Spec Ops v0.6?

[Woody]

Edit: nevermind, got it wrong, but I would like to see those changes

[Maistros]

Oh, and watch this.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 20&q=seals

[Maistros]

Interoperability Activity is pretty common, when on deployment if not on a direct action mission being planned, they move and operate "on loan" from time to time.. pretty common. If a normal unit task needs skilled assistance then they work with them.. usually not for random or low priortity things.

[Cheeseman]

Maistros']I really can't believe how many myths about special operations units are in these threads.

Special Operators in many cases use light tactical helmets in maritime operations (PROTEC - basically skateboard helmets)
See here:

You’re correct, those are Special Forces units with “light tactical helmets”. This is because their mission probably consists of moving with stealth and self-sufficiency into the enemy territory and getting out without any notice. But when you have a situation (like in PR) where the Spec Ops unit is working with the USMC in direct combat situation, you don't have the Spec Ops units equipped with light helmets which provide almost no protection at all. The kind of equipment used by the Spec Ops depends on the type of mission, and since in PR you have the Spec Ops along side the USMC, fighting in the battlefield with limited visibility and cover then you have the Spec Ops in a different situation with different equipment suited for that particular mission. Thus they are equipped with Kevlar helmets for better protection.

Hers an example of Special Forces in such missions:




PS I know what the hell I'm talking about so please do not call my suggestions "myths".

[Maistros]

You obviously missed the other half of my post where I talked about interoperability actions.

You know, the part that says they use the same equipment as the other unit (Which would imply Kevlar helmets )

[Cheeseman]

Maistros']You obviously missed the other half of my post where I talked about interoperability actions.

You know, the part that says they use the same equipment as the other unit (Which would imply Kevlar helmets )

Ok then, why cant the Spec Ops in PR have Kevlar helmets then? I mean I'm not going into details and asking for different camouflage(special forces don't use digital/pixelated camo) and new gear, I'm just suggesting at least give them the PASGT instead of a baseball hat.

[{GD}Snake13]

BLind']why would i do that, the at kit is the best at taking out light viechles from range wen a heavy AT isn't available. What can the spec ops do that cant be done better by another kit.

And please dont say close combat, because a m16 + grenades is far better than an m4.

In your opinion, in mine the M4 is much better in close combat and I also have slams for asset destruction. I find the M4 with aim point a superior weapon to the M16 in nearly every way in game.

[Sneak Attack]

why do spec ops need kevlar helmets in PR? all the opposition carry mainly the G3 and AK-47 which it sure as hell wont stop, it might stop the 9mm and 5.56 but its like me hitting you in the head with a ballpeen hammer, it wont make a whole in your head but it will probably kill ya.

i think it should be made a limited kit as it is still abused way to much and that sucks, even when you are on the US side as that kit does NOTHING for your team. everything that can be done with that kit can be done just as good if not better with a different kit. only thing M4 does the best is draw in guys that flop to the ground when they see you and spray until they hit you with there extremely accurate gun. it should at least be made less accurate then the G3. having a US "sub class" more powerful then the MECs main weapon doesnt work out well.

[zeroburrito]

heh, g3 is the best gun in the game...by far, no recoil and cough bullets.

[lunchbox311]

Maistros']

In terms of game play I would like to see the commander deploy an object that allows for 4 kits to be requested from it. This way, the commander can place it near the squad he wants to give it to. If I were commander, I would use my comms to address the squad I see best fit for the special ops kits.. and then tell them to meet me at such and such a place.. put it down, and then they request their kits from it. After that, I destroy it so it can be placed again. Placing said object should take 5 tickets.

The special operations kit itself can consist of a carbine or SMG with an optional suppressor. By optional I mean you can select to put it on or take it off like you switch from buckshot to slugshot with the shotgun. These LIMITED special operations kit get the following

1) Knife
2) Pistol (Suppressed)
3) Carbine or SMG w/ optics (Suppressed)
4) Carbine or SMG w/ optics (Unsuppressed)
5) Smoke grenades x4
6) SLAMs x6
7) NVG
8 ) SIMRAD
9) Field Dressing x1

I love the idea for these changes. I personally do not go Spec Ops unless asked, usually going rifleman instead, but the class does have limited usefulness in aiding a sniper, helping look with the squad leader with SOFLAM and the occasional asset destruction that is fire and forget.

I agree too many people go Spec Ops, but as a limited kit I think it would fill its role as needed.

[Cheeseman]

why do spec ops need kevlar helmets in PR? all the opposition carry mainly the G3 and AK-47 which it sure as hell wont stop, it might stop the 9mm and 5.56 but its like me hitting you in the head with a ballpeen hammer, it wont make a whole in your head but it will probably kill ya.

i think it should be made a limited kit as it is still abused way to much and that sucks, even when you are on the US side as that kit does NOTHING for your team. everything that can be done with that kit can be done just as good if not better with a different kit. only thing M4 does the best is draw in guys that flop to the ground when they see you and spray until they hit you with there extremely accurate gun. it should at least be made less accurate then the G3. having a US "sub class" more powerful then the MECs main weapon doesnt work out well.

You ask why the Spec Ops need a helmet? BECAUSE IN REALITY THEY WEAR IT. So what if it doesn't stop a large caliber round at all times? It’s like asking, why does the US Army or the USMC even bother to wear the Kevlar helmets or vests when they don’t always stop 7.62x39 or 7.62x51 rounds from penetrating. That’s a stupid thing to ask. It might not stop a bullet at all times, but it’s still better than a baseball cap. Plus I'm not suggesting the implementation of the PASGT helmet because of protection reasons alone; I'm suggesting that in real life situations Spec Ops wear Kevlar helmets in combat duty, rather than a hat. This fact alone should be enough for a reality mod to support.

Also there have been quite bit of times in Iraq were the PASGT helmet has stoped a 7.62x54mm round and as a result saving the soldiers life. Hers one:


Direct link: http://www.defendamerica.mil/profiles/n ... 0205b.html

[[WAW]TOTENKOPF]

in PR Most maps that the USMC are a part of, involve large scale operations.These are not Air Force CCTs, green berets, seals on stealthy operations.I t involves full blown Armor/Aircraft assaults. They should be kitted for the job. For example more body armor, pasgt helmets, modded m4s
(possible m14 SOPMODs ).

THE MAIN ISSUE HOWEVER THIS REALY DOESNT EFFECT GAMEPLAY.It would however be asthetically pleasing .

my 2 cents

[Maistros]

That's if they're around the lines, or doing direct actions with the larger unit involved in the larger scale battle.

In game, if I had a squad of special operations kits I would be getting inserted well behind those dangerous lines and doing recon/demo. Now with commander placeable objects there are important objectives that would warrant such behind the lines missions. Seek out assets and destroy them, then kill their commander.

The point I think in limiting them, and giving them less armor would be to discourage them from being front line assault.

[Cheeseman]

Maistros']That's if they're around the lines, or doing direct actions with the larger unit involved in the larger scale battle.

In game, if I had a squad of special operations kits I would be getting inserted well behind those dangerous lines and doing recon/demo. Now with commander placeable objects there are important objectives that would warrant such behind the lines missions. Seek out assets and destroy them, then kill their commander.

The point I think in limiting them, and giving them less armor would be to discourage them from being front line assault.

Will actually they'll be in greater danger when "behind dangerous enemy lines" and since your suggesting that the Spec Ops be a limited kit, then this means the job has to be done right the first time and that means they actually need better protection to be able to get the job done the first time.

[EagleEyeLG]

Guys, enough with calling special forces a "noob kit". It's not. I find myself, as well as squad mates doing just as well with any other kit as with the spec ops kit. I have found them incredibly useful in taking out enemy rally points and spotting enemy movement with the binocs.

The M4 is about equal in lethality as the M16; much of this depends on who is using either weapon.

If any kit should be considered the "noob kit", it should be the grenadier kit or even the basic AT kit.

You all are talking about how the spec ops kit should be a limited kit. If this is the case, then every kit should be limited as you never have more than a few medics, engineers, or anti-tank personnel. Sure there shouldn't be as many spec ops guys running around the battlefield, but making it a limited kit, in my opinion, is taking it too far.

If everyone thinks it's still "unbalanced", then put more effort towards balancing it, not limiting it or eliminating it altogether.

Before anyone calls me a spec ops whore, I rarely use it, but if I find a need or an urge to play it, I will.

BLind']exactly. the only people who take spec ops are those who want to spray with the m4. If you want to blow stuff up and cuase havoc behnd enemy lines then engineer is far more effiecient, and any class can be stealthy, theres really no excuse. Thats why if any1 dares take spec ops in one my squads they fined themselves kicked instantly.

If the member of your squad that is spec ops is sticking with the squad and following orders, there should be no reason to kick them. It's all about preference. If you were to kick anyone, it should be whoever takes the grenadier kit (which I don't consider to be a "noob kit", although I believe it to be the closest to a "noob kit" in the game).

[Maistros]

Will actually they'll be in greater danger when "behind dangerous enemy lines" and since your suggesting that the Spec Ops be a limited kit, then this means the job has to be done right the first time and that means they actually need better protection to be able to get the job done the first time.

Well they can be careful and get it right the first time regardless of what they're wearing. Bottom line is that in real life, in those types of situations they don't roll out with full third line gear. They have to be much more mobile and able to blend in.. hard to do when you look like a really big rock.

Aside from that, to balance the kits out in game they would not be given heavy armor. They just aren't that kinda thing, and I'm pretty sure the DEVs do not intend them to be, either.

They're in equal danger but for different reasons. No danger is worse or greater than the other, but being sneaky behind the lines is better because they don't know you're coming.. and you know where they are, and they don't know where you are. In a front line situation, it's the opposite. You don't always know where they are, just that you're taking fire. You have more control in your hands over the level of danger when you're being the sneaky ones.

[Woody]

I still say we go to the option of REMOVING that kit and replacing it with something better. If not take off the kit give them heavy body armor and take away the M4. Or change the class to like an Artillery Officer or something like that.

[EagleEyeLG]

Woody']Or change the class to like an Artillery Officer or something like that.

And when exactly would an artillery officer be of use in-game?

If the artillery officer would be in charge of artillery strikes, then I would say that would be excruciatingly boring waiting for arty strikes to "reload".

[Woody]

I mean carry around a SOFLAM with a stand cause those things are heavy. They call the strike and it comes. maybe a like 3 minute wait for reload. limited to like 3 kits.