Pistols

DaedalusAI1 · Post by **DaedalusAI1** » 2007-02-20 00:08

Sneak Attack wrote:but, though 9mm wont go through body armor and will probably barley give your a bruise on your chest, for PR purposes they should probably be abit more powerfull, ells your going to have to make the MP5 suck with it.

we could put in the .50 Desert Eagle (joking) as it will go through body armor and like, everything ells it is pointed at.

A 9mm bullet from an MP5 will hurt more than a 92FS due to muzzle velocity. MP5 has longer barel so it will go quicker. As for the amount of damage the 92FS does, I think it is fine. I heavy AT whore a lot and I only ever pull out my pistol if I'm out of ammo. It isn't your job to engage infantry. Your job is to kill tanks and apc's, oh and helicopters are fun to kill. Pilot shouldn't have hovered in one spot for that long

. It is only there as a last resort.

NavalLord · Post by **NavalLord** » 2007-02-20 00:17

As a Spec Ops or Officer, I often run out of ammo in a fire fight and pull out my pistol before there isn't time to reload. I'll put 5+ rounds into someone at near point blank range, and they wont die. It's very frustrating, because I've never gotten a kill for this reason. In a game where all the guns kill you in about 2-4 hits, having a last resort weapon that takes near 10 hits is pretty useless.

Rusty_FunP · Post by **Rusty_FunP** » 2007-02-20 00:51

Body armor wont save you from pistol hits all the time, there are seams in the kevlar, and it doesnt help when you get shot to the arms or legs (remember major arteries.)

Also, 9mm parabellum (luger in US) is "just" a pistol round, but it still packs quite a lot of punch, and even if the kevlar stops the bullet, you still can get quite a lot of bruises and broken bones under the allmighty body armor. Sure, 7.62x51mm is more a cherry popper than the 9mmP, but it aint a miracle in weapon technology either, 9mm from point blank range will deliver the same amount of physical trauma as the 7.62 from 400m.

DaedalusAI1 · Post by **DaedalusAI1** » 2007-02-20 01:01

I get kills as an insurget with what ever pistol the rpg gunner gets. You just need to get the drop on the person for it to work. I don't think this games physics engine is advanced enough to determine damage based off of distance. If it is, then yeah the 9mm would hurt bad up close. I'm guessing body armour is a numerical value and isn't spot sensitive. Could be wrong though and would appreciate if someone knows about this to embelish on that.

Wasteland · Post by **Wasteland** » 2007-02-20 04:17

DaedalusAI1 wrote:MP5 has longer barel so it will go quicker

If the chemical propellant (usually gunpowder) has time to completely burn before the round leaves the barrel, muzzle velocity would't be affected at all by barrel length. I'd imagine a simple test of whether or not it's completely burnt would be the presence of muzzle flash. I've never seen an MP5 fired IRL, but is there muzzle flash?

Beefybong · Post by **Beefybong** » 2007-02-20 04:23

Sure, 9mm may not pierce body armour easily but I don't think you're going to be in the best of shape after being shot 4-5 times.

Teek · Post by **Teek** » 2007-02-20 04:33

JP*wasteland.soldier wrote:If the chemical propellant (usually gunpowder) has time to completely burn before the round leaves the barrel, muzzle velocity would't be affected at all by barrel length. I'd imagine a simple test of whether or not it's completely burnt would be the presence of muzzle flash. I've never seen an MP5 fired IRL, but is there muzzle flash?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEETqGPj ... ed&search=
well thar you go

trogdor1289 · Post by **trogdor1289** » 2007-02-20 04:41

Well a longer barrel gives the round more time to stabilize so it carries it's speed longer. At least that is how I understand it.

Wasteland · Post by **Wasteland** » 2007-02-20 04:52

A longer barrel will increase accuracy for sure.

But the reason it increases velocity is this.

A round is accelerated because the highly pressurized gasses behind it have no other way of expanding. They have to proppel the round forward. But as soon as the round is out the barrel, there are lots of places the expanding gasses can go to. So if the chemical reaction that causes propulsion is incomplete when the bullet leaves the barrel, then it hasn't reaped all the propulsion it could have.

ReadMenace · Post by **ReadMenace** » 2007-02-20 04:53

MP5s? Since when is there one in PR?

Wasteland · Post by **Wasteland** » 2007-02-20 04:54

MEC spec ops.

EDIT: forgot that's not an MP5. Oh well. They still have the vanilla model though. And engineers used to have the MP5.

ReadMenace · Post by **ReadMenace** » 2007-02-20 05:30

JP*wasteland.soldier wrote:MEC spec ops.

EDIT: forgot that's not an MP5. Oh well. They still have the vanilla model though. And engineers used to have the MP5.

No, I don't believe that is the vanilla model, look closely at the magazine; It's chambered in 5.56 btw.
-Read

DaedalusAI1 · Post by **DaedalusAI1** » 2007-02-20 06:27

I'm not saying that having a really long barrel is better. If the barrel is to long, then the gasses won't have enough pressure to force the bullet forward. To long a barrel is bad, to short is bad. Also the grain of the bullet could be different. Like the rounds from a regular mp5 compared to ones you would fire from an mp5sd would be different. (sd= suppressed). You would fire subsonic bullets so they would be traveling slower to reduce the sound and therefor do less damage.

You just have to optimize the bullet for the performance you want. Weapon manufacturers design there weapons to perform for certain needs. So a wider range of say 9mm bullets will have more effect from an MP5 then say a handgun.

I did a post on the M16 is **** thread about how barrel length on for example M16 compared to M4 affects the velocity. But that is using the same grain and powder in a bullet. Same goes when comparing other guns.

KP · Post by KP » 2007-02-20 07:15

The MEC "MP5" is an HK53, chambered in 5.56 NATO.

M.0.D · Post by **M.0.D** » 2007-02-20 07:54

@Daedalus: Yeah normally supressed weapons use subsonic bullets, but i think only the MP5SD uses the normal 9mm ammunition, they have a special designed Surpressor, though i can not explain how it works ^^

KP · Post by KP » 2007-02-20 08:04

I think I can. Then Bob_Marley should be able to fill in the details

All right, what we basically have, is a regular MP5 firing regular 9mm ammo. The barrel, however, is extended and has holes in it to vent off the expanding gases formed by the detonation in the chamber. This ported barrel is inside the suppressor, which is basically a tube divided into several chambers, where the gases are allowed to expand. Like when you slowly let the air out of a balloon. Just a whooshing noise. When you pop the balloon, however, the air inside will expand rapidly, creating a bang. That's how a suppressor works. It allows the gases to expand more slowly, and thus it removes most of the bang. The ported barrel of the MP5SD also serves another purpose: when the gases are bled away, there is less force to propel the bullet forward, and thus the bullet becomes subsonic before it leaves the barrel, suppressing the sound even more. An MP5SD firing regular 9mm ball ammo sounds much like a BB gun. And therefore, it isn't recommended to use subsonic ammo in an SD.

Was that understandable?

DaedalusAI1 · Post by **DaedalusAI1** » 2007-02-20 11:21

Thanks for the clarification KP. Always nice to learn something new

KP · Post by KP » 2007-02-20 11:31

Ha! Somebody actually understood one of my explanations! *looks around, grinning*

Gaz · Post by **Gaz** » 2007-02-20 13:20

you will find that the round calibres have been processed and audited to give out realistic damage to players. Shooting a 9mm will be weaker than a 5.56. A 7.62 is stronger than a 5.56, and so on.

the next patch will fix the penetration issues, and pistols are weaker than assault rifles. Go for the head and you will drop anyone.