not too long I may work on making a whole new Basrah providence map and see if the community likes it.

[tankninja1]

I think the tank version is much easier. If you have good sappers the British can't cross that river that divides the map. Compare that with the Helicopter layout and the river becomes much less of an obstacle. The British can move at 100 times the speed and build fobs in different places that are much harder to access from land.

[Pronck]

I think the tank version is much easier. If you have good sappers the British can't cross that river that divides the map. Compare that with the Helicopter layout and the river becomes much less of an obstacle. The British can move at 100 times the speed and build fobs in different places that are much harder to access from land.

You clearly haven't played it in a while. With the landbridges being invisible but yet still intact they can cross almost every part of the river without the fear of drowning.