Angry players and stress projection...

[Fir3w411]

That's some pretty cool background information there, thanks, I actually learnt a lot. But on another note, what is your point ?

My point is that it's extremely frustrating how an APC or CAS can just camp out a cache, while getting intel from all those kills, and there is very little you can do about it when there is (for example) an APC covering the one firing on the cache, as well as infantry too. That is what happened in what I said, they camped it out and gained 40 intel points 10 minutes into the game, nothing we could do because a super fob and another APC was covering the other.

What makes it worse is when this happens on factions where there can't be civis, Blufor can't lose those intel points they get.

[SGT.Ice]

Angry? Stop playing, it'll poison your game. Go do something else and come back or move servers.

I've been pissed off and I've probably pissed other people off, best thing is just to withdraw if you aren't enjoying yourself.

Server admins should be managing the clan distribution of their server, clans themselves have a responsibility to police themselves too. iGi used to ensure we were on the weaker team, often squad leading an entire team of pubbies to victory against our Bitter Russian clan rivals who tended to come to our server (I miss you guys ) we'd ensure we were spread onto both teams if no other clans were present.

If servers are not doing this, please post a constructive and polite post in their feedback sections so that they can address that issue.

Off Topic: Rudd I thought you were dead and no longer developing.

[Murphy]

We all know how frustrating it can be trying to save a cache that has all but been blown up. Sometimes the Blufor boys do what they're meant to and have all the firepower come crashing down upon a cache, including cooperation from APCs. This is the fundamental strategy employed by any Blufor team with heavier assets that is actually working towards the common objective. To complain about assets pounding a cache compound is to neglect the entire battle up to that point. The LAV didn't magically spawn with a line of sight on the cache, and the infantry getting 100s of kills (200 points in AAS is nothing to scoff at, and the intel gained from 100 kills will keep the intel going) didn't just spawn in cover while the enemy kept throwing 100 men towards their position.

The examples given seem fairly poor as they describe a forgone situation that was obviously lost by insurgents allowing the Blufor to have superior positioning, it's the key for an INS teams success. Hold the important ground and don't die needlessly, even if you don't lose tickets on death you still have to get back to the position that can control the cache/flag area. That is the truly frustrating aspect of playing on the INS team, having to fight back to your previously defensible position only to realize there is an APC/IFV waiting for you.

It's part of the whole concept of insurgency, if you want to play an INS round without heavy assets owning open and congested areas alike there are options (Korengal comes to mind as the CROWs is kinda useless most of the time, and all INS maps have INF layers). If you don't like being killed by big armoured vehicles of death and destruction stay in main or log out, coming to the forums to ask for a fundamental change in mechanics because you get angry when you die is poor sportsmanship and pretty sad.

[Fir3w411]

We all know how frustrating it can be trying to save a cache that has all but been blown up. Sometimes the Blufor boys do what they're meant to and have all the firepower come crashing down upon a cache, including cooperation from APCs. This is the fundamental strategy employed by any Blufor team with heavier assets that is actually working towards the common objective. To complain about assets pounding a cache compound is to neglect the entire battle up to that point. The LAV didn't magically spawn with a line of sight on the cache, and the infantry getting 100s of kills (200 points in AAS is nothing to scoff at, and the intel gained from 100 kills will keep the intel going) didn't just spawn in cover while the enemy kept throwing 100 men towards their position.

The examples given seem fairly poor as they describe a forgone situation that was obviously lost by insurgents allowing the Blufor to have superior positioning, it's the key for an INS teams success. Hold the important ground and don't die needlessly, even if you don't lose tickets on death you still have to get back to the position that can control the cache/flag area. That is the truly frustrating aspect of playing on the INS team, having to fight back to your previously defensible position only to realize there is an APC/IFV waiting for you.

It's part of the whole concept of insurgency, if you want to play an INS round without heavy assets owning open and congested areas alike there are options (Korengal comes to mind as the CROWs is kinda useless most of the time, and all INS maps have INF layers). If you don't like being killed by big armoured vehicles of death and destruction stay in main or log out, coming to the forums to ask for a fundamental change in mechanics because you get angry when you die is poor sportsmanship and pretty sad.

What part of 5 minutes into the round don't you people understand. How did we let them get the upper hand, when the round literally had just begun. All they did was drive two APC's and a logi, built a superfob and camped the cache with perfect line of sight on the cache from 500+ meters away.

Last time I checked, caches aren't supposed to be camped by an APC, unless of course, you are the one doing it...

[Portable.Cougar]

You sir just demonstrated the title of this thread.

On topic.

I normally SL. I find it to be a frustrating position at times.

To remedy this I have been changing roles every round.

SL, armor, SL, medic, SL, anything else.

I have found this to allow me less frustration and more enjoyment.

[Murphy]

Last time I checked, caches aren't supposed to be camped by an APC, unless of course, you are the one doing it...

Last time I checked caches getting camped by an APC means the INS team isn't using their AT properly. It's a failure of one team, not that the other is exploiting. That's the fundamental difference in the two schools of thought here. One faults the defenders for playing lax and not being prepared (INS do get to spawn on caches, you do realize this right?), the other faults the attackers for doing what they are supposed to especially considering they have the APC available for support.

[Danger_6]

Last time I checked, caches aren't supposed to be camped by an APC, unless of course, you are the one doing it...

????? According to whom? What should APCs do? Aren't they meant for fire support?

You need to reevaluate how you play this game.

Also, insurgents get mortars on 1kmaps<; and they should damn well use them. Problem is then solved with super fobs.

Murphy hit the nail on the head with his post.

This is the annoying thing with PR these days. People don't try and find tactics to counter their enemies. They just expect to run towards the enemy, without understanding the mechanics of the game, hoping for as many kills as possible. Then when that doesn't work they find it necessary to complain that the game needs to be changed for 'balance'.

Last I checked ins was all about asymmetrical warfare. This means you will never achieve such balances.

Use your brains guys. Sometimes the situation might be fubar, but these situations are rare. Most of the time people just don't take insurgency seriously.

[Cpt.Future]

I mean: are we in CoD now? Since when does the personal K/D count!?

But ... K/D is kinda important:
And I don't mean having a lot of kills, but having only a few deaths or no deaths at all is important.
A 0-8 K/D is usually a sign that you're doing something wrong and that you're wasting the tickets of your team.

[matty1053]

Last time I checked caches getting camped by an APC means the INS team isn't using their AT properly. It's a failure of one team, not that the other is exploiting. That's the fundamental difference in the two schools of thought here. One faults the defenders for playing lax and not being prepared (INS do get to spawn on caches, you do realize this right?), the other faults the attackers for doing what they are supposed to especially considering they have the APC available for support.

Agreed.

I have seen countless times of people taking AT kit and running right into a squad of enemies. So they wasted a valuable kit. People spawn on the cache, take kits and just screw up by not building assets.

[Jutsch]

But ... K/D is kinda important:
And I don't mean having a lot of kills, but having only a few deaths or no deaths at all is important.
A 0-8 K/D is usually a sign that you're doing something wrong and that you're wasting the tickets of your team.

I was definitely NOT the reason we lost!

[Danger_6]

KD is all about estimating whether you win the fight. I have the experience to look at the scoreboard and guess within 50 tickets or so the enemy's real ticket count.

Bad KD also shows you that you need to change your tactics. Good KD shows that you are dealing more damage to enemy then they are to you. You must also think about respawning. If you're getting kills that means you are disrupting the enemy from completing their objectives by preventing their movement to certain strategic points.

[Bringerof_D]

I suggest learning how to lead a squad if you're that dissatisfied. If you learn how to keep a squad together you can't really have a "bad" game because even if you get steamrolled, you'll still be teamworking and communicating, which I think is the most satisfying part of PR.

By the way, Psyrus, I've not sure if living in Japan is going to help your pessimism

Ironically one of the best experiences i've had in PR was screaming GRITs, or some other nonsensical directions there of, at each other as we were over run and steam rolled by literally EVERYTHING. Of course it's better when you win but if you communicate well and can really jive with your squad, losing can be pretty awesome too.

I recently crewed a tank with a very angry individual, i drove he gunned. He fired a shot at a Chinook, when it didnt explode he asked me if i saw him hit it, i said no then explained to him i didn't see the tank cannon fire nor the shell at all (I assume it was a bug because he insists that he fired a round) so the bird got away and he starts calling BS and all that. He subsequently misses his first shot at an APC and again asks me for my observation as the APC begins to scurry away. I saw the shot this time and told him he may have skimmed over top of it. he then starts spazzing out about how theres absolutely no way he missed because he's a great shot. I tell him to shut up and shoot again. he hits and thats that, the round ended shortly after.

Decent shots and Great shots all miss from time to time, the only difference is how quickly they pull themselves together to take the next shot.

[Fir3w411]

????? According to whom? What should APCs do? Aren't they meant for fire support?

You need to reevaluate how you play this game.

Also, insurgents get mortars on 1kmaps<; and they should damn well use them. Problem is then solved with super fobs.

Murphy hit the nail on the head with his post.

This is the annoying thing with PR these days. People don't try and find tactics to counter their enemies. They just expect to run towards the enemy, without understanding the mechanics of the game, hoping for as many kills as possible. Then when that doesn't work they find it necessary to complain that the game needs to be changed for 'balance'.

Last I checked ins was all about asymmetrical warfare. This means you will never achieve such balances.

Use your brains guys. Sometimes the situation might be fubar, but these situations are rare. Most of the time people just don't take insurgency seriously.

You people don't get it do you. How many times do I have to repeat my self before someone figures it out?

An APC is for fire support, but what I have already written out boldy and in plain English twice is that it shouldn't be OK for an apc to get 100 kills firing into the CACHE ROOM (the room which the cache lies in, where you spawn, where you pickup weapons to FIGHT the APC, yeah that one). It'd be better if you could spawn on multiple rooms of the building instead of one where the apc can camp you in, is one solution I think you people might understand

I'd add more which I have tons to say about, but it seems like this isn't something people think about or realise.

[Danger_6]

An APC is for fire support

And a couple of posts ago:

Last time I checked, caches aren't supposed to be camped by an APC

The hypocrisy is overwhelming...

Before you accuse others of not understanding please understand what you have written in the past and what you are writing in the present.

But to continue back to the previous discussion.

You're correct in saying that it's not 'OK' for an APC to get 100 kills camping a cache. And what I mean by that is, it's not 'OK' for the insurgents to allow that. The only reason that can happen is bad comms on a team, assuming you are speaking about them spawning on it.

You claim that people should use their brains, but why not implement that advice in game and simply communicate to prevent further spawns on a cache and an effective and expeditious counterattack on that apc from a different location?

[fatalsushi83]

My point is that it's extremely frustrating how an APC or CAS can just camp out a cache, while getting intel from all those kills, and there is very little you can do about it when there is (for example) an APC covering the one firing on the cache, as well as infantry too. That is what happened in what I said, they camped it out and gained 40 intel points 10 minutes into the game, nothing we could do because a super fob and another APC was covering the other.

What makes it worse is when this happens on factions where there can't be civis, Blufor can't lose those intel points they get.

Thankfully blufor won't be able to get intel with heavy assets like APCs in the next patch. Also, I get the frustration of getting spawn killed but keep in mind that insurgents still win most of the time as the devs have said before. Blufor may get the better toys but they still have a harder time winning.