CLOS SAM Systems

[potatochan]

Wow thats rude I just said you nag like an old man. But you probably didn't mean what you said

[Navo]

Wow everyone take a chill pill

Also Rhino, I always enjoy these long informative posts.

[solidfire93]

[Jacksonez__]

Does pilot get lock-on warning when that command-line-of-sight missile is approaching aircraft? Or will it be a "silent killer"? Should get lock on warning so pilots can make evasive maneuvers.

I just thought that it is impossible for CAS helicopter to avoid Starstreak missiles. You cant' really do "steep" movements with CAS helicopters without losing the control. And if you manage to pull some epic evasive trick moves, the approximity fuse will fuck you up anyways. So it's kind of GG.

With the current AA system, I think you could pop flares and pull hard right or left so the AA missile would explode on flares. My logic says you cannot evade that Starstreak missile since helicopters really are not that fast.

[Navo]

Does pilot get lock-on warning when that command-line-of-sight missile is approaching aircraft? Or will it be a "silent killer"? Should get lock on warning so pilots can make evasive maneuvers.

I just thought that it is impossible for CAS helicopter to avoid Starstreak missiles. You cant' really do "steep" movements with CAS helicopters without losing the control. And if you manage to pull some epic evasive trick moves, the approximity fuse will fuck you up anyways. So it's kind of GG.

With the current AA system, I think you could pop flares and pull hard right or left so the AA missile would explode on flares. My logic says you cannot evade that Starstreak missile since helicopters really are not that fast.

From my experience, the Stormer already killed it's target 75% of the time if you spammed all 8 missiles.

[Rhino]

Also Rhino, I always enjoy these long informative posts.

Cheers, was starting to wonder if anyone was reading these walls of text

I actually really like this system, I'm all for more skill based weapons. I just hope that it isn't so abundant that it's hard to make Trans runs.

Shooting choppers at long range, without any zoom anyways, is still going to be pretty tricky and the best tactic is probably to fly seriously low and as fast as possible as a chopper, using as much terrain cover as possible to give the AA as little time as possible to deploy the weapon, and shoot you if he gets eyes on. As well as trying to stay away from the front lines too will help

But ye, I must admit that I am worried for choppers on the Falklands. It was hard enough for them before with IR AA Missiles everywhere and all the jets about also taking the odd pot shots at them, but will have to wait and see what happens when we get a full server of people playing.

Does pilot get lock-on warning when that command-line-of-sight missile is approaching aircraft? Or will it be a "silent killer"? Should get lock on warning so pilots can make evasive maneuvers.

No they get no lock-on warnings at all.

The only thing we could possibly do is implement the same system the vBF2 tanks had, which is when ever an AT missile launcher, was aimed at them, they would get a lock on warning, like in this video at 25secs, but note in that video a missile from the LAV is never fired, its just the launcher pointing at them that gives them the warning. If we also did implement this into PR, aircraft wouldn't be able to tell the difference between if it is an IR missile being launched, or CLOS SAM aiming at them, so you would be using up your flares for nothing it if was a CLOS SAM, although that isn't that bad. The worst thing thou is that to get this system to work, we would most likely have to fully re-implement the "Being Locked" tone back into PR, to get the system above to work. Currently we only have the "You are Locked" tone, when a missile is fully locked on to you and is already in the air, where we have removed the "You are being locked" tone from vBF2, which means someone is trying to lock you, but hasn't got a lock yet, giving you a chance to deploy flares before they have fully got a lock and had a chance to fire off the missile before you have had a chance to start to deploy flares. If we re-implemented this, it would make it even easier than it already is to avoid IR Missiles, since the gunner would never be able to get a decent lock to even begin to fire his missiles, by the time you have managed to bug out or even kill him...

This is also not to forget that this system would be unrealistic since the Aircraft in the Falklands, didn't have anything that could detect the CLOS SAMs, and the Starstreak is designed to be a super-silent killer even to modern detenction systems, with the only one which would give out any signals would be the Tunguska, which is only used on one map and has SACLOS as a backup, and can already fire its guns without giving you a locked warning

If CLOS SAMs prove far too devastating then we might look into trying to implement a warning somehow but to do so, we would most likley have to sacrifice some other important gameplay aspect.

I just thought that it is impossible for CAS helicopter to avoid Starstreak missiles. You cant' really do "steep" movements with CAS helicopters without losing the control. And if you manage to pull some epic evasive trick moves, the approximity fuse will fuck you up anyways. So it's kind of GG.

With the current AA system, I think you could pop flares and pull hard right or left so the AA missile would explode on flares. My logic says you cannot evade that Starstreak missile since helicopters really are not that fast.

Well for a CAS chopper, your best bet is to get solid Intel from your team on where it is, and avoid that area until something on the ground has destroyed it

But I wouldn't say its impossible to avoid its missiles when its fired, but isn't going to be easier ye, the Stormer will have the upper hand, as AA should tbh

[Tit4Tat]

;2116118']
-snip-

IMO, another banned user/player (prob CAS user ) that didn't get his way or wasn't listened to by community which in turn made him have a "fued" with PR and the DEV team.




On topic, cant wait to try this cause as things stand its a lottery to hit CAS.

[W.Darwin]

Rhino, I like all the change implemented, the diversity of the gameplay is a major force in Project Reality! Thanks for the work on that its greatly appreciated.

Although, as time goes by and Anti-air defense systems get better, the supremacy of CAS on the field is decreasing. Maybe drop 20 min spawn to 15 minutes? Depending on how the game dynamic is affected by these new piece of armor.

[Rabbit]

I for one welcome our new CLOS overlords.

[c4ke]

Taking milsim to a whole 'nother level. Nicely done Rhino.

[blayas]

Great job Rhino, always waited for AA saclos material for PR, as ever the addition of realistic characteristics, or close to realistic for each device adds depth, dynamics and diversity to the game, one of PR's strengths !, can not wait to shoot down some CAS operators overconfident of their RWR's.

[X-Alt]

Nice nerf to the stormer no more two shotting BMPs. Anyways, this will neat to see in action, jets will have to be a little more cautious in the air. I'm getting ready to dunk on kids with rapid fire TOW HE ))))).

[PricelineNegotiator]

Great job Rhino, always waited for AA saclos material for PR, as ever the addition of realistic characteristics, or close to realistic for each device adds depth, dynamics and diversity to the game, one of PR's strengths !, can not wait to shoot down some CAS operators overconfident of their RWR's.

Well if we are going to make AA more accurate, time to make CAS more accurate and give separate warnings when are being locked onto, and when we are locked. It's only realistic.

[mries]

Awesome! Really looking forward to it. Also thanks for the side information posted Rhino!

What I was wondering? Are there more than 2 AA kits available on the Falklandmaps? Because the Blowpipes are technically more worse than the normal stinger/igla.

[crazygamelover]

>looks through comments for answer to a question
>absolute shit storm
>gonna ask question so I don't have to read anymore

Will the Tigercat be deployable? The dirt mound gives the impression that it will be.
Also, great work! Very cool stuff and I can't wait to read the allchat when these are implemented XD

[Raklodder]

Now I'm hyped for v1.4.

[Rhino]

Nice nerf to the stormer no more two shotting BMPs.

Stormer will still do same amount of damage to vehicles as it does currently, just in the video two of the 4 missiles missed the target

Awesome! Really looking forward to it. Also thanks for the side information posted Rhino!

What I was wondering? Are there more than 2 AA kits available on the Falklandmaps? Because the Blowpipes are technically more worse than the normal stinger/igla.

Well firstly, currently the Blowpipe has two shots compared to the normal one that MANPADS have ingame, which is mainly so players are more willing to take shots at the hard targets than just saving them for the super easy shots, as well as them having many more air targets to engage, and also so they can see the reload animation hehe

But on top of this, from the original Blowpipe Highlight here: https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f196-p ... npipe.html
[quote=""'[R-DEV"]Rhino;2000306']The Blowpipe wasn't the only MANPADS used during the Falklands War however. The British SAS did deploy the FIM-92 Stinger and the Argentinians the SA-7 Grail, but both in very small numbers and they weren't used much during the war. However because of this and to also give the aircraft a bit more of a hard time each team will be getting a pickup kit of each on all the layers of the Falklands with jets on, to go on top of the normal AA, Blowpipe kits

[/quote]

[quote="crazygamelover""]>looks through comments for answer to a question
>absolute shit storm
>gonna ask question so I don't have to read anymore

Will the Tigercat be deployable? The dirt mound gives the impression that it will be.
Also, great work! Very cool stuff and I can't wait to read the allchat when these are implemented XD[/quote]

Now I'm hyped for v1.4.

[Firepower01]

I asked this before when the Blowpipe was announced with the original Falklands release but... Will Canada or the UK in modern PR be using the Blowpipe? The most recent MANPAD Canada has purchased was the Javelin which is quite similar to the Blowpipe so it would make sense, and before the Javelin they used the Blowpipe.

[Rhino]

Canada retired off the last of their Javelin MANPADS in the 1990s, although granted, without replacement. It could be argued that they may take some out of retirement, like they attempted to do with the Blowpipe for the 1991 Gulf war (but 9/27 missiles tested misfired in some way due to age so they didn't use them). But tbh it is probably more likely that they would quickly buy up some brand new Stingers since the training for them is far easier on short notice, and they are more readily available, if a situation called for it.

As for the UK, Stinger is used in small numbers within the British Armed Forces so still best MANPADS for them, at least until a Starstreak MANPADS can be made but from what I've seen, Stinger seems to be even more common than the handheld version of the Starstreak

[Firepower01]

Canada retired off the last of their Javelin MANPADS in the 1990s, although granted, without replacement. It could be argued that they may take some out of retirement, like they attempted to do with the Blowpipe for the 1991 Gulf war (but 9/27 missiles tested misfired in some way due to age so they didn't use them). But tbh it is probably more likely that they would quickly buy up some brand new Stingers since the training for them is far easier on short notice, and they are more readily available, if a situation called for it.

As for the UK, Stinger is used in small numbers within the British Armed Forces so still best MANPADS for them, at least until a Starstreak MANPADS can be made but from what I've seen, Stinger seems to be even more common than the handheld version of the Starstreak

Maybe include the Blowpipe as an alternate AA kit for the Canadians then? It just looks like it'd be a hell of a lot of fun to use and I'd hate to see it restricted to use only on the Falklands minimod. Regardless it looks like you guys did a great job and I look forward to using it!