Assistant gunner kit

[Sleeper68]

I had thought of this but never tried suggesting it until now. One of the smaller problems I've come across in PR is the unavailability of ammo bags. While the Rifleman kit is the only kit that carries the ammo bag it usually doesn't survive first contact or is often wasted on other things. Countless times have I been playing as an AR, MG, RPG, Light/Heavy AT and asked a friendly Rifleman for ammo only to find out he used it half an hour ago so he could get a few extra mags after an engagement or to resupply someone else and countless times have I been that Rifleman in this situation.

This is where the Assistant Gunner comes into play. In essence he's just a Rifleman with more ammo bags. Instead of giving him all the same gear as the Rifleman with just extra ammo bags, he could possibly have things the rifleman doesn't have such as grenades and/or not have a mid-range optic and use irons/aimpoint. Now due to the fact that an Assistant Gunner is in fact a real life role in the military among MG and AT teams he could also have a pair of cheap binos. This being because of the fact that the real life counter parts not only carry extra ammo for the "gunner" but also help him with fire adjustments.

I would like to hear what everyone has to think about this. I feel this would be a subtle addition that'd make a sizable enough difference to make it a valuable kit to have in your squad should you be part of an MG/AT squad.

[Jacksonez__]

Would be useful for e.g mortar squad to have one assistant gunner kit. I support this if the kit is limited kit. Maybe give the kit two or three ammopacks.

[AfterDune]

I believe we have discussed the same thing in the team forums a while ago. While there are some good pros, there are also cons;

The kit will almost never be used where it's designed for. Most of the time this kit will just support AT guys, so they can fire multiple rockets, instead of 1 or 2. Or whatever else someone can do with it. It's always handy to have multiple ammobags, but in most cases, the guy holding this kit won't support the Support or MG guy. Perhaps incidentally.

If a Support or MG guy needs more ammo, he should probably get a dedicated Rifleman on his side that can supply him with that. Or if there's no dedicated Rifleman, he should get the SL to preserve the ammobag for the Support or MG guys. Communication is key in this case.

[ghostfool84]

Would be useful but its not needed i think. If your squad is organized the rifleman shouldnt be allowed to drop his ammo bag without asking the medic, mg, or AT before. Like AD pointed out, communication....

If your squad is not able to organize tasks like this, a "ammo guy" will not help that much.

[Rolling_Ruedo]

I think it would be great, alot of times I have been a rifleman who could not resupply a medic/AR/AT and I've also been an AR/medic stuck without ammo. I doubt it would be too fun of a role, but still an important one that I would gladly play.

[IWI-GALIL.556FA]

AD is right, it would just be used to resupply HAT and AT kits.

[Sleeper68]

Well that is what the intention is. I know first had that the SMAW system(USMC HAT) is used by a team consisting of a gunner and an "A" gunner, and I'm sure that other countries employ assistant gunners for their anti-tank weapon systems. Not only is this kit a help to such weapon teams but can also be great help to squads that have been cut off or need resupply when supply lines are down.

[SterrUwe321]

maybe just give the comon rifleman a 2nd ammobag?

[obpmgmua]

The only way I see this working if the Assistant Gunner's Ammo Bag only resupplies MG, AR, AT, AA & HAT Kits.

[Sleeper68]

If that's something they can code they I'd be perfectly fine with things working out that way.

[Gracler]

Running out of ammo may feel like a very annoying thing but it makes the ammo much more tactical. If you make a very limited kit carry more ammo it will just be used for HAT or AA like AD says.

Also to prevent the assistant gunner from having unlimited ammo you would have to limit the amount of ammo in an ammo-bag if that is even possible.

If you find yourself without any ammo it is either because you didn't plan ahead or the enemy is denying you resupply which is probably one of the only ways to take out a fortified location like a tunnel or bunker.

This kit is definitely not needed for mortars either since the rifleman is good enough for that.

I feel like BF2 PR needs a new fresh and useful kit though, but a "more ammo kit" is not it imo. Would be cool with a designated fire-team leader kit or something to support the SL with Binoculars and extra patches and make it more visible to the squad who is leading what.

This is where ARMA is awesome btw that you carry specific items that you can share if you want. To bad the rest of ARMA is kind of awkward and slow compared to BF2.

[Eddie Baker]

The only way I see this working if the Assistant Gunner's Ammo Bag only resupplies MG, AR, AT, AA & HAT Kits.

If that's something they can code they I'd be perfectly fine with things working out that way.

If it could have been coded that way we would have done it years ago because I made this exact suggestion on the DEV forums in 2004.

Rifleman pretty much was the "A-gunner" kit, but binoculars were rightfully removed from all but a few kits.

To be honest, I think you're better off suggesting this (and pretty much anything else) in the PR ARMA 3 or PR2 forums. This engine was on its last leg years ago and is now being pushed in a medical transport chair on a morphine drip.

[ComradeHX]

Assistant gunner would be fantastic.

Just about every country with infantry AT weapon employ them in AT teams of assistant gunner + gunner.

But only if code supports resupply for only AT.

[Gracler]

If it could have been coded that way we would have done it years ago because I made this exact suggestion on the DEV forums in 2004.

Rifleman pretty much was the "A-gunner" kit, but binoculars were rightfully removed from all but a few kits.

To be honest, I think you're better off suggesting this (and pretty much anything else) in the PR ARMA 3 or PR2 forums. This engine was on its last leg years ago and is now being pushed in a medical transport chair on a morphine drip.

One gotta admire your optimism Eddie , but yea BF2 is not the youngest kid on the block anymore, it won't be easy to transfer the magic PR BF2 has to a new game though. ARMA 2 proved that.

[camo]

How about the alternate/or standard rifleman gets an extra ammo bag but instead gets 1 less grenade?

[Brainlaag]

I don't understand why people want to make a already heavily biased class (HAT), even more unfair by providing it with near unlimited ammo.

As for the assistant, the rifleman should suffice. Glacier put it quite nicely, the limited ammo adds an additional tactical factor to the game (not that it matters much since every vehicle can poop down ammo boxes/crates).

[BroCop]

Guys, we had a 5 page discussion prior to 1.0 release. It was concluded that shit (role) doesnt need to be and cant be added as its already there. The situation is fine as it is.

[Jacksonez__]

I don't understand why people want to make a already heavily biased class (HAT), even more unfair by providing it with near unlimited ammo.

As for the assistant, the rifleman should suffice. Glacier put it quite nicely, the limited ammo adds an additional tactical factor to the game (not that it matters much since every vehicle can poop down ammo boxes/crates).

Would be easy fix.. one drop-able ammobox (the boxes which are carried by vehicles) = 1 HAT missile. It's ridiculous that one small ammobox (the one rifleman carries) can give 1 HAT missile / rearm 3 RPG rockets.

[matty1053]

I think this would just ruin PR's teamplay.

What would the point be of ammo crates from APC's and ****?


Pros...
Will give ammo to who ever.

Cons...
Will not be used right.
only the HAT and LAT kits will get the ammo.
No teamwork much.
Lone wolf would be increasing.

[HAAN4]

I think this would just ruin PR's teamplay.

What would the point be of ammo crates from APC's and ****?


Pros...
Will give ammo to who ever.

Cons...
Will not be used right.
only the HAT and LAT kits will get the ammo.
No teamwork much.
Lone wolf would be increasing.

how can be lone wolf increased when the suggestion is about kits that need two man teams
one gunner and other auxiliary gunner?

I Already suggested this before, and i am impressed that this suggestion is now be talked again. since all this time.

I don,t know if in real life Anti tank infantry walks in two man teams, one gunner and one auxiliary gunner, but i still favor the suggestion anyway.

i also stay in favor of the kit still have scope, since the second role of the Auxiliary Gunner is to protect the Anti tank infantry, and if possible protect it so well that the AT infantry men will be always whit the anti tank gun in hand. also smoke grenades will be need to do such role. yet i am in favor of no frag grenades,

the amount of this kits to be deployed in the same time, must be the same number of the of HAT kits and AA kits, if i am not wrong this will be four Auxiliary Gunner kits in each team.

sorry be my English and regards