Yet another helicopter suggestion - but truely a good one

[=*CLA*=StudMuffin21]

no ropes from helo's
it's been suggested and rejected many times.
I could swear that I hit something like 700knots in the BH on Jabal and I don't think helicopters go that fast in RL.

Yeah, I hit over 850 just last night.

[Ghostrider]

Kill me if I'm wrong but I believe I was talking to Rhino once and there is a way to have more then 8 people in 1 vehicle.. Again I might be wrong because it's been a while..

It was confirmed during 0.5 dev cycle. I think that one of the modellers made the confirmation if I remember correctly.


-Ghost

[=*CLA*=StudMuffin21]

WhiteMoon']

To =*CLA*=StudMuffin21 : I love the first pic posted and found it long time ago ! I just get back to PRM and am about to begin my PRM copter's pilot learning (more difficult than BF2) after re-installing my Topgun Afterburner 2. I would be pleased to make training with you to develop such flying technique... let me know

WhiteMoon:

It would be my pleasure to train with you. I have started a list of tactics to use and have posted them on my website. Soon I will be working on training simulations to use when our community (clan) grows larger. Unfortunately we (=CLA=) do not have enough members to actually "train" as of yet. But feel free to join our TeamSpeak server if you wish to practice with myself and another serious member. You can find our info under the "Clans and Teams General Discussion" of this website.

[Figisaacnewton]

Anyway, on to my idea:

Allow for all bay doors on all helicopters that have them operational.
Bay doors must be opened by either the pilot or a copilot before any troops may enter.
This would also hopefully stop those with twitchy fingers from hitting the "E" button before the helicopter has reached a safe unloading zone.

This would require a complete remodel of the MEC and PLA trans helicopters. Would take a while. Good idea, but would be hard to implement.

One thing I (and the tester I discussed this with) thought would be very nifty is the implementation a CH-47 on only large maps were transportation is needed. Use of this aircraft would serve several purposes. It could perform the following operations - but only one at a time:

Option 1)
Cary twelve (12) troops (two full squads) plus one pilot and one copilot. Again, operation of bay doors would be required in order for troops to enter and exit the aircraft.

Unless we can fix the bf2 engine and make it so a player can stand inside a moving vehicle while not in a vehicle position and not die... this is not possible. It BARELY works with the merlin, and only works at all while going very slowly.

Option 2)
One (1) fully loaded Humvee (with a mounted .50) may be loaded/unloaded at any given time in any given location (for either insertion or extraction) inside the helicopter. Closing of rear bay door would secure the Humvee inside the helicopter until a safe drop off location is reached and rear bay door is opened.

Option 3)
Two (2) fully loaded DPVs (Desert Patrol Vehicles) may be loaded/unloaded at any given time in any given location (for either insertion or extraction) inside the helicopter. Again, closing of rear bay door would secure the DPVs until a safe drop off location is reached.

Not possible at all. Putting one vehicle inside another always = both explode.
However, it might be possible to make the copilot have a gun which cannot be reloaded that, when fired, makes a humvee or whatnot appear at the back of the chinook.

[Cyber-Couch]

How do you tell your speed while flying?

[=*CLA*=StudMuffin21]

Cyber-Couch:
At the bottom left there is a speed readout in KM/hr. Though I doubt it's any bit accurate.

Figisaacnewton:
I really didn't expect much from thinking any kind of vehicle would fit inside the Merline or a Chinook. But hey.....it's fun to dream about! Maybe some time way down the road if anyone ever wants to put that much work into it it can be figured out...till then we'll have to settle with what we've got. And that's good enough!!

[Wipeout]

WhiteMoon'] Dakohunterwhite ! I feel good reading your feedback on those pilots. It gives a good opinion of the community

??? Wipeout ??? I find BF piloting with mouse really good made but I always had a better feeling with a joyistick, especially with copters simulating games where keyboard doesn't allows enough simultaneous keys use

Did you really trained with a joystick ? Because I remember three things :
- I first learned copter piloting on BF Vietnam with mouse and I was pretty good at. Then I bought a joystick and I had to learn again piloting from the beginning because it's really different to use. This known as, I saw someone piloting so good on BF2 (demo) with mouse I don't know if one day I'll ever do so good. And on the copter (almost) simulator Med Evac it is simply impossible to flight very well with a keyboard (I took quarter an hour to first land and finish to get patient to buy my joystick).

- I had one day a conversation about wheel using with a friend who was like me fan of arcade simulating driving (like NFS and more) and he replied me like you, saying he's more precise with the keyboard. I said just like before that you have a delay to re-learn driving. Monthes after I met him again and he said me he tried again the wheel and discover how it can be great.

- I've been in relation with a BF Vietnam players group where some really good pilots were fragging high. On their forum, I post a training shooting course with the fighting huey, where we had to shoot precise objectives in precise order and land back in the same direction than before taking off, time and rockets used being the challenge. I trained so much on it I finished with a very well time. One of the pilot said (before testing) he'll blow my time, and I still wait his result

Now if you're a well trained joystick players that got back to "archaic" (in my opinion) mouse/keyboard control, let me know cause I would like to read more about this

Only reason I'd use a JS is for throttle control... but Who needs throttle control when you can take the time to feather the "w" key. I dunno really it turns into a what you like best. I have used Joystick, just couldn't stand the time it took for me to adjust to it, and I was still 10x better with mouse and keyboard. When your an awesome pilot and you rival some perty good pilots, money says that you won't wanna give that up. Obviously I'm no where near as great a pilot as I used to be but still.

[[Fr]WhiteMoon]

About putting one vehicle inside another always... did they explode immediatly ? Anyway, did you think about coding ONE vehicule regrouping two ? I mean you can code a chair or a juke box (with a bar) in a chopper, so why not a Humvee ? So I present my vehicule behind or inside the chopper, I secure it pressing a key, and the empty chopper becomes a chopper with a part representing the vehicule inside... ok that's look like a little X-files to code, especially with the men in the second vehicule, transforming the usual sits in the back of the chopper in sits in the part of the chopper representing the vehicule...

And what about going simpler with vehicules teleportation ? Oh sorry it's a contemporary mod !

Thx for the answer "Muffin man" and the TS solution

[Raniak]

Can't you make it that when you are standing behind transport aircraft you can request a vehicle like BF2 vehicle drop but make it spawn on the ground, and make it that only x amount of deployed vehicle can be on the map ?

[Figisaacnewton]

WhiteMoon']About putting one vehicle inside another always... did they explode immediatly ?

Basically ya. try landing one helicopter on another and then taking off with the bottom heli. couple seconds of bugginess and then boom.

Anyway, did you think about coding ONE vehicule regrouping two ? I mean you can code a chair or a juke box (with a bar) in a chopper, so why not a Humvee ?

A chair or juke box is part of the chopper model. Its not a seperate entity that just happens to stick inside the chopper, its part of the chopper. If you shoot the chiar, the chopper loses health.

So I present my vehicule behind or inside the chopper, I secure it pressing a key, and the empty chopper becomes a chopper with a part representing the vehicule inside... ok that's look like a little X-files to code, especially with the men in the second vehicule, transforming the usual sits in the back of the chopper in sits in the part of the chopper representing the vehicule...

Um... not quite sure what you're saying. The 2 possible ways i see to do this are

1) Make a weapon which 'fires' a humvee out of the back of a chinook. When you throw an ammo bag, you are firing it. Use similar code (with less throwing and more just appearing) to make a humvee appear. Give this 'gun' only 1 ammo and make it never reload or take 40793456083947 minutes.

2) make the bfv style towing vehicles from choppers work in bf2. likely impossible though.

[Raniak]

Make a weapon which 'fires' a humvee out of the back of a chinook. When you throw an ammo bag, you are firing it. Use similar code (with less throwing and more just appearing) to make a humvee appear. Give this 'gun' only 1 ammo and make it never reload or take 40793456083947 minutes.

Noob: what is this weird gun, let's fire it !
*lunch Humvee, Humvee fall to the ground and get destroyed*

Maybe make it that only people with crewman(if you can't use the vehicle you can't lunch it) can lunch it...

[minigunmonk]

Keyboard collective and pedals suck but mouse movement is closer to RL cyclic movement than a PC joystick because of the pivot point of the joystick being so short. In RL the stick moves almost in a flat plane due to its length.

[[Fr]WhiteMoon]

If I remember well the comanche (canceled) was developped with a joystick where pedals are replaced by a plane rotation of the joystick. I think the problem isn't the short point of pivot but I always thought my joystick was too much sensible to handle precisely (didn't found a way to adjust that), so it needs more training to get it naturaly.

You looks to have a good knowledge on copter minigun, have you ever fly in RL ?

[Seagoon]

So no one flys with the keyboard AND joystick?

(I use the keyboard WASD for +/-throttle and rudder, and the joystick for everything else AND rudder again..)

[Maistros]

I too enjoy their speed. I am only doubting their realism.

StudMuffin, don't doubt their realism unless you've been in one, or seem them do their thing in real life.. not Blackhawk Down. (Does not include airshows, either)

Until you've either been in one during a tactical drill, or have seen them land and take off from a carrier every day for 6 months... just.. no.

The speeds are realistic, but the acceleration will probably be toned down a bit. IRL, blackhawks top out at 180mph... compared to BF2 speed meter it's spot on. Cobras go over 200mph top.. which in BF2 speak is about 1050+kpm

So when you get your blackhawk up to "800" in BF2.. it's only doing about 150mph in realistic comparison.

[77SiCaRiO77]

200 mph => good for maps of 300 km^2 , not for maps like bf2/pr , witch only suport 4 km^2.

[bbyboy]

Aside from the fact that now Blackhawks seem very unrealistic (keep in mind I am no helicopter expert or pilot) with their speed acceleration and maneuverability above a speed of 400 or so, I absolutely LOVE the new Merlin on Operation Ghost Train. Getting some practice today I and a fellow clan member were taking screen shots. Realizing the possible potential I discussed the idea with one of PR's testers. He said it might work, though unfortunately maps aren't large enough.

Anyway, on to my idea:

Allow for all bay doors on all helicopters that have them operational.
Bay doors must be opened by either the pilot or a copilot before any troops may enter.
This would also hopefully stop those with twitchy fingers from hitting the "E" button before the helicopter has reached a safe unloading zone.

One thing I (and the tester I discussed this with) thought would be very nifty is the implementation a CH-47 on only large maps were transportation is needed. Use of this aircraft would serve several purposes. It could perform the following operations - but only one at a time:

Option 1)
Cary twelve (12) troops (two full squads) plus one pilot and one copilot. Again, operation of bay doors would be required in order for troops to enter and exit the aircraft.

Option 2)
One (1) fully loaded Humvee (with a mounted .50) may be loaded/unloaded at any given time in any given location (for either insertion or extraction) inside the helicopter. Closing of rear bay door would secure the Humvee inside the helicopter until a safe drop off location is reached and rear bay door is opened.

Option 3)
Two (2) fully loaded DPVs (Desert Patrol Vehicles) may be loaded/unloaded at any given time in any given location (for either insertion or extraction) inside the helicopter. Again, closing of rear bay door would secure the DPVs until a safe drop off location is reached.

Option 4)
Six (6) quads may be loaded/unloaded at any given time in any given location (for either insertion or extraction) inside the helicopter. Once more, closing of the rear bay door would secure the quads safely.

I know nothing of the BF2 engine, what is possible and what is not. I do know that these ideas (other than allowing for 12 troops to be secured) are highly unlikely. I am only voicing my opinion of what I believe would be a huge asset for game play as well as realism.

Now for the picture that inspired me to think of this idea:

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/3205 ... 9b0fj7.jpg

Here is my reenactment of this event. Throughout the game I successfully pulled off at least one dozen of these operations (parking the butt end of the helicopter on a edge while troops loaded/unloaded, then performing the same operation for a pickup and moving on to the next flag. NOTE!!! THIS REQUIRES MUCH PATIENTS, A STEADY HAND, A JOYSTICK, AND PRACTICE!! PLEASE DON'T DO THIS UNLESS YOU ARE SURE YOU CAN PULL IT OFF AS TEAM KILLING A FULL HELICOPTER WILL SURELY NOT MAKE YOU FEEL GOOD. So again (not to brag ) I was piloting, and =CLA=ReaperMAC was taking screen shots.

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/7546 ... 074bo4.png
http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/7551 ... 084cf5.png

I wasn't sure what code to use so you'll just have to click on the link.

Batlefield Vienam ,on your mind? Dude thats a great idea, but how about updated version of *Chihook*, and relise a line to lift friendly vehicles like APC?

[[Fr]WhiteMoon]

No, lifting vehicules has already been discussed severals time on the forum and at least the option is rejected. Note bbyboy that you don't need to quote the entire first post of the subject to had two comments lines

[Dakohunterwhite]

But what if the Humvee spawned directly in the helicopter? Then, as soon as you pressed w it would be released and could drive out? Maybe so that only if the bay door was closed, if you could do that. They've done it with the BF1942 engine so why not BF2? I saw a '42 mod which put a jeep into a landing boat.

[Thunder]

because its not the 1942 engine. any vehicle spawning on top of a vehicle would jump around a bit and explode, the bf2 devs modeled a lcac but dropped it form the game because of these transport problems