How the HUD should look in PRM.

Valtasar · Post by **Valtasar** » 2006-12-18 08:27

As you said you can see engine smoking etc. In BF yuo can't SEE it you can only hear and geas will it blow up now or 5 sec later.

Guerra norte · Post by **Guerra norte** » 2006-12-18 08:31

I'm not compleatly sure if I understand you there, anyway I'm off to work so I'll be back on the thread later today.
PS: Try and stay on topic please.

dunkellic · Post by **dunkellic** » 2006-12-18 13:43

Guerra norte wrote:WTF? NO! If you're driving a vehicle and it's taking fire you're not going to know what state the vehicle is in, all you're gonna see and hear is the bullets hitting, engine smoking, windows getting blown out, wheels popping etc. You are not going to be aware of what critical parts on the vehicle is damaged until you get out and investigate.

that´s exactly it - you know a tire has been hit - you know the engine has been hit - damn, from the sound you could even try to judge what part of the engine is hit - but you cant do those things in pr - so dont always "Z0mg, tehre is no minimap in real life" - it is still a game
(still, i agree with you on dont brining back the health for vehicles - perhaps with some exceptions on tanks, since they´ve got a damage report system)

actual topic:
well, it would be nice that if you remove the minimap, you would see the direction where an enemy has been spotted on your compass - so if he is nort of you, a red dot will appear on the edge of the compass - otherwise you would greatly be harming teamwork (and by great i mean fucking huge), because it would get totally useless to spot enemies outside your squad, because noone would be able to see it anyways (only by bringing up your map - but afaik, some people even dont want that)

kina like the "the elder scrolls oblivion" compass, that also only showed the direction a waypoint or so is, but the exact location was only shown on the full map (you had to bring up )

Valtasar · Post by **Valtasar** » 2006-12-18 19:12

Yeah that's what I whant damage report system. Maybe not on car's but on tank's, apc, heli(transport and attack),plane. So you can tell how badly youre tank, apc etc. is hurt.

Darkpowder · Post by **Darkpowder** » 2006-12-18 20:30

About removing the minimap,
You need to bearin mind some things..

IRL...

There are streetnames, identifyable landmarks, i.e. hotel majestic, and other things combined with -real- maps issued to soldiers.

Also, there is a remote and well informed command structure. with full maps.

As far as i see it, our nice minimap is an adequate approximation for modern navigation skills, GPS and pre-mission briefings.

We aren't simulating the soldier simulation, map-reading, or navigation. I recommend you join the boy-scouts or real army for that, or learn the pastime of orienteering for that.

The map makes up for the resources we can't easily simulate in this mod, so it should stay.

however... i would like the -addition- of a magnetic compass.

luizinhuu · Post by **luizinhuu** » 2006-12-18 20:48

Guerra's hud is perfect with the exception of the visible compass, it should just show up with the M key, along with the whole map
but the hud organization is perfection

Lucid Nightmare · Post by **Lucid Nightmare** » 2006-12-18 22:49

Darkpowder wrote:About removing the minimap,
You need to bearin mind some things..

IRL...

There are streetnames, identifyable landmarks, i.e. hotel majestic, and other things combined with -real- maps issued to soldiers.

Also, there is a remote and well informed command structure. with full maps.

As far as i see it, our nice minimap is an adequate approximation for modern navigation skills, GPS and pre-mission briefings.

We aren't simulating the soldier simulation, map-reading, or navigation. I recommend you join the boy-scouts or real army for that, or learn the pastime of orienteering for that.

The map makes up for the resources we can't easily simulate in this mod, so it should stay.

however... i would like the -addition- of a magnetic compass.

Agree. And the spotting of infantry on that map simulates your squadmates pointing/gesturing among other things.

Post by **dizzy** » 2006-12-18 22:54

Im just glad your screen shot captured my awesome server rules

Post by **fuzzhead** » 2006-12-18 23:35

hahahha fkin eh dizzy! best rules evar!

Post by **BrokenArrow** » 2006-12-19 00:52

Valtasar wrote:As you said you can see engine smoking etc. In BF yuo can't SEE it you can only hear and geas will it blow up now or 5 sec later.

Actually in most you can see the engine smoking, and in helos you get the shake when you are severely damaged, and the alarm if destruction is iminant. Really you are able to tell when you are screwed, if not, find a safe place and hop out to check how you are doing.

Guerra norte wrote:You are not going to be aware of what critical parts on the vehicle is damaged until you get out and investigate.

Not entirely true. In helos you can check hydraulic presser (i.e. you'd know if a hydraulic fluid line was hit) you'd know if an engine went out etc.

As for mini-map, I've said it before... I'll say it again. You can't substitute situational awareness in a video game.

Guerra norte · Post by **Guerra norte** » 2006-12-19 04:09

Darkpowder wrote:About removing the minimap,
You need to bearin mind some things..

IRL...

There are streetnames, identifyable landmarks, i.e. hotel majestic, and other things combined with -real- maps issued to soldiers.

You can't compare a bf2 map to a real life combat area, there is hardly any need for need for navigation on bf2.

Darkpowder wrote:Also, there is a remote and well informed command structure. with full maps.

Well, start making more complex maps for PRM then.

Darkpowder wrote:As far as i see it, our nice minimap is an adequate approximation for modern navigation skills, GPS and pre-mission briefings.

Can you tell me of any device that will tell a soldier exactly where all friendly soldiers, vehicles are? And let's not forget it can even tell the EXACT direction and position enemy is facing and located.

Darkpowder wrote:We aren't simulating the soldier simulation, map-reading, or navigation.

Why? isn't this a realism mod? or am I mistaken?

Darkpowder wrote:I recommend you join the boy-scouts or real army for that, or learn the pastime of orienteering for that.

I do quite a lot of navigation by reading maps on my job, I acually think it's fun

As for the army... they didn't want me for reasons I shall not speak of.

The map makes up for the resources we can't easily simulate in this mod, so it should stay.
Ever heard of VOIP?

DivS-konti · Post by **DivS-konti** » 2006-12-19 17:06

cause most of the time I find it to be VERY distracting due to a lot of **** flying across the screen.

Yes same opinion here. "Your" hud is nice. But I don't need a compass. Minimap is just fine!

About removing the minimap,
You need to bearin mind some things..

IRL...

There are streetnames, identifyable landmarks, i.e. hotel majestic, and other things combined with -real- maps issued to soldiers.

Also, there is a remote and well informed command structure. with full maps.

As far as i see it, our nice minimap is an adequate approximation for modern navigation skills, GPS and pre-mission briefings.

We aren't simulating the soldier simulation, map-reading, or navigation. I recommend you join the boy-scouts or real army for that, or learn the pastime of orienteering for that.

The map makes up for the resources we can't easily simulate in this mod, so it should stay.

however... i would like the -addition- of a magnetic compass.
__________________
[PR]RFAD|Darkpowder

You say it! The minimap is quite important for gameplay fun AND coordinations. It's very helpful to be able to tell your team-mates where the enemy is! Quickly and without the barrier of language!
(Is it realistic to speak english with your team-mates when you play (fight) for the mec?)

Please keep the minimap as it is! But change the positions of the "written text".

ArmedDrunk&Angry · Post by **ArmedDrunk&Angry** » 2006-12-19 18:23

The vehicle damage meter idea is great. Aircraft have all sorts of warning lights and sounds to alert you to damage/problems but after a while you learn how much damage you have by experience.
It would be nice to have that 3 position meter for emplaced weapons as IRL i think you would be able to peek and see if the ammo can was 1/2 full or not.
I always reload the .50 when i get in a vehicle and I know sometimes I just threw out 90 good rounds in a 100round belt.

Post by **UK_Force** » 2006-12-19 18:49

The MiniMap IS Realistic?

With the intro of Bowman to the Brits, and I know the US have a similar system, guys on the ground now have a PUDT (Portable User Data Terminal), which shows all icons of guys on the ground, using OSPR (Own Situation Position Reporting), also when enemy are seen, this can be passed on to using Data - GPS Built in and attached to a secure radio to transmit the data ....... all this and strapped to the forearm ?

Sounds like the minimap to me ???

Here is a picture - showing two PUDT's

And the COMBAT screen it shows

Combat is the software we use

Common Battlefield Application Toolset – ComBAT

ComBAT is the software application used with Bowman hardware and is available on all User Data Terminals (computer laptops) with the exception of the handheld Personal User Data Terminal which has slightly different software, A useful analogy is that where a PC uses applications such as MS Office, Bowman uses ComBAT. ComBAT provides the core of the Battle Management System, from fighting platform up to divisional level. Integrated into Bowman, it provides enhanced situational awareness and common operational, intelligence, personnel and logistic planning tools to improve the tempo, survivability and effectiveness of land forces. It also facilitates mission analysis and the provision of orders, map overlays and route planning and provide standard reports and returns formats.

So in Summary, I think the minimap - fits the term "realism", just my opinion though

Guerra norte · Post by **Guerra norte** » 2006-12-19 19:12

Hey while we're at it, why not add a temprature meter, wind indicator, clock, ground surface friction meter, body sector damage meter, headache meter, moral meter etc. etc....

This thread is about how to get the HUD cleaner and more minimalistic , it's not about adding more unnecessary ****.
I can agree on a sector damage meter for aircraft, however for vehicles it would be useless.
There is no need for it vehicles because

A: As of now vehicles don't have separate damage areas.

B: When/if they get it there would be no need to know this because there will be no need of changing tyers, tracks, armour engineparts and so on. So I asume the engineer will still have no need for the knowlege of what part is damaged, he will still be fixing the vehicle in general with his magical wrench.

I mean come people, there are so much in real life that can not be simulated in a game, and if we try to do it by adding all kinds of meters, indicators and magical maps you might get lucky if there's even room for the ironsights.
Right now I have set my Armed Assault setting to where when there's nothing in particular going on, my HUD is compleatly empty, there's no crosshairs, no nothing AND I LOVE IT!

Guerra norte · Post by **Guerra norte** » 2006-12-19 19:16

The MiniMap IS Realistic?

Yes I'm pretty sure the insurgents in Iraq, the PLA and most arab armies have experimental US and British military equipment...

dunkellic · Post by **dunkellic** » 2006-12-19 19:36

jeez, first you whine about the minimap because its not realistic, now, proved otherwise, you whine about the fact that to-some-degree-not-real-near-future-armies have it - let alone out of balance issues all sides should have it

Post by **UK_Force** » 2006-12-19 19:43

Guerra norte wrote:Hey while we're at it, why not add a temprature meter, wind indicator, clock, ground surface friction meter, body sector damage meter, headache meter, moral meter etc. etc....

This thread is about how to get the HUD cleaner and more minimalistic , it's not about adding more unnecessary ****.

I dont think thats what I was saying - was I, read again ?

=|Azeitona|= · Post by **=|Azeitona|=** » 2006-12-19 19:43

The letters size are too big. They should be smaller, really smaller and be as is in the image, near to the down border.

Guerra norte · Post by **Guerra norte** » 2006-12-19 19:50

'[R-DEV wrote:UK_Force']I dont think thats what I was saying - was I, read again ?

I wasn't replying to you.