Again with the dragging! Noone is going to drag ANYONE ANYWHERE!
you could of healed 5 people doing it the old way.
So what, this is your idea of realism? I said in the above post that none of this would work, period. At best we could remove the revive feature, concentrating on having medics stop bleedings instead of being veritable fountains of health.
And if that's what they are reduced to, why even have them in the game?
It just seems to piss some people off that they can use others misfortune to gain points. And if that quirk was taken out, along with replentishing health, hardly anyone would play that class anymore, since it has no advantages over the common grunt.
waffenbaum wrote:Again with the dragging! Noone is going to drag ANYONE ANYWHERE!
you could of healed 5 people doing it the old way.
So what, this is your idea of realism? I said in the above post that none of this would work, period. At best we could remove the revive feature, concentrating on having medics stop bleedings instead of being veritable fountains of health.
And if that's what they are reduced to, why even have them in the game?
It just seems to piss some people off that they can use others misfortune to gain points. And if that quirk was taken out, along with replentishing health, hardly anyone would play that class anymore, since it has no advantages over the common grunt.
No see you going to have a blood health bar then? very realistic.
Medics are a vital part of the team and arnt used just to gain points and if they are then during the process they also make allot of people happy. If i get shot and then hear 'Clear' and im back i personally am very thankful they revived me. Points should be awarded for there help!
Stretchers are unrealistic in such a game. dragging and healing is a good idea imo but you cannot have the time limit stop whilst doing it.
I like the idea that mdeics can bring people back from a very dangerious state, allot.
It should remain in the PR mod even if its done in a different way.
I don't have any ideas in mind, but I'm just saying the new system should be effective, yet simple, much like the shock paddles. I like the idea of Black Hawks and humvees being medic stations, because most maps have at least one, and it's the driver/pilot's responsibility to evac the wounded, while more serious stuff gets field treatment (an alternative to the shock paddles approach). But maybe that's just me.
we could base it off of what realistically happens, and then dumb it down a bit so its not so goddamned complicated.
Now, we are going to assume Bob has been shot, lets say, striaght through his right arm. Bob, being righthanded, has dropped his M16 after cursing for a bit, and scurried quickly behind the corner he just peeked around to get shot. He's grabbing his arm, screaming for a medic. After some cover fire from some other guys, Bill, the medic, runs over the Bob. He reassures him, and tells him to stay still, while bandaging the gaping whole left from the 7.62 round. Luckily, the round missed the bone, but Bob still won't be using his arm the same way ever again. After bandaging Bob up, Bill calls for some more cover fire and runs with Bob over to the fire team leader.
Bill explains the situation to Fred, the fire team leader. Fred assess the situation and concludes that there are only known hostilities at this one front in this one area. Fred determines it is safe to call in a medevac. Fred gets out his radio and informs the commander of the situation, and suggests a landing zone. Commander agrees, Fred gives Bill a green smoke canister to mark the LZ, and tells him it is back two blocks, in an abandoned parking lot, where there is a safe defensive perimeter already set up.
Bill and Bob run over, wait for about 10 minutes, and a black hawk comes down, picks Bob up, flies back to main base, where Army surgeons immeadiately begin opperating on him to remove the bullet and set up a stable splint/cast. Either way, Bob will probably not be able to lift very much for a while.
Now, take that story, which I made up, but I would say is fairly realistic, and analyze it, simplify it, and turn it into gameplay.
As a note before I start analizing, if Bob had recieved a wound that would have made him tottaly unable to fight in real life, but still alive, we're going to kill Bob in the game, because, injured that badly, there is no way you could possible fix up Bob back to fighting condition within the time limit of a spawn, much less a round, muchless within a couple of months the surgery and physical therapy would take.
*Bob is shot in arm. Being shot in the right arm, he flinches and drops his M16 (This may be possible in gameplay.)
*Had Bob decided to take out another weapon, he'd only be able to aim and fire it left handed (I doubt you could switch the hand a guy hold his gun in inagme if he's shot in the right arm, most likely, he wouldn't be able to use a weapons again, or if he could, it'd be very very badly aimed and would have much more recoil, as he could not control it as well.)
*Bob grabs his arm and screams. I think it would make sense that, if you were shot, you wouldn't just twitch and keep fighting, there needs to be a second or two second pause where your guy screams, he just got freakin shot!
*The medic runs over and bandages him. Notice the lack of the sentence "The medic runs over and throws a bag at him." Now, here is the incentive for bandaging him: Along with a health meter, you have a Blood meter, which starts at 100%, and, after being shot or near an explosion, slowly goes down. As it goes down, aim is worse, tunnel and blurry vision set in, and sound become duller and farther off (think saving private ryan, where he can't hear anything in the beggining scene). The medic bandaging him stops the bleeding, stops the blood meter from going down farther.
*Now, the rest of the story is just to illustrate the complications, but here is the dillema: Realistically, it would take months, possible year or two to recover from ONE bullet wound like that. Realistically, there is no way that guy would be back as a fighting man any time soon, possibly ever (depending on how badly the bullet destoyed everything in its path).
I think that a semi-realistic solution would be: each team's main base has a strecher with an Iv hangining off of it, a static vehicle (like a gun emplacement) you run ( or hobble, depending on your wound) up to it, and enter it, and sit in it. It gives you one health point back every... 3 seconds.
3 seconds if we can have each part of the body with its own 100 health and each part of the body has its own adverse affects on the state of the player, if we can only have one health bar, than i think one health point every 7-10 seconds would be good.
This makes the guy out of action for a while, but you can go back and fight.
Now, about dragging a guy away (or picking him up and throwing over shoulders): First of all, not SOP of any medic, I don't think. You are supposed to STABILIZE them, especially if you dont know how they are hurt, which you woudnt untill after looking at him for 15 seconds and finding the wound. Then, you'd put him on a stretcher and carry him to safety.
If a guy moves around a corner, and is shot in the leg, then i can see the point of dragging him back around the corner. But this means that after a leg shot, your guy becomes unconcious (critcally wounded), and then becomes an object another player can pull around. Maybe, after being shot in the leg, you go unconcious, then wake up after about 30 seconds or something.
This dragging thing is just too hard to implement, I have no idea how you'd code it, and I can't figure out how to make it work in gameplay after you get it to work...
What the hell, I'll just type my idea out for the 5th time (SEARCH!!!)
Along with health meter and blood meter, people have a health bar for each limb:
Head/neck
Upper chest
Left arm/left shoulder
right arm/right shoulder
Heart
Torso/stomach
Right leg
left leg
Head/neck shot kills you in one hit, make a head and neck zone instead of one, and we can have the grabbing throat gurgling animation for neck shots
Upper chest will pretty much be kill you in one hit, only a few pistols woudn't kill you in one hit here. Being damaged hear makes you slower, worse aim, etc
being shot in the arm or shoulder WILL NOT KILL YOU. It will however make you drop your gun (maybe possible), and make your gun sway increase, and recoil will increase
heart shot from anything = dead, unless you figure in that body armor may stop pistol rounds
torso/stomach shot makes you go a lot slower, turning speed slower, you can't sprint anymore. shots to this area will kill you evnentually.
leg shot makes you limp (if possible) while walking, you can't do anything but crawl as prone. also, you CAN'T die from leg shots.
Isn't it great though? People won't even bother reading a few posts up before posting an already answered question in the same thread. I could probably set up a thread called "Choppers are fun" and the first question would be about wether or not I thought choppers were fun.
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What the hell, I'll just type my idea out for the 5th time (SEARCH!!!)
Along with health meter and blood meter, people have a health bar for each limb:
Head/neck
Upper chest
Left arm/left shoulder
right arm/right shoulder
Heart
Torso/stomach
Right leg
left leg
Head/neck shot kills you in one hit, make a head and neck zone instead of one, and we can have the grabbing throat gurgling animation for neck shots
Upper chest will pretty much be kill you in one hit, only a few pistols woudn't kill you in one hit here. Being damaged hear makes you slower, worse aim, etc
being shot in the arm or shoulder WILL NOT KILL YOU. It will however make you drop your gun (maybe possible), and make your gun sway increase, and recoil will increase
heart shot from anything = dead, unless you figure in that body armor may stop pistol rounds
torso/stomach shot makes you go a lot slower, turning speed slower, you can't sprint anymore. shots to this area will kill you evnentually.
leg shot makes you limp (if possible) while walking, you can't do anything but crawl as prone. also, you CAN'T die from leg shots.
Great idea!
PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:51 pm
Isn't it great though? People won't even bother reading a few posts up before posting an already answered question in the same thread. I could probably set up a thread called "Choppers are fun" and the first question would be about wether or not I thought choppers were fun. Smile
Haha
"There are no atheists in foxholes" isn´t an argument against atheism. It´s an argument against foxholes." - James Morrow
I think that's still too complicated. No-one wants to sit out for a minute and a half just to get their health back, when they're already half a mile away from the enemy.
First of all, I'd like to say this: wouldn't Bob fall to the ground from an arm shot? I mean, sure, it's just a bullet, but I sure as hell wouldn't keep standing if a bullet went into my arm... I'd collapse to the ground. Sure, I'd be in deep pain, but being in the line of fire won't get me much relief - someone would have to drag me out of there. Now, this isn't possible in the game, I'm pretty sure - how else could we deal with it? I'd say screw dragging (of any kind), it's just not going to work. No matter how realistic it would be, it's too hard to perform. Unless you guys can think up something, I'd have to say get the medics to work on him amidst all the fire.
However, I might have come up with an idea which might work instead of the base stretcher thing - a medical tent. Injured can simply trudge over to a medical tent, and await any kind of treatment to replenish their health. Perhaps a main base could have a more complex medical system, but other bases could have a medical tent. What do you think?
As for the whole body part damage thing, I'm sure I've killed bots in one shot to the head. If I have, then limb damage must be possible.
I was thinking more along the line's of that any soldier can walk up to a fellow who has recently been killed and give him BASIC first aid. Ya know walk up and press "e" thus giving the soldier more time before he has to respawn again and that way a medic has a better chance of getting to him in time. And like Figi said, you could have a bllod meter (nice idea) and if the soldier has just been wounded a fellow soldier can run up press the magic e button and stop the bleeding. Moments later a medic will run up and fully recover him.
I know the idea of giving "basic first aid" to a dead soldier is stupid but I'm using simple english and couldn't find any other word's to use......mayb we can take bit's and peice's from each other's idea's and turn it into something intelligent and usefull.
"Incoming fire has the rigth of way"...........
"never share a foxhole with anyone braver than you are"
If everyone could give basic first aid (which is the right term, i think), how would the medic be special or different?
Also, realistically, I think (this is where Eddie comes in and corrects me) mostly, medics would be the only ones who are trained in basic first aid, as well as other forms of first of first aid (which would really be second aid, if you think about it).
All soldiers get a first aid course as far as I know. Basicly CPR and how to stop a person from bleeding to death. But nothing fancy, and they don't have the required tools to do anything, especially not extensive field surgery.
Honest question: Would giving CPR to a person with a bullet wound help them live longer?
If so, then I think this CPR idea (basic first aid) is realistic and plausible and should be done, but if CPR doesn't help you with a bullet wound, I think it would be pointless.
