Air supremacy fighters

[DogACTUAL]

Whats the deal with the ASF jets, particularly the russian MIG 29 ASF.?

Compare them to the normal MIG 29 or the russian SU 27 and they have no advantage in dogfights whatsoever.
They have the same amount of air to air missiles, but lack bombs (since it is ASF of course),
and can not display any lases on the HUD.

What i mean is since they are not made for air to ground combat they should have a distinctive advantage in dogfights over normal jets, for example better turn radius, higher speed or more air to air missiles (i did not notice any of that).

Maybe you could add two more close range missiles (if the engine allows it)?

[Rhino]

Firstly FYI, its Air Superiority Fighter, which is a type of fighter aircraft designed (or in our case, loaded out at least) for entering and seizing control of enemy airspace as a means of establishing complete dominance of one side's air forces over the other side's (air supremacy). Once Air Supremacy has been achieved, there is no real need for Air Superiority Fighters, other than to keep control encase the enemy somehow tries to launch new planes into it.

There are three levels of control of the air:

1. Air Supremacy is the highest level, where a side holds complete control of the skies.
2. Air Superiority is the second level, where a side is in a more favourable position than the opponent. It is defined in the NATO glossary as the "degree of dominance in [an] air battle ... that permits the conduct of operations by [one side] and its related land, sea and air forces at a given time and place without prohibitive interference by opposing air forces."
3. Air Parity is the lowest level of control, where a side only holds control of skies above friendly troop positions.

Now that's out of the way, the MiG-29 does have the same amount of missiles as the normal one, just without bombs, but iirc, its only used on Op Soul Rebel, and this load-out was chosen because its only up against Harriers, and giving it more missiles would give it a bigger advantage than it already had over the Harrier. It is also worth noting that map dose not have any other Mig-29s on it, only MiG-21s with only SRAAMs.

The Su-27 on the other hand has 2 more AMRAAMs over the normal version, with bombs, which is more or less the same case with the other ASF loadouts ingame, with the exception of the MiG-29, for the reasons above.

Cheers.

[X-Alt]

The Russian MiG-29 has a broken flight model.

Like legit it needs an immediate change.

[Danesh_italiano]

but iirc, its only used on Op Soul Rebel

Op Soul Rebel and Hades Peak. Or... no more mif29 asf on 1.4 ?!?!?!

[DogACTUAL]

Thanks for the answer.

I know what the purpose of the ASF is, that it is not meant for ground strikes (my argument was formulated a little bit confusing), what i meant is that there are other maps where the MIG 29 ASF is deployed where it is facing jets with the same amount of aa missiles but with the added bonus of being a multirole fighter with bombs and the capability of displaying lases on the hud.

Thats why i was arguing for the ASF to get more aa missiles, to have a distinctive advantage in air to air over the enemy jet, since it has no bombs leaving two additional hardpoints.

Also the russian MIG 29 isn't that good, the eurofighter has nearly the same turn radius in my experience.
And everytime i was up against the MIG 29 ASF in a british harrier i managed to outturn it easily (lower airspeed means more time to turn since the faster enemy jet will overshoot the harrier).

Of course the MEC MIG 29 has a much better turn radius than the russian one, only being surpassed by the F15 strike eagle.

So in my opinion right now the MIG 29 ASF against the eurofighter has no advantage (other than maybe a slightly higher turn speed), i think two more close range missiles or higher turn speed would give the ASF designation more meaning in this case.

[LiamBai]

The Russian MiG-29 has a broken flight model.

Like legit it needs an immediate change.

Aside from the turn speed not being to your liking, what about it is broken?

[Frontliner]

To my knowledge groho is working on a renewed jet physics model so there's hope changes will appear in due time. I'm hoping ASFs and the Jets fitted with AA-missiles only get a better turn rate than IDS'. Currently it's a strange mish-mash.

[rPoXoTauJIo]

I'm lazy fuck, so things might get broken even more, dont hope

[FFG]

I mean, A mig 29's a mig 29. They should really have the same turn rate.

Aside from the turn speed not being to your liking, what about it is broken?

[LiamBai]

I mean, A mig 29's a mig 29. They should really have the same turn rate.

Hard to disagree with that, but that doesn't mean the "flight model" is "broken".
IMO the MEC mig29 is the one that needs to get 'fixed' rather than the other way around.

[X-Alt]

Hard to disagree with that, but that doesn't mean the "flight model" is "broken".
IMO the MEC mig29 is the one that needs to get 'fixed' rather than the other way around.

>supermaneuverable fighter
>lighter load than Su
>unstable
>F-15

nice try tho

[Rhino]

I mean, A mig 29's a mig 29. They should really have the same turn rate.

Ye, its a bug that has already been fixed.

[FFG]

Hard to disagree with that, but that doesn't mean the "flight model" is "broken".
IMO the MEC mig29 is the one that needs to get 'fixed' rather than the other way around.

I don't think its broken, I was just saying that they should have the same flight model.

[LiamBai]

MEC one should be worse since it has bombs on, and bombs only improve turning in one direction.

[Roque_THE_GAMER]

MEC one should be worse since it has bombs on, and bombs only improve turning in one direction.

does that mean if they trow out their bombs they will turn better and all other jets will have this feature as well? otherwise is a step back, just let the jets flying at their best (no bomb loads or any other extra load)

also is suppose the SU-27 fly that bad? really its feels like a bomber, even the Tornado do better, at least give the Russians in silent eagle a mig-29, the tornado and Typhoon can out turn they quite easy.

[Gerfand]

does that mean if they trow out their bombs they will turn better and all other jets will have this feature as well? otherwise is a step back, just let the jets flying at their best (no bomb loads or any other extra load)

also is suppose the SU-27 fly that bad? really its feels like a bomber, even the Tornado do better, at least give the Russians in silent eagle a mig-29, the tornado and Typhoon can out turn they quite easy.

IRL, The SU-27 is one of the best fighters in turning, what can be evidenced by the COBRA manouver, that only the SU-27, MIG-29, and F-22, F-18 and the Saab 35 Draken??? can do that
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pugachev's_Cobra
Also, Russian Jets are better than Western Jets in the case of manoeuvre and some other things...

but lack Digital cockpits

EDIT this manoeuvre is achived by the thrust vectoring

[FFG]

isnt the su34 a dual seater su27?

[rPoXoTauJIo]

Lol no
It's just built using design of su27.
Su30 on other hand being produced from two-seater training version of su27.

[X-Alt]

IRL, The SU-27 is one of the best fighters in turning, what can be evidenced by the COBRA manouver, that only the SU-27, MIG-29, and F-22, F-18 and the Saab 35 Draken??? can do that
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pugachev's_Cobra
Also, Russian Jets are better than Western Jets in the case of manoeuvre and some other things...

but lack Digital cockpits

EDIT this manoeuvre is achived by the thrust vectoring

An F-15 will still keep with an Su, and has a much better radar, but that means nothing in PR.

[Gerfand]

isnt the su34 a dual seater su27?

Yes but there differences, the SU-34 is a dual seater, but the Seats side by side, while the SU-30 is like the F-18F