Has PR Lost it's way ?

hugekebab · Post by **hugekebab** » 2007-03-02 20:53

I have loved PR from the first release, its always been my fav mod. I love the high recoil, realistic sounds, great squad based team play, good ballistics, and I am even one who agrees with the longer spawn time, as this adds to the fact that you don't want to die!

saying that, I really believe this mod is going down the wrong track lately, hence I felt compelled to join the forum.

The system of assigning kits is OK, needs polishing but generally adds to team play. My main problem, and its a significant problem, is that the latest release has all but destroyed the usability/fun factor/practicality of vehicle usage. on foot infantry fighting is cracking; love it to bits, but maps with vehicles have become smaktardastic fests of carnage and frustration. the system of assigning a kit for use of a vehicle is on paper a good idea; in reality though it couldn't be worse for the gameplay/fun factor. it is just so boring/frustrating having to go to a kit point get the right kit then go to the airfield/base only to get smacktarded etc. i really wish so much that we could go back to the day when i could just jump in an apc and be off. what should be realistic is the ballistics and armour effects, the anal assigning of a specific kit makes the game sooo slow and dare I say it boring to play, to the point where now I just dont bother with vehicles anymore. everyone seems to be just stuck around mains doing nothing, and there are frequent complaints on servers.

to illustrate the unpopularity of this, I was looking at the release notes of the latest server release on bf2files.com and found this on the comments page:

" #1 - Posted by: misnomer (Member) on 03-01-2007 at 21:31
congrats on a good update.....although warm up time on jets sounds just as vexing as on helis. Still a lot of sitting around to be done in the mod, but this update should make it more playable.

#2 - Posted by: UGSAce (Battlefield Files Staff) on 03-01-2007 at 21:45
i agree this game has to much sitting in it i could handle the all the other stuff like warn ups on helo's and what not but the spawn time is what annoys me the most, nothing like be spawn camped and having a half a min spawn.....

#3 - Posted by: RussianComrade (Member) on 03-01-2007 at 22:36
Hang on....so you get killed if you're in a vehicle that isn't controlled by someone in your squad? I don't particularly like that idea....but the rest of it looks good, I enjoy PR big grin

#4 - Omg... - Posted by: Bodegas (Member) on 03-01-2007 at 22:59
8. A 10 second timer has been implemented that will now kill a player that stays in a vehicle position with the wrong kit or that is not in the same squad as the player that "owns" the vehicle.

Wow that truly sucks balls. If you're far away from your squad ( say if theres a spawn error or your squad got ahead of you) and the only transportation around you is another guy from another squad, then you're screwed. I was really hoping they'd fix the issues PR .5 had but now it looks like they just added a few new assinine features while fixing a few bugs. I uninstalled .5 because of the lag, now its staying uninstalled because of retarded rules like that.

#5 - Posted by: UGSAce (Battlefield Files Staff) on 03-01-2007 at 23:31
to much realism kills its fan base and its doing it well

#6 - Posted by: pookie (Member) on 03-02-2007 at 00:20
that kill timer only applies if u sit in a position such as gunner for an apc as positions like that require a crewment kit. u can still sit in the back of an apc or tank turrets or jeeps etc since u dont need special kits so transport isnt the issue. the issue they are fixing is 2 people from different squads operating one vehicle as they have no way to coordinate anything without a mic so the vehicle gets wasted.

the spawn timer is perfect too, nothing to say there just some ppl like it some dont. Being spawn killed isnt an issue cause u spawn on user placed rally points so the enemy doesnt know where to camp.

#7 - Posted by: misnomer (Member) on 03-02-2007 at 05:19
obvious this is someone who has never been spawn killed let alone gotten into a vehicle to be insta-killed since he didn't hit f3 fast enough. woo realism for making the mod unplayable for people who haven't memorized the player's guide. stop with the theory and listen to the people who play your mod. we don't like the spawn timer, it doesn't dissuade us from dying. calling it perfect just shows how out of touch you are. and sure you can tell me just how wonderful it is and quote all your buddies who love it, but look at what #2 said. a staff member suggesting that you are killing off player base. devs are really starting to annoy me.

#8 - Posted by: HUGEkebab (Member) on 03-02-2007 at 05:34
i agree with above comments, they have killed a lot of the fun factor. im all for hyper real ballistics and ease of killing/recoil, but the vehicle system and officer system sucks sooo badly that ive drifted away from an otherwise sublime mod.

#9 - Posted by: Smith_ (Member) on 03-02-2007 at 11:11
I like everything except the a10 timer. Also, why cant both teams use the 4 wheeled transportation. Im fairly sure these cars are button started and they dont have locks. And ALL cars use the same basic principle (gas, break wheel). Why cant both sides use each others humvees?

#10 - This mod is getting very lame. - Posted by: HEDST8 (Member) on 03-02-2007 at 11:53
This mod needs faster action as like other peeps have said.you wait for 30 secs+ and then die if in wrong place and die again and again.Yawn
Roll on fh 2 as if its anything like the orignal one it will have very good team play and very fast game play too.None of this running for 5 minutes and then getting team killed.....I need a yawn again.Roll Eyes (sarcastic)

#11 - Posted by: UGSAce (Battlefield Files Staff) on 03-02-2007 at 12:18
I'm really surprised at these comments a few patches ago you didn't dare diss this mod of fear of being flamed... but now everyone kinda agrees this mod is losing its fun factor.

#12 - Posted by: imtheheadhunter (Member) on 03-02-2007 at 12:26
PR has a fun factor? confused"

Look don't get me wrong, I realise that popularity isn't everything, but people arn't mindlessly flaming here, there is a general thread of disapproval at the diminishing of the games 'fun' factor. even one of the bf2files staff openly moans (i admit I am whining, sorry but its how i feel)

Again, I LOVE the tenets to which PR tries to stay faithful, I just wish you would relax a little on all this kit assignment, vehicle locking overkill so we can play the game we all know and love. I mean those who whore vehicles originally could easily be knocked off by a mischievous sniper or a guy doing a bit of camping with an RPG, this naturally balanced the game against vehicle whores. The analisation of the whole vehicle system is truly ruining any vehicle based maps, or large scale maps that require quick effective troop transportation. the time for vehicles to start up is also getting out of hand. Troop based maps have improved, as long as they dont require too much transportation, in which case gameplay is gimped.

I know im going to be vilified for posting this, but I feel so strongly and passionately about this mod that I had to come on and say my piece. Sorry.

SteelRainFilms · Post by **SteelRainFilms** » 2007-03-02 21:00

BF2 gives few opportunities for realism, when the developers created Vanilla BF2, they certainly weren't thinking about flexibility as far as modifications go. And for as little as PR has to work with, I think they've done a fantastic job. Alot of BF2's features are pretty much hard coded & unchangeable, yet the PR team has managed to create one of the best modifications for BF2.

Seems like the people who made the above comment's didn't even know what they were downloading. They made have forgotten to read the word "REALITY".

Everyone is expecting a whole new game with PR, not realizing PR is still BF2!...same code & everything.

Jeez.

Demio · Post by **Demio** » 2007-03-02 21:03

PR was never made for the masses, and that's a good thing. Less smacktards running around.

hugekebab · Post by **hugekebab** » 2007-03-02 21:06

the argument that those who disagree with prmm changes are not part of the community is a non argument. People who play the game are part of the prmm community period, whether anyone here likes it or not. its a very clique attitude to dismiss someone's argument on the grounds of their not being 'real' prmm fans. if you like the changes, then fair enough, just recognise that many dont and that their opinion is as valid as yours.

to the PR guy, I love the reality aspects, its just that I dont like the vehicle system, it simply doesnt work!! i like high recoil, fatigue, high hit kill probability, real round effectiveness based on calibre etc etc. we are talking about the implementation here, not whether or not we want it to be reality based: im sure we all do!!

SteelRainFilms · Post by **SteelRainFilms** » 2007-03-02 21:12

What don't you like about it? Having to walk maybe 50 meters at best from your spawn point, press T & request the kit you want, then wait 30 seconds at best for an engine warm up.

Seriously if you can't handle that then you shouldn't be playing. There is nothing wrong with the current vehicle system. It's easy to understand & to the point.

They can't overhaul the whole system because you have no patience.
Not to mention it sort of promotes a more "realistic" style of play, instead of 3 medics operating a tank...oh ya tons of realism there.

hobbs · Post by **hobbs** » 2007-03-02 21:14

Erm...Kebab... that was truly a useless post...

It wasn't even constructive critism... dunno what the point of it was?
If you read these forums that are populated by the major part of the community instead of reading a forum that has basically no clue whatsoever what they are reffering to.. You might understand as Demio said, it's not for EVERYONE! You sound a bit more like a Counterstrike fan, but hey! that's ooook cause it's every man for what they like and enjoy. So if you can't provide this community with some more constructive input then what you just posted here. Don't bother.. noone likes a cry baby

Ps. Btw don't let the forum door hit you in the *** on your way out! Ds.

Clypp · Post by **Clypp** » 2007-03-02 21:23

The problem some seem to have is the 10s kill on crew seats. It only applies to driver and gunner seats in the APC and MBT.

the big J · Post by **the big J** » 2007-03-02 21:34

I agree with him to an extent. PR just isn't as realistic as it was in 0.25.

Demio · Post by **Demio** » 2007-03-02 21:36

the big J wrote:I agree with him to an extent. PR just isn't as realistic as it was in 0.1.

What? I don't think there has ever been a 0.1....

It was 0.05 and then 0.25.

Don't troll please

mrmong · Post by **mrmong** » 2007-03-02 21:36

thank god i hate it when im trying to support someone with an APC by helping out tanks in urban areas and ferrying squads about (i had to do it on my own becasue the rest of the team were fannying about with jets and helicopters COUGH DUCKHUNT GRRARG) and then some guy spawns on me and uses the gunner slot of the APC and gets us killed.. this didnt happen once he kept spawning and sort of just fired the gun but couldnt move it, i even stopped so he could grab a crewman kit but he was already a super leet snipar and didnt want to give up his kit.

the big J · Post by **the big J** » 2007-03-02 21:38

'[R-PUB wrote:Demio']What? I don't think there has ever been a 0.1....

It was 0.05 and then 0.25.

Don't troll please

I don't get where you're coming from. I never said there was a version 0.1. Although I think there was. Dolt.

mrmong · Post by **mrmong** » 2007-03-02 21:41

haha you just edited your post from 0.1 to 0.25..

this is off topic anyway.

DkMick · Post by **DkMick** » 2007-03-02 21:42

Your concerns are understandable, but I don't agree 100% with them. I do agree that many of the new features meant to improve teamwork are a tad over the top as I don't think teamwork can be forced, period. However, I personally have come to accept and enjoy .5. A huge part of that is UNDERSTANDING how the gameplay works. Going in blind is not the way to do it, you really have to read the manual and play a while in order to understand why some of the changes were made.

By the way, "don't play it" is a dumb *** thing to say. Especially from a PR guy.

Demio · Post by **Demio** » 2007-03-02 21:42

the big J wrote:I don't get where you're coming from. I never said there was a version 0.1. Although I think there was. Dolt.

You did, check my quote.

Just because you edited your post it doesn't mean I couldn't get a quote before you did it

And please remember I'm on the PR Team. If you continue to imply I'm lying you might just get the BAN Hammer.

Have a nice day,
Demio

the big J · Post by **the big J** » 2007-03-02 21:42

mrmong wrote:haha you just edited your post from 0.1 to 0.25..

this is off topic anyway.

That I did. However, there was a 0.1.

I just wanted to see if you'd notice.

Demio · Post by **Demio** » 2007-03-02 21:45

DkMick wrote:By the way, "don't play it" is a dumb *** thing to say. Especially from a PR guy.

Not really. We are pleased that our mod has achieved such a huge success but many people simple can't handle / don't like the kind of realism we are aiming for, so there are many good alternatives out there for them.

Crewman / Pilot kits are here to stay, like it or not

Post by **Duke** » 2007-03-02 21:51

Kebab, the people commenting in your post either:

a) got their facts wrong or

b)clearly arnt suited to PR

as for the facts, people dont seem to realise that the timer is for exclusively crewman kits. They also complain its not realistic, yet a 10 second timer for going out of the map on Bf2 is ?

pah

most of those guys sound just like people that we dont want playing the mod anyway, their attitudes simply are not what are appreciated in a PR environment.
Most of the yawners dont seem to realise that the mod is about team play and squad play. If they lone wolf it nilla stylie theyre just gonna get frustrated and leave. By the sound of it that was almost exclusively the type of player posting on that forum, flaming PR for not letting them getting their own hero fix, and so complain afterwards.

Thus, the reason theyre in your post in the first place, to back up your point, is nullified.
Theyre not a fair representation of the community at all, its like asking someone who just got fired for incompetance whether they like their old boss

hugekebab · Post by **hugekebab** » 2007-03-02 22:01

hobbs wrote:Erm...Kebab... that was truly a useless post...

It wasn't even constructive critism... dunno what the point of it was?
If you read these forums that are populated by the major part of the community instead of reading a forum that has basically no clue whatsoever what they are reffering to.. You might understand as Demio said, it's not for EVERYONE! You sound a bit more like a Counterstrike fan, but hey! that's ooook cause it's every man for what they like and enjoy. So if you can't provide this community with some more constructive input then what you just posted here. Don't bother.. noone likes a cry baby

Ps. Btw don't let the forum door hit you in the *** on your way out! Ds.

this is an ad hominem argument

Ive played this since the day it was released. you obviously havent read my post properly, as im not critisising all aspects of the mod just the vehicle system.

im not a cs fan, thats a pathetic response to a measured post by myself. I have played americas army since 1.0, and ghost recon/rvs. I am the definition of someone who likes realism...i just dont like the implementation of the vehicle system.

to be honest your response makes me even wonder why i bothered posting.

hugekebab · Post by **hugekebab** » 2007-03-02 22:07

why is everyone being so defensive, I didnt slate the mod or anything, i just posted an opinion on one or two aspects: We're on a forum, look the word forum up on wikipedia to see the function of a forum.

Its frankly embarrassing that people come out with the argument of 'if you dont like it dont play it' when thats clearly not what I said; i love the mod infantry wise, i just dont like the vehicle implementation.

clearly the majority like the new vehicle system which is fair enough, I'll just stick to infantry only maps, i can accept the will of the majority: but saying that I still feel I have some valid points.

to the moderator, although some opinions i pasted are as you say clearly not from reality lovers, many are moderate, pros/cons posts that have reasonable opinions, so some of them do give credence to my point of view.

Colfax · Post by **Colfax** » 2007-03-02 22:20

This game isn't for you hugekebab. The vehicle system is fine. It isn't even hard to get the crewman kit. You can get it at the vehicle. The 10 sec kill timer is a great idea because it keeps the retards from stealing away a gunner or driver spot from maybe the other guy repairing the vehicle.

The people in those posts sound like a bunch of whining babies. Tell them to go back to vanilla.

I am brand new to this Mod maybe 2 or 3 weeks new and i will never go back to vanilla. And i understand the game concepts just fine.

Has PR Lost it's way ?

Has the new vehicle system got out of hand and diminished gameplay?

Has PR Lost it's way ?