Structurizing squads

[AnRK]

My god he is a Communist!!!

For satirical purposes a politicised translation of the above...

'The workers of the world are ignorant and must be guided into a situation in which their exploitation is not possible!'

[dbzao]

Ok, I will reply to the goals of your suggestions, and not the suggestions themselves. These are my replies, not the dev team ones.

-Prevent mixed squads, make sure they are infantry only, armour only or air only

The squad leader is responsible for this. If he needs an infantry only squad, is his problem to make that work. If he can't control his squad members, he's not a good squad leader or probably he doesn't have good squad members.

-Realistic loadouts for squads: No silly squads with too many of one type of kit

In v0.6 we have squad limitation of limited kits. You can only have 2 of each limited kit in the squad. I think it should be lowered to one specially for kits like sniper, HAT and HAA, but at least for the open beta we are playing with this number.

-Stop people from joining a squad just to be able to request a certain kit

In v0.6 we have the 2 min rule. If your are joining a squad for the second time or more in that round you will have to wait 2 min before being able to request a limited kit. In that time you (squad leader) can notice if he's just trying to request a kit and bail, or if he's really wanting to play with the squad.

-Make it easier for the commander to effectively command by being able to order around important units like snipers directly

This is good and usually squads that want to play as a specific unit like armor, attack helicopters, snipers, etc, already create their own squads and lock them to the limit necessary to be efficient. It's not always like that, but it's getting more common.

[Apheirox]

Nobody likes restrictions, but what it boils down to is a choice, and a fairly simple one: On public servers, in a realism/teamwork-oriented mod, do you want freedom to roam about as you like willy-nilly or do you want organized play? In case of the latter, there is no way around imposing restrictions.

Oh, and if we can stop the smack talk I would greatly appreciate it.

[ArmedDrunk&Angry]

The smack talk comes from your attitude.

Your grand theory now has more holes than Swiss cheese.
I think the consensus is that yes, we want the freedom to roam around willy nilly because believe it or not freedom of action can benefit teamwork.

I'm trolling ? WTF I am Grendel ?

Your idea sucks because nobody wants some holier than thou uber brain "guiding" them.
If we did ......we would sign right up for your army.

Make a poll and wait 2 days .... if I am wrong I will aplogize on bended knee.

Nobody wants fools playing.

All your rules would do is force fools to play with certain kits.

It has been said many times before........you can not mod the players.

[[uBp]Irish]

worst idea i've ever heard.

Stop trying to limit what the player can do. You're eliminating choice from a game. Go play Americas Army if you want squad structure. In PR that's left up to squads that actually want to succeed.

[Long Bow]

Nobody likes restrictions, but what it boils down to is a choice, and a fairly simple one: On public servers, in a realism/teamwork-oriented mod, do you want freedom to roam about as you like willy-nilly or do you want organized play? In case of the latter, there is no way around imposing restrictions.

Oh, and if we can stop the smack talk I would greatly appreciate it.

Ok so we implement all your rules and clearly define everyones roles. So what happens the very first round when, to use your words, people run around "willy-nilly" in well defined roles? What then?

Please don't be so niave as to believe that you have found the cure for the common smacktard . Usually new players learn the mod quickly by being taken under the wing of a good squad, not from reading the QM messages and death from the APC seat. I get what your saying and some of it could be good but you are approaching this with such a rigid frame work. If we had 60-80 people per team then I could see having more defined roles and squad rules as you outlined. But we need to improvise sometimes, stay dynamic to overcome certain obstacles and limitations inherint to the low team #'s.

As AD&A said

It has been said many times before........you can not mod the players.

[AnRK]

Wooo!

Better dead then Red!!! Black Army FTW! etc.

[theSASTA]

i love the idea of limitting the SPEC OPS kit and implement the SUPPORT into standard squad kit layout
that way EVERY SQUAD would at least get a heavy machine gun.... like it is in most real squads.
/smack me if im wrong....
*puts on helmet*

[dbzao]

/smack... you obviously didn't play PR 0.4... Unlimited support is gameplay suicide.

People don't use support because they just don't request them. There's enough support for all infantry squads. At least in 0.6 because we have a little bug in 0.5 that sometimes can make this not a true statement.

[AnRK]

Innit.

As a technicality it's a light machine gun in standard squads not heavy, unless you have an army comprised of clones of the meaty bugger from Predator, Is what he does even physically possible for a guy even of his weight?

[mammikoura]

1) PR already imposes heavy restrictions on what players can do. You get kicked from most servers for not joining a squad, you die if you remain in driver/gunner seat without kit. The quartermaster even gets annoyed and will not talk to you for two minutes if you spam too much and asks you to read the manual.

2) There are no [public] servers with smart people only.

1. Yeah. Some servers do kick for not joining a squad. But that's up to the server admins. And there are very good reasons for killing people who stay too long on the drivers/gunners position without the right kit. Well more like there are many reasons for having those kits, the only reason for the auto-kill is that noobs don't stay in the vehicle trying to figure out why it doesn't shoot.
And I believe the QM is there to stop radio spam.

And those are all pretty small changes compared to what you are suggesting.
Another problem is that even now half of the players haven't even looked at the guide. Don't you think adding more rules would only make it harder for people to learn them all?

2. Maybe not so that everyone is smart, but you can definitely find servers where most of the population has some kind of idea what the word teamwork means. And if not you can always join a clan/community/something so you can always get into a great squad.

[theSASTA]

dbzao']/smack... you obviously didn't play PR 0.4...

nope.. started this whole MOD THINGY at 0.5
since someone wrote that kits get limited acces inside squads in 0.6... why not limit the SUPPORT CLASS to 1 inside a SQUAD which consists of at least 4 guys ? or raise the maximum number of those limitted SUPPORT KITS (which u gotta request) dynamically to the number of squads which are active on the BF ?

*puts-helmet-back-on*

[Apheirox]

Hey now, remember that I am not asking for unlimited support. I did not play 0.4 but I can easily imagine what a disaster that must have been!

[[T]waylay00]

So, you could in fact not find a flaw. You are just trolling. But that is ok - hey, welcome to /ignore!

Talking to me?

Actually, Waylay: While there certainly are 'idiots' most players belong in the 'inexperienced, casual' category. They try their best but just do not know any better. With my suggestions these players are 'guided' into doing the right thing such as not creating a squad where everybody is a sniper or where the squad leader decides to leave his subjects in base and take the jet for a spin. Is it not what we all want?

That's what the PR Player's Guide is for.

[ArmedDrunk&Angry]

The SAW or it's equivalent is limited to squads with 3 or more as are most of the kits.
If we get a 128p server then rigid guidelines might be useful but since the max is 64 and often far less we need to be flexible to deal with changing game conditions.


I am an idiot............ I prefer to learn from experience and other players and do not want "guidance" and frankly resist most attempts to "guide" me.

[blud]

Well I'm not reading any of this, but based on the topic title, is this something about strategery?

[[LTC] Gunther.S [4SFG]]

I kick, but the vast majority do not. I know it is sad but I fear they need a helping hand.

So you do kick people, yet you dont lock your squad? That is silly, usually if their noobish enough to get kicked. They would instantly rejoin over and over again.

So I bet you do lock squads, to your benefit and the squads also. You dont realize it but your ideas will only reduce gameplay and probably reduce effectiveness.

[ArmedDrunk&Angry]

To quote Dio " If you listen to fools.... the Mob Rules !