You shouldn't. I think you raised some interesting points, especially when you showed that helicopters and jets use different flares with different settings,which explains why they behave differently and also dispels the narrative certain people have been pushing, namely claiming flares on helicopters are exactly the same as on jets.
All i did was critizise some of the stuff you said because it was misinformed imo.
State of AA
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DogACTUAL
- Posts: 879
- Joined: 2016-05-21 01:13
Re: State of AA
Not only did the DEVs totally throw off the CAS/AA balance and make TOWs useless against tanks, no that was not enough. They also had to introduce their most controversial change yet, a 16 character limit on player names.
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''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
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''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
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agus92
- Posts: 280
- Joined: 2016-01-03 11:11
Re: State of AA
Just to clarify (and I know what I'm talking about);
The missile AA's on Falklands, Blowpipe and Tigercat, have Command operated guidance, as opposite to "fire and forget", which is what all the other missikes in PR use.
Active/passive guidance doesn't refer to wether or not the missile has to be guided by an operator, but rather if the signal they are picking to detect the target is created by the target itself (heat signature) or the target requires illumination (radar on attacker plane bounces radar waves that are detected by missile).
I don't want to derail, but IMO it's an important clarification.
The missile AA's on Falklands, Blowpipe and Tigercat, have Command operated guidance, as opposite to "fire and forget", which is what all the other missikes in PR use.
Active/passive guidance doesn't refer to wether or not the missile has to be guided by an operator, but rather if the signal they are picking to detect the target is created by the target itself (heat signature) or the target requires illumination (radar on attacker plane bounces radar waves that are detected by missile).
I don't want to derail, but IMO it's an important clarification.
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lakinen
- Posts: 215
- Joined: 2016-12-03 15:24
Re: State of AA
There's no real flame on your screen, it's just magic. 
Last edited by lakinen on 2019-07-04 15:13, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Deleting
Reason: Deleting
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DogACTUAL
- Posts: 879
- Joined: 2016-05-21 01:13
Re: State of AA
Hey, the lines of 'code' you pulled from the PR files look very interesting. Can you please do everyone interested in this a favour and try to pull all the relevant information, to try and understand how it works exactly and what parameters are responsible how the missile behaves and how those parameters can be changed?
It would shine a big light on a lot of stuff we really need to understand to make a judgement about the AA situation.
It would shine a big light on a lot of stuff we really need to understand to make a judgement about the AA situation.
Not only did the DEVs totally throw off the CAS/AA balance and make TOWs useless against tanks, no that was not enough. They also had to introduce their most controversial change yet, a 16 character limit on player names.
------------------
''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
------------------
''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
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AlonTavor
- PR:BF2 Developer
- Posts: 2991
- Joined: 2009-08-10 18:58
Re: State of AA
IIRC "Unique" are operator guided. "heatseeking" are the non-operator-guided that lock.
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agus92
- Posts: 280
- Joined: 2016-01-03 11:11
Re: State of AA
Checking the missile codes is nice to know how they work, but if flares and missiles work with choppers, the problem must be with the planes (assuming flares are unchanged in both planes and choppers).
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lakinen
- Posts: 215
- Joined: 2016-12-03 15:24
Re: State of AA
There's no real flame on your screen, it's just magic.
Last edited by lakinen on 2019-07-04 15:13, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Deleting
Reason: Deleting
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DogACTUAL
- Posts: 879
- Joined: 2016-05-21 01:13
Re: State of AA
Again, thank you for the information. Would be really cool to see anti radiation missiles ingame!
I still don't understand this:
DEV says the issue became noticeable after substantially increasing the 'tick rate' of the missile checking for a nearby target to explode on, that before this the missile would just fly past the aircraft without exploding in many instances. And that for some unknown reason flares work better on helicopters than on jets and it is all because of vanilla code being shit.
But here is the thing. Right after the 'tick rate' change, i remember helicopters having the exact same problem as the jets, missiles locking flares just going straight for the helicopter ignoring flares. There were even posts about it with gifs showing this.
Then another update came out and suddenly helicopter flares worked as they do now, pretty reasonable with a good chance of attracting and stopping the missile! Though if i remember correctly the changelog made no mention of this change, yet it was very noticeable when flying helicopters and testing flares.
So what was done there that made the flares on helicopters work better and why can't it be done for jets as well?
Considering that helicopters had the exact same issues as jets do now, why not?
I still don't understand this:
DEV says the issue became noticeable after substantially increasing the 'tick rate' of the missile checking for a nearby target to explode on, that before this the missile would just fly past the aircraft without exploding in many instances. And that for some unknown reason flares work better on helicopters than on jets and it is all because of vanilla code being shit.
But here is the thing. Right after the 'tick rate' change, i remember helicopters having the exact same problem as the jets, missiles locking flares just going straight for the helicopter ignoring flares. There were even posts about it with gifs showing this.
Then another update came out and suddenly helicopter flares worked as they do now, pretty reasonable with a good chance of attracting and stopping the missile! Though if i remember correctly the changelog made no mention of this change, yet it was very noticeable when flying helicopters and testing flares.
So what was done there that made the flares on helicopters work better and why can't it be done for jets as well?
Considering that helicopters had the exact same issues as jets do now, why not?
Not only did the DEVs totally throw off the CAS/AA balance and make TOWs useless against tanks, no that was not enough. They also had to introduce their most controversial change yet, a 16 character limit on player names.
------------------
''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
------------------
''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
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DogACTUAL
- Posts: 879
- Joined: 2016-05-21 01:13
Re: State of AA
So anyone working on dis?
Not only did the DEVs totally throw off the CAS/AA balance and make TOWs useless against tanks, no that was not enough. They also had to introduce their most controversial change yet, a 16 character limit on player names.
------------------
''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
------------------
''Mats literally does not give a single fuck what you, me or everybody else thinks the game should be like. He doesn't care if you, me or everybody else plays the game even.'' - Frontliner
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AlonTavor
- PR:BF2 Developer
- Posts: 2991
- Joined: 2009-08-10 18:58
Re: State of AA
That's not what I remember, they just had a huge explosion radius and hitting the flares always killed the heli.i remember helicopters having the exact same problem as the jets, missiles locking flares just going straight for the helicopter ignoring flares
I have no idea why they almost never go for Jet flares, don't have much man power to look into it right with most BF2-script people working on WW2.
Only difference between heli flares and jet flares are drag and gravity modifiers. I'll try to look into these eventually, maybe they fuck up something in DICE's code.
Last edited by AlonTavor on 2018-08-09 15:05, edited 1 time in total.
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FLAP_BRBGOING2MOON
- Posts: 166
- Joined: 2011-02-20 20:56
Re: State of AA
the absolute state of pr right now lmaoAlonTavor wrote:don't have much man power to look into it right with most BF2-script people working on WW2.
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anantdeathhawk
- Posts: 641
- Joined: 2015-11-12 21:11
must be great for PR:WW2.-
lakinen
- Posts: 215
- Joined: 2016-12-03 15:24
Re: State of AA
Note:
I only tried this with BOT player,shooting them,not with people playing.
I only tried this with BOT player,shooting them,not with people playing.
Last edited by lakinen on 2019-07-04 15:12, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Deleting
Reason: Deleting
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lakinen
- Posts: 215
- Joined: 2016-12-03 15:24
Re: State of AA
Note:
I only tried this with BOT player,shooting them,not with people playing. And I'm not a lover of CAS driving.
I only tried this with BOT player,shooting them,not with people playing. And I'm not a lover of CAS driving.
Last edited by lakinen on 2019-07-04 15:12, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Deleting
Reason: Deleting
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lakinen
- Posts: 215
- Joined: 2016-12-03 15:24
Re: State of AA
Last edited by lakinen on 2019-07-04 15:13, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Deleting
Reason: Deleting
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SCAR-H
- Posts: 20
- Joined: 2017-07-10 05:19
Re: State of AA
WHERE THE DEVSlakinen wrote:Videos of test:
plane flare orginal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dg9YdCDAPQ
helicopter flare orginal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWc_jUYARvQ
And something I'm doing for a while,putting smoke into the tail small rockets.To get on the dynamics of the game,so if people like or DEV, can be inserted into the game.I'm still testing about the size of the cloud,colors and the length of the tail.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzgRuv42W7Q
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AlonTavor
- PR:BF2 Developer
- Posts: 2991
- Joined: 2009-08-10 18:58
Re: State of AA
WHERE THE ENGINE SOURCE CODESCAR-H wrote:WHERE THE DEVS
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winject
- Posts: 38
- Joined: 2017-12-25 10:22
Re: State of AA
Revert AA to 0.98 with the current assembly and it's all going to be fine.AlonTavor wrote:WHERE THE ENGINE SOURCE CODE
I bet nobody is even looking to fix the anti-air logic anymore and I'm tired of researching in vain.
This isn't addressed specifically to you Alon, but if the tester team wasn't such a closed group to priviledged dev friends we might have fixed this issue a long time ago.
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WeeD-KilleR
- Posts: 792
- Joined: 2009-11-01 13:32
Re: State of AA
https://www.realitymod.com/forum/testers.phpwinject wrote:Revert AA to 0.98 with the current assembly and it's all going to be fine.
I bet nobody is even looking to fix the anti-air logic anymore and I'm tired of researching in vain.
This isn't addressed specifically to you Alon, but if the tester team wasn't such a closed group to priviledged dev friends we might have fixed this issue a long time ago.
