M2 SLAM

Suggestions from our community members for PR:BF2. Read the stickies before posting.
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What do you think of all this?

You SUCK! Get outta here!
5
9%
Interesting but not important.
6
11%
Nice, hope they put it in a future patch!
15
28%
I like realism A LOT. Let's do it!
27
51%
 
Total votes: 53

Oacceptabelt
Posts: 8
Joined: 2007-03-29 01:33

M2 SLAM

Post by Oacceptabelt »

I have some suggestions about the M2 SLAM. It seems to me like it works like some powerful grenade or explosives charge. Maybe this is all what's possible with the BF2 engine, but let me just add a few thoughts I have about it.

First a little review of an article I found:
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http://www.iraqslogger.com/index.php/post/1629
There is another EFP warhead mentioned in this link, the M303.
IraqSlogger wrote: the M303 is a shape charge that can knock down walls, destroy power stations and even flatten bridges.
But the M303 is considerably more powerful and heavier than the 2.2 Lb/1 Kg's M2 SLAM. A lot of information regarding the deployment and operation of M2 SLAM (and the Claymore) can be found in standard ARMY FM manuals hosted by Global Security.

More information about EFP principles at English Wikipedia and Global Security websites.

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(Picture illustrating formation of an EFP warhead. Link to the full article.)

A short sum up is that the M2 SLAM fires a relatively short-lived projectile (rather than acting like a demolitions charge) which breaks up into shrapnel at a relative short distance. It should only do limited damage to any object out of focus of it's "lens", or objects out of range. It is designed to hit an object with the explosively formed penetrator (EFP), and not blowing objects like a demolitions charge would.

Damage and the need for careful deployment

I think that the M2 SLAM should be able to do considerable damage to any lightly armored vehicle (HMMWV, Vodnik and all the rest) - not by blowing the actual vehicle into molecules but at least disabling it's movement and killing some or all of it's crew. Any APC hit at the right spot (see picture above for example) should also run some risk of having wheels/track impaired (slower speed until repaired) or disabled (sitting duck until repaired) and some of it's crew hurt. MBT's should run the risk of at least getting it's track disabled. All of the events described should of course require the M2 SLAM to explode at the right moment, angle and distance.

Any aircraft should be easily destroyed by a M2 SLAM though, since they are relatively fragile. They should also be heavily damaged or destroyed by an attached M2 SLAM (this should go for all vehicles but the APC/MBT's). This is also suggested by figure 4-6. in the standard ARMY FM manual linked above, if I understand this correct.

I have read some suggestions regarding the deployment of the EFP and its eventual detonation. I think the timer detonation is a good choice, but a secondary option to detonate it by radio control (like the claymore) would be even better. Sighting it in is not that hard and it is actually a good thing they can't be thrown any significant distance, since they are carefully planted in real life and aimed to hit crew compartment to do as must damage as possible. When deployed by timer it should also have the anti-tamper feature from real life meaning that any engineer using his wrench on it should be blown to smithereens.

The M2 SLAM should act more like a quite powerful projectile at relatively short distances then breaking up to shrapnel flying in a narrow conical path at a moderate distance. Anyone in it's close vicinity (~2 meters) should be killed or concussed from it's detonation, but light armor vehicles/aircraft out of the EFP's path or distance (which the SLAM it's not directly attached to) should not be affected. I'd rather see the M2 SLAM acting anti-material (some vehicles included) while having very limited anti-personel use.

Practical implementation in BF2 engine

The M2 SLAM could maybe fire something like a short "RPG-3 light" (RPG-3 = predecessor of RPG-7), only a lot faster and self destructing after 10 meters. Then a fragmentation blast from the point of self destruct and a moderate distance in the shape of a 10 degree cone. Is a projectile flying 10 meters in the fraction of a second, detonating and transforming into a "shaped frag grenade" impossible or very hard to do? I am looking forward to all feedback, and do vote in the poll!
Last edited by Oacceptabelt on 2007-03-29 07:05, edited 1 time in total.
Soulis6
Posts: 452
Joined: 2007-02-17 12:31

Post by Soulis6 »

I love the idea because the slams need a boost as they are now, but they can't do damaged parts (engine, treads etc) depending on hit location right now. Something could be figured out though.
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Oacceptabelt
Posts: 8
Joined: 2007-03-29 01:33

Post by Oacceptabelt »

The effective range for the M2 SLAM is actually 25 feet/~8 (7.62) meters.
I suggest fragmentation to about 15 meters, in a narrow conical pattern.

Source: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/20-32/appb.html
bobfish
Posts: 217
Joined: 2007-03-11 11:41

Post by bobfish »

Just making them do damage would be nice.. you can stick two slams on an apc and not destroy it. Whilst it may not explode them in real life, it would render them useless if it was well placed.
Superior Mind
Posts: 161
Joined: 2007-02-15 01:55

Post by Superior Mind »

Hell ya, I just saw a bit about the SLAM on the Military Channel and I was thinking the same thing. Currently the PR SLAM is just like a sticky grenade with some extra umph. Adding this feature would require some skill to properly place the SLAM.
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Soulja
Posts: 611
Joined: 2006-10-09 20:50

Post by Soulja »

I'd kinda like to see the SLAM fixed a bit.
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LeadMagnet
Retired PR Developer
Posts: 1372
Joined: 2007-02-09 20:11

Post by LeadMagnet »

It'd be nice to see it at least be able to disable and/or track a vehicle if placed correctly.

“Without Warning, Sans Remorse”
Eddie Baker
Posts: 6945
Joined: 2004-07-26 12:00

Post by Eddie Baker »

We are aware of the actual capabilities of the SLAM, but getting them to perform to those specifications is more difficult than it seems. Thanks again, EA.
Rambo Hunter
Posts: 1899
Joined: 2006-12-22 18:40

Post by Rambo Hunter »

Can you make it fire a large projectile inflicting damage? Like place it on a wall or tree like the pic, detonate it and it fires a "bullet' but have that bullet have the power of like a tank round or something? Like a sticky claymore, but with one large round
Wasteland
Posts: 4611
Joined: 2006-11-07 04:44

Post by Wasteland »

How about a KRAKATOA? Yes, I watch Future Weapons :(
Originally Posted by: ArmedDrunk&Angry
we don't live in your fantastical world where you are the super hero sent to release us all from the bondage of ignorance
Originally Posted by: [R-MOD]dunehunter
don't mess with wasteland, a scary guy will drag you into an alleyway and rape you with a baseballbat
Rambo Hunter
Posts: 1899
Joined: 2006-12-22 18:40

Post by Rambo Hunter »

JP*wasteland.soldier wrote: I watch Future Weapons :(
Shame on you
youm0nt
Posts: 4642
Joined: 2007-03-16 15:13

Post by youm0nt »

No, no, give us the Metal Storm, haha
Oacceptabelt
Posts: 8
Joined: 2007-03-29 01:33

Post by Oacceptabelt »

If there must be a choice I would opt to let the SLAM be all anti-vehicle.

What makes the landmines impair the APC/MBT traction? Couldn't the same game mechanism be used for this vehicle breakdown effect? Well, I know EA are the ones to blaim for all this. You should get insiders from Digital Illusions (etc.) to work with you! =)
Gyberg
Posts: 709
Joined: 2006-08-04 23:36

Post by Gyberg »

Fordonsmina 14 FTW! ;)
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Anthony Lloyd, himself a former soldier in the British army and a Northern Ireland and Gulf War veteran:
"The men inside (the APC) might have been UN but they were playing by a completely different set of rules. They were Swedes; in terms of individual intelligence, integrity and single-mindedness I was to find them among the most impressive soldiers I had ever encountered. In Vares their moment had come."
[3rd]Sonders
Posts: 168
Joined: 2006-04-10 01:14

Post by [3rd]Sonders »

I voted for option #5 = Too long to read.
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Teek
Posts: 3162
Joined: 2006-12-23 02:45

Post by Teek »

Oacceptabelt wrote:If there must be a choice I would opt to let the SLAM be all anti-vehicle.

What makes the landmines impair the APC/MBT traction? Couldn't the same game mechanism be used for this vehicle breakdown effect? Well, I know EA are the ones to blaim for all this. You should get insiders from Digital Illusions (etc.) to work with you! =)
disables are tiggered randomly by damage done
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MMad
Posts: 190
Joined: 2006-03-26 02:36

Post by MMad »

I never use SLAMs nowadays. Reason being, some asshat always runs up to it before it detonates and gets himself TKed..
El_Vikingo
Posts: 4877
Joined: 2006-11-27 01:50

Post by El_Vikingo »

Would you run up to a tank in battle, stick a SLAM on it and then run back again in real life? No? The SLAM isn't an anti tank weapon.

Thus, leave antitank to.....antitank?
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If you are reading this dont stop, cause if you do, I'll kick you in the balls.
LeadMagnet
Retired PR Developer
Posts: 1372
Joined: 2007-02-09 20:11

Post by LeadMagnet »

El_Vikingo wrote:Would you run up to a tank in battle, stick a SLAM on it and then run back again in real life? No? The SLAM isn't an anti tank weapon.

Thus, leave antitank to.....antitank?

Depends if you were ordered to. If you can smack 2 SLAM's on an armored vehicle that is pinning down your unit I'd do it every single time. If anything it'll give the driver pause and may even force him to withdraw and repair giving your squad to regroup.

“Without Warning, Sans Remorse”
Dylan
Posts: 3798
Joined: 2006-05-29 00:41

Post by Dylan »

As it is, it is given to special operation forces in game. It would help with sabotage. So making it work like it should would give their team a tactical advantage... Taking down heavy vehicles with it would be nice, but making them immobile... Priceless.
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