The rifleman kit...

[Corrient]

Is it just me, or now that every rifleman kit has a scope (or in the case of the Marines, a high zoom) does it seem like firefights are less intense?

I mean, you can SNIPE with these things. It's like having a semi/fully automatic sniper rifle which almost completely negates the usefulness of kits like the support kit on anything but urban maps. The second the support kit opens up, people see tracers, and headshot the poor sod before he knows what's going on.

[$kelet0r]

it's a limitation of the engine
the problem is that the weapons can and are that accurate but the timing and patience needed to achieve that cannot be represented in game without making the weapons horribly inaccurate because weapon sway and breathing cannot be implemented at all.

[Outlawz7]

Theres still enough recoil to go with.

[Cheeseman]

That’s the point. PR is trying to back away from Rambo style game play. People will think twice before running in the open and risk of getting shot by someone 100 meters away. People are encouraged to find appropriate cover and work together to scan the area for enemy threats before engaging towards their objectives.

[wazza_ni]

I mean, you can SNIPE with these things. It's like having a semi/fully automatic sniper rifle which almost completely negates the usefulness of kits like the support kit on anything but urban maps. The second the support kit opens up, people see tracers, and headshot the poor sod before he knows what's going on.

I think thats going a bit over the top...

What the devs are going for is more long range combat which is why theyve increased the view distance. Not that ive been in too many combat situations (actually none - im basing my point on alot of war footage ive seen) but alot of it is taking well placed shots at enemy that are several hundred metres away. And from the few games I got to play on the last Beta (namely Kashan Desert) i was well chuffed with the results.

Yea, if your lying in an exposed position and you start spraying an enemy position with the SAW your gonne be vulnerable to fire. But like cheeseman said, its about finding the right cover first before you open up on your opponent.

[Corrient]

Even behind cover (logs, wedged between rocks, etc) somebody can still zoom in, duck behind a hill/cover a sec, pop up to see where you are, duck, adjust where they are aiming accordingly, and then let go of duck and pop you right in the noggin.

When I mean firefight, I don't mean spray and pray idiocy either, but the way the current rifleman kit works (automatic marksman kit...) minimizes such things as cover fire and well... machine guns in general since their accuracy is so piss poor over any sort of range.

I much preferred the .5 version of the rifleman kit. Still very useful, but without being scoped, it didn't have the amazing advantage over other kits in combat situations that it does now.

[Xmaster]

Is it just me, or now that every rifleman kit has a scope (or in the case of the Marines, a high zoom) does it seem like firefights are less intense?

I mean, you can SNIPE with these things. It's like having a semi/fully automatic sniper rifle which almost completely negates the usefulness of kits like the support kit on anything but urban maps. The second the support kit opens up, people see tracers, and headshot the poor sod before he knows what's going on.

It makes you think twice before giving away your position.

[VipersGhost]

I thought these same things until I got some good time in on Seven Gates with a decent squad. The support gun owned and functioned very well. The engagement distances and number of scoped weapons is fairly accurate. We got into plenty of firefights and the use of smoke is now a REQUIREMENT instead of a suggestion. I loved the game machanics of the rifleman kit and thought things were well balanced. Yeah you can't stand or sit out in the open any more which is nice. Everyone has to have some cover or move well...position matters now not who can run and gun the best. Firefights are real now...when you here a bullet hit near you...get your head down or the next will put you down and by all means you better stick with your squad...there is no more of this darting all over the place until you find some guys and then dodge out with the fast-unrealistic movements. Now you have to man up and cover your buddies and make it work.

[{GD}Ghost]

Are you telling me that none of the basic rifleman kits are iron sites only?!

I am a hardcore believer in iron sites and have learned to use them well even at longer distances. Yes, it takes a bit more skill than relying on a scope. If this is true, is this not a step away from realism? From what I know, a normal rifleman squad is not issued scopes unless one or two of them are designated marksmen.

[Ecko]

I find the longer range better tbh.

I've had some 5 min fire fights without either parties dieing.

[Masaq]

The British army issues a 4x scope as standard with the SA80, I believe.

[Outlawz7]

Are you telling me that none of the basic rifleman kits are iron sites only?!

I am a hardcore believer in iron sites and have learned to use them well even at longer distances. Yes, it takes a bit more skill than relying on a scope. If this is true, is this not a step away from realism? From what I know, a normal rifleman squad is not issued scopes unless one or two of them are designated marksmen.

Use the Medic. Has no optics, but still useful - a lot

[VipersGhost]

Hey Ghost, yeah I thought it was kind of strange than most soliders are now going to have pretty decent scopes. I didn't think this was realistic but from what I've been told the Dev's got it right...they said that most rifleman, which make up the core of your squad, have access to scopes. You really should just get on and play it with the improvements and changes...not everyone has a scope in a squad and its not like you are extremly extra effective with one too. Once you play it you will see.

[Outlawz7]

Yeah, and everyone, that comes from vBF2, wants the sniper kits. You got the rifleman with better optics than the vBF2 scopes, ffs

[Lampshade111]

I find long range firefights rather boring so I use cover and flank the enemy to get close whenever possible. Most firefights take place at rather short ranges in real life anyway.

[Rick_the_new_guy]

The engagement distances and number of scoped weapons is fairly accurate. We got into plenty of firefights and the use of smoke is now a REQUIREMENT instead of a suggestion. I loved the game machanics of the rifleman kit and thought things were well balanced. Yeah you can't stand or sit out in the open any more which is nice. Everyone has to have some cover or move well...position matters now not who can run and gun the best. Firefights are real now...when you here a bullet hit near you...get your head down or the next will put you down and by all means you better stick with your squad...there is no more of this darting all over the place until you find some guys and then dodge out with the fast-unrealistic movements. Now you have to man up and cover your buddies and make it work.

@ the Public Realtions community for PR.

Check out that quote, feel free to use parts of it to promote .6. This is the kind of player base we need for the mod.

[Alex6714]

The scope is nice, but try using it in reasonably close quarters on automatic, its harder then, or at least for me it is. You need some one to assault those bunkers!

[Dunehunter]

At really close ranges, just fire without zooming in. It usually works for me.

[AOD_Morph]

I find long range firefights rather boring so I use cover and flank the enemy to get close whenever possible. Most firefights take place at rather short ranges in real life anyway.

Average distance for a firefight IRL is about 200 meters.
In urban combat its about 60 meters.
Forgot where i got these numbers, but try to take my word it was a good source

[{GD}Ghost]

I have found both in vBF2 and PR that it is always better to engage at range. When you do, it is truely the person with superior marksmanship skills that win those firefights.

While I don't agree that people should have to be lured into longer range fire fights by handing out scopes to most, I guess if it works, it works.

I can't wait to try it.