We Need More Servers

[Joovy]

Is giving your kids admin rights so they can do father son bonding admin abuse and bully other players against the terms of service ? Look at the HOG forums its all in the open.

An unknown fact about HOG is they do give their kids admin rights. Not just one or two, multiple admins on HOG also admin with there sons/family.

So if you have a dispute with one of them your signing up for the son/father admin abuse, which always leads to them bullying you and banning you from the server. Its sad that they do this bullshit there. Family bonding through admin abuse/bullying what a joke. Its not even "Project Reality" anymore its "HOG Reality" because they ban whoever they want from the game if they dont like them. Its not even about rule breaking anymore just constant personality conflicts.

The truth needs to finally come to light about HOG and if you silence it, it will only get worse.

[FFG]

- snip -

If you feel that a servers actions go against the Server License Agreement, Feel free to PM Mats, Mineral,
Nate, or myself with evidence of them doing so.

[Tommygun]

I'd like to see 1 regular EU server just for ping (& variety). Brazil & U.S. is sorted! That said there is expense and its no mean feat to host a server, seed it and admin it well. You need a number of admins to be effective and be online when ppl are playing and they need to be mature enough to deal with all sorts without getting overly emotional.
All that said, I've been playing a while and never ever gotten banned on any servers but Im a grunt, not an asset whore and I suspect thats where most arguments occur.
Kudos to anyone who keeps a server up, keep on keeping them up.
p.s. Just a thought, there are a lot of CO-op servers, could an EU one not do standard play again at times?

[Tommygun]

I had a thought...1 server is good because its generally full. How about HOG & and EU server coordinate times so they both run like 12 hours/14 hrs each during the main play time for that time zone, 12pm noon till say 2am? Then server admins wont need to spend all day on line trying to get seeding going ans server admins will also know in adveance what their active times will be and can plan accordingly. That way US & EU servers get the benefit of best pings during their major play time AND we have a server up and well admin'd 24 hrs. Just a thought, I was thinking this is more of a community than a competitive thing and it might be good for both servers...

[Brotherscompany]

Just a thought, I was thinking this is more of a community than a compettative thing and it might be good for both servers...

I remember you name from a long time ago and I also know you have been away for quite some time

We had that exact thing happening a couple of months ago.
Gamma Group (which doesnt exist anymore) and FCV (which doesnt exist anymore as well) were stopping the server for each other at agreed time to cover both timezones and shared the same pool of Admins if they wished to help the other server, it worked quite well for a few months.

But then the attacks started and it wasnt possible to maintain server up so its HOG 24/7. lt all comes down to will in cooperating rather than competing but thats up to each owner to decide.

[Joovy]

As the HOG admin abuse's keep adding up and new threads are made (Here and on HOG Forums), I want to point out R-Dev Nate's response to admin abuse on HOG from a recent thread.

R-Dev Nate : "If you have an issue with a specific admin and incident on HOG, go to their forums and make a post, I'm sure HOG Lead admins will take a look, as far as I know they don't like it when Admins micromanage gameplay like that"

That is your response to admin abusing players for building a FOB where they did not want it ?


That is the problem, when the R-Devs see's the admin abuse and does nothing about it at all or fakes like they care and re directs you to HOG forums where you will be treated like trash. R-Devs need to undertstand that HOG bans for what ever fucken reason they want. It doesnt have to be in the rules, it could be the way you talk or even just the way you play the game or like the above Incident "building a FOB where the admin does not want it)

It is clear that you are willing to sacrafice a fair PR gameplay experience and let admin abuse go unnoticed in order to keep the game alive. While letting HOG do whatever the fuck they want. Like I said before change the name to "HOG Reality" and warn new players when they download the game what they are about to experience.

Look on HOG forums right now, they have multiple threads open where an admin banned players for killing them. What a joke, you can only silence the truth for so long.

[Mineral]

rant

We are volunteering developers of this mod, we don't run servers.

Please show which other games or mods with dedicated servers that even have a system such as we do with server licensing. This is already much further than most games go in terms of managing servers and the admins that run them. 99% of game developers don't interfere at all with dedicated servers and how they are run. And that is for a very good reason.

We indeed rarely interfere with servers and how they operate. That is by design. We don't pay for their servers, run the day to day operations of server management or admin a 100 player server every day. We don't want to do that. We aren't good at it. We want to mod the game.

The license only exist for extreme cases of abuse of the software we provide or in long term bad management of servers. If we shut down a server each time for an admin making a mistake, good luck finding people willing to run servers long term. There wouldn't be any servers to speak of today and PR would have died a decade ago. That would be actual abuse on our part.

However, what we do have, is a relationship with server owners. And that is what we focus on. Having conversations with them to help them, for them to help us, and to sort out any problems. And yes we do talk about admins showing abusive behaviour as well.

Developers interfering with server operation is always a bad idea, hence we limit our interference. If you don't like that, play on another server, start your own, or go to another recent game where you press a matchmaking button and don't need to deal with admins.

HOG has been the only consistent server for years with a steady population, must be doing something right I guess? But I'm probably just silencing some truth.

Now back on topic on 'we need more servers' or whatever that means. Your personal hatred for existing servers shouldn't be part of that discussion.

[Talon-OneOne]

This whole thing sounds like you are complaining about a server that is successful that we all can play on without some idiot teamkilling wasting assets ect...

[CAS_ual_TY]

People complaining about HOG: Some-%
People complaining about HOG and helping to seed other servers: <1%

Kinda weird isnt it. Apparently playing on HOG isnt a big enough issue to change, but big enough to expect change from others

[UncleSmek]

We are volunteering developers of this mod, we don't run servers.

Please show which other games or mods with dedicated servers that even have a system such as we do with server licensing. This is already much further than most games go in terms of managing servers and the admins that run them. 99% of game developers don't interfere at all with dedicated servers and how they are run. And that is for a very good reason.

We indeed rarely interfere with servers and how they operate. That is by design. We don't pay for their servers, run the day to day operations of server management or admin a 100 player server every day. We don't want to do that. We aren't good at it. We want to mod the game.

The license only exist for extreme cases of abuse of the software we provide or in long term bad management of servers. If we shut down a server each time for an admin making a mistake, good luck finding people willing to run servers long term. There wouldn't be any servers to speak of today and PR would have died a decade ago. That would be actual abuse on our part.

However, what we do have, is a relationship with server owners. And that is what we focus on. Having conversations with them to help them, for them to help us, and to sort out any problems. And yes we do talk about admins showing abusive behaviour as well.

Developers interfering with server operation is always a bad idea, hence we limit our interference. If you don't like that, play on another server, start your own, or go to another recent game where you press a matchmaking button and don't need to deal with admins.

HOG has been the only consistent server for years with a steady population, must be doing something right I guess? But I'm probably just silencing some truth.

Now back on topic on 'we need more servers' or whatever that means. Your personal hatred for existing servers shouldn't be part of that discussion.

Why are you even modding a game nobody enjoys due to one defunct NA server having monopoly?

[Coalz101]

Why are you even modding a game nobody enjoys due to one defunct NA server having monopoly?

The Monopoly server that has been active for more than 10 years. I mean they are doing something right no doubt about that (Server management wise). But their administration still has the mindset that the player base now is still the same player base 10 years ago and its not. The server rules needs a reform to compensate for the change the player base (I'm aware they are not obligated to nor will they even consider it) when last has HOG rules changed? I'm sure they haven't. They're also the only server that has a map specific rule which confuses the shit out of people. Many times people mix up Muttrah only rules for general rules and its annoying.

A question for the devs:
"We hold you accountable and responsible for the actions of said administrative staff on your server and services. If a player appeals any action taken against them, you will deal with their appeal in a fair manner and within a reasonable time-frame. You will provide the services and/or tools to allow them this appeal. You and your administrative staff may not discriminate against players belonging to particular groups of people."
This is straight from the license agreement, does this include reporting of administrator behaviour? Because I'm sure if you go to the HOG forums right now most, if not all, the reports against specific admins are unanswered. In addition, HOG does have a lot of racist admins, I would call names but I have no physical (Audio recordings or videos) proof of this so I'll keep it confidential at the moment. You will notice a lot of racism and discrimination coming from the general players as well when it comes to maps where ARF are concerned as well. Does this warrant DEV action or not?

Just some personal feedback:
I'm sure that I'm not the only one who hates 10 minute boring PR rounds because of the no rush rule. It wastes my time, If I wanted to just have 10 minute rounds they are many other things I could of done.

[Kila021]

Hello i play this game for almost 3 years i know im (new) still back in years i play all the time with more then 10 my close friends and we all stop becuse hog is ONLY server where you can play ( i dont include Russian Reality for few reasons) Admins there abuse players all the time they destroying PR they ban people for everything for fucking anything today i see guy is ban bcs he say ( only muttrah niBBas <3 ) imagine ban somone for that thez abuse me like several times bcs im from Serbia one time some guy squerl or smth like that he ban me bcs i speak on my fucking launge if zou want to have new players make server without any dude who been admin on hog if you want to people play game or one day only few people is going to play on hog and some Russians on their server and what about us others ??? i dont play game bcs we dont have server where we can play admins on hog please developers do shit 2 years i read forum and people fucking crying and asking for help and you give us new updates fuck that frist make fucking server where we can expirence game not to play on russian reality where idk what they speak or brazzil server please developers make new servers or idk make to be free to open server

[Kila021]

Guys to be honest i think PR developers dont give fuck about us and about normal players people saying how hog is bad for years now and admins dont want to make free seerver noo i need licence to have server i think developers make game for themselfs to play and to be honest they dont give a single fuck to others they dont give fuck bcs PR have maybe 300 active players bcs hog is only playeble server (sorry for english im angry and sad)

[dcm]

Guys to be honest i think PR developers dont give fuck about us and about normal players people saying how hog is bad for years now and admins dont want to make free seerver noo i need licence to have server i think developers make game for themselfs to play and to be honest they dont give a single fuck to others they dont give fuck bcs PR have maybe 300 active players bcs hog is only playeble server (sorry for english im angry and sad)

I have no ill feelings towards HOG, nor any other server. But I know the sentiment harbored among many members of the player base towards HOG. Many people refuse to play Project Reality at all, because the only viable server at most times, is HOG, and whether it be from personal feelings, or not being able to join the server at all. Many players abstain from Project Reality as a whole.

I agree that Project Reality needs an injection of new players. In recent years more amicable conditions and attitudes towards the Project Reality player base from the Developers have been noticed. But those gestures, do not fix the main issue at the heart of Project Reality's decline. Strict server codes. Yes Project Reality is an old game, but people still play games and modifications of games from before the millennium.


I dunno, I'm just spit balling here. But what if Project Reality was split into two versions?

Classic Project Reality: The standard 'vanilla' Project Reality experience. For the hardcore military simulation enthusiasts among us.

And,

Casual Project Reality: A more streamlined, quicker playing and easier to get into version of Project Reality; for the more 'impatient' among us. Casual Project Reality could hypothetically replace Co-Op, because many people; play Co-Op for the fast re-spawns and unlimited kits. But we detest playing against bots. Server licensing could also be more streamlined or nonexistent. Instead of requiring any onus amount of digital paperwork to run a server. The ability to start a server would be built in from the launcher and/or freely available. I know plenty of people who would gladly return to Project Reality and bring their server hosting capabilities with them. Myself included.

[Nate.]

rambles

A PR server license costs nothing.

And to be honest - we don't care if players like you are banned from all PR servers.
(PS: https://hogclangaming.com/index.php/for ... peal#31711 ).

@TeeHazmat - thanks, and yes we are in a frequent dialogue with server admins about various things including general ones like the one you have mentioned as well as individual cases.

[dcm]

A PR server license costs nothing.

It's not about the money. It's the principle of the thing. Imposing a barrier to entry such as a server licensing, goes against the spirit of game modding as a whole.

[FFG]

It's not about the money. It's the principle of the thing. Imposing a barrier to entry such as a server licensing, goes against the spirit of game modding as a whole.

Anyone can have a server license as long as they meet the requirements, How is that an issue?

[dcm]

Anyone can have a server license as long as they meet the requirements, How is that an issue?

A Project Reality server license comes with strings attached. I cant run it how I want. I have to run it how the you guys want. It goes against my principles. I believe that if I'm putting out the money to run a server, I should be able to do with it, what I want. Yes I know that; technically I can run custom rules, if I password protect my server. But I want my server to be open and available to all, without any need of further barriers to entry.

I'm no stranger to EULAs and server agreements in my professional life. But there's a difference. Those server agreements come with warranties and are designed to help me run my businesses. Project Reality is something I do to blow off steam.

[AlonTavor]

-----

The server files are public for everyone. You can host whatever server you want. People can join your IP at any time. Your client already has the server files and you're one click away from hosting an unlisted server.

But if you wanted listed on our infrastructure, you play by our rules.

Have you even read the license agreement? Its not as draconian as you make it sound.

[dcm]

Its not as draconian as you make it sound.

It is to me.