2 versions of PR ?

[-=TB=-Schrotti]

Hello,

might it be possible that you provide us 2 versions? 1 with the new license and 1 without it. To be precise: 0.6 with licence and 1 older version without. I thought of version 0.3 which was in my eyes the best 1 and really was fun to play.
F.e. good recoil system, no strange rules, easy to understand, nice maps with a good ammount of urban combat (Muttrah city).

The community would have got 2 versions available:
PR action
PR strategy

The newest version (0.6) should of course be seen as the most important one, with the note that it is the up-to-date version. And besides that the older one with the note that it's the version which is more focussed on action.

I'd like to provide a server and even the possibility to download the content.

Greetings
Schrotti

[77SiCaRiO77]

..my god.

[youm0nt]

Probably not going to happen... Too much work and the playing community would be split which isn't good.

[Top_Cat_AxJnAt]

TB Schrotti you are here for hardcore realism and tactics or you are not here atall!


O and any way 0.6 firefights are far more "action packed", they just require alittle more skill to win in!

[Gaz]

Past builds of public releases are still available. AFAIK 0.3 is still accessable from Filefront and the likes.

We cannot, and would have no intention of trying to stop you running the likes of a 0.3 server, but you would get no official support or advertisement from the team.

We like to think forwards as opposed to backwards I don't think the team is willing to put future energy and resources into a 'PR for pussies', or watered down version

[eggman]

It would be too much work. We have identified a need to broaden the appeal of PR.. but ... a lil differently than what you are suggesting.

We're looking at what we have today as a baseline and looking to create some enhancements to that which would appeal to the more hardcore realism players. But it won't be anything like the v0.3x releases nor would it be a separate installation... more like a game mode that some servers would run exclusively that would likely appeal to the more hardcore gamers.

[Xmaster]

Are you serious Schrotti?! Thats the worst thing I've heard as of yet today.

[hall0]

Schrotti i also think its a bad idea. The guys who dont want to play pr like it is they should play somethink else.

[blud]

@OP, if you want 0.3, then just go get it.

[jackal22]

erm im not taking any sides here but isnt 0.3 well actually all versions up to 0.5 available to the public on various hosts anyway? i mean without them being content locked...

come to think of it i still have 0.3 to 5 on my pc in various folders, but i have to say i enjoyed 0.4 the most, yeh the m4 was annoying but it was satisfying when you killed them and masthur was more fun imo. and mutrah i prefered mutrah better as well

[Hx.Clavdivs]

I am not 100% sure, but I think what he is trying to say is that PR is of late become much more complex than the first releases.

The 0.3 was much more "Takes a minute to learn, and a lifetime to master".

0.6 is more like "Takes a minute to find the manual, 15 minutes to read, couple hours of waiting around for a good size server, then in the middle of the game get flamed because you just don't remember one point written in the manual."

Back to the main point again. I don't think he's saying anything AGAINST PR or the PR way, just maybe "dumb" it down a bit again.

[VipersGhost]

To me PR is easy if you are a grunt...if you dont want to be a grunt then you better study up and learn a few things and get some experience. PR as a grunt is simple, all you need to know is how to use the bandages and to not sit in an APC gunner...other than that its pretty explainitory. You dont' have to use the limited kits, rifleman is pretty deadly. PR is complex at times but still has pretty dumbed down basics. No run and gun anymore though, people will have problems with this and I love it!

[101 bassdrive]

like claudius said.. for somebody who comes from vanilla and stumbles upon PR 0.6 the learning curve will be immense. adapting to 0.5 already took a while.
not the actual gameplay will be the off-putting thing but the 20thousand rules which take a good ammount of time to internalise.
schrotti I believe I understand why you want 0.3 back and would like to call it PR action.
quite often the OB arent well filled and 20-30 percent of the players still dont know for sure whats going on so the gameplay can be, how should I say, though.
but when your TB server and all others change to 0.6 I believe the glory days of tactical action will return.

[AfterDune]

I agree with VipersGhost. If you think things are too complicated, just be a squad like you used to. You don't -need- to use all of the .6 features. The only thing you "walk into" is the crewman kit and the new RP system.
I find all features fantastic, but if you prefer to keep things a bit more simple, stick with what I said above (or run a .3 server, though I doubt anyone will join that..)

You can also take a look at USI?

As far as two versions.. don't think that's a good idea. PR is PR and stays that way. It's not "PR" and "PR-". There's a very good reason for the new .6 license, which I fully back up.

[Long Bow]

PR 0.6 Full bodied with a bold finish and nutty after taste. Assaults the palet.

PR Light All the flavour you know and love with half the calories and no after taste.

[T0M@field]

First of all:
For german board users its complicated to write proper english to get some respect. Schrotti may tell you more if anyone could understand german

But back to topic:
It think Clavdivs got the piont:

...The 0.3 was much more "Takes a minute to learn, and a lifetime to master".

0.6 is more like "Takes a minute to find the manual, 15 minutes to read, couple hours of waiting around for a good size server, then in the middle of the game get flamed because you just don't remember one point written in the manual."

For me it got more complicated or just time expansive to learn these new rules everytime when i got a new beta/public version.
Some infos are even wrong or missing in the wiki.
So I think PR has an information problem...
I've never heard before that i've to read a wiki in order to play well.
Its no problem, dont misunderstand me, but these infos are not mentioned ingame. Thats a barrier for many... I think everyone knows that many (and of course even some here in the board reading this ) just get a DL-link in their messenger. Even these potential players are worth it to explain to them how to play well
Why doesnt the mod team implemente this tutorial-voice of vBF2 with text explanation (when playing a new release the first time)? that would be very helpful!

My first advice I got from my informatics professor was: "Keep it simple and easy".
Many rules make sense and are logicaly traceable.
But some dont make sense on the first look or are too complex so that even talented drivers/pilots never dare to drive a tank or fly a plane/helo.
I mean, these rules make sense... in a war situation but not on a public server.

In other words: I dont wanna "fight against rules". I would prefer realistic driving physics and vehicels which are difficult to handle with less punish rules for these who didnt read the wiki.
I dont wanna e.g. a F-16 waiting for X-Mas to get ready for take off without any advice... but more often than not a smacktard sticks a C4 or Slam on the plane before you can take off - priceless^^
Or why doesnt SM spawn in the air instead of "crawling out of a pile of backpacks"?

I know the devs are just developing many new rules and features in order to solve old glitches and bugs...but PLEASE keep it simple and easy.
And a game which claims to be realistic is a paradoxon - i know.

I hope none will take this critisim personally or think i wanna flame - its meant to be constructive.
I love this mod and theres no other mod which is kicking *** like PR.

Thors Brigade and its community is discussing every day (and night^^) and everyone is invited to discuss with us.
As in the beginning of this large text mentioned many german players are to shy to write into this board.
So please be nice to these few who dare to write.

THX

[Long Bow]

T0M@field']
My first advice I got from my informatics professor was: "Keep it simple and easy".
Many rules make sense and are logicaly traceable.
But some dont make sense on the first look or are too complex so that even talented drivers/pilots never dare to drive a tank or fly a plane/helo.
I mean, these rules make sense... in a war situation but not on a public server.

THX

I think your right about the guide being behind the times. It isn't always up to date with all the changes and sometimes the rules are a little buried in the guide.

I believe the reason the game has complex rules now is becuase this is a mod to an unfriendly game engine. The Devs are constantly using work arounds and odd solutions to a seemingly simple problem. It's not that they have a perverse desire to go about modding this way but have to be creative in getting to the end result, the end justifys the means in this case. Simple things like needing a crewman kit to operate a vehicle, they can't stop you from entering the vehicle so they have to kill you to accomplish this.


Project Reality Devs - The purveyors of "Duct Tape and Zip-ties" BF2 modding They use what they have to make it happen.

[AfterDune]

T0M@field']First of all:
For german board users its complicated to write proper english to get some respect. Schrotti may tell you more if anyone could understand german

Ye, I know. Not only Germans though . But it's okay. Good thing to point it out btw.

T0M@field']For me it got more complicated or just time expansive to learn these new rules everytime when i got a new beta/public version.
Some infos are even wrong or missing in the wiki.
So I think PR has an information problem...

I thought I read something somewhere about the Wiki being reviewed? Not sure. But we all can do that you know. We are a community and you, me, we can edit what we want. But I guess we need to grow on that a bit more.

T0M@field']I've never heard before that i've to read a wiki in order to play well.
Its no problem, dont misunderstand me, but these infos are not mentioned ingame.

No offense intended, but have you never ever had to read the guide or the 'book' that came with a game? Some games come with entire books you have to look at, in order to play the game right.

T0M@field']Thats a barrier for many... I think everyone knows that many (and of course even some here in the board reading this ) just get a DL-link in their messenger. Even these potential players are worth it to explain to them how to play well

True. But same as I wrote above. And it's okay to just play like you want, but you have to "agree" on not using te "not so simple" things (things you need to learn for, or at least get a feeling of what needs to be done).

T0M@field']Why doesnt the mod team implemente this tutorial-voice of vBF2 with text explanation (when playing a new release the first time)? that would be very helpful!

True. Tutorials would be awesome. A (downloadable/web-viewable) video-tutorial would be great, which is much easier than setting up a full tutorial in-game, I think.

T0M@field']My first advice I got from my informatics professor was: "Keep it simple and easy".
Many rules make sense and are logicaly traceable.
But some dont make sense on the first look or are too complex so that even talented drivers/pilots never dare to drive a tank or fly a plane/helo.
I mean, these rules make sense... in a war situation but not on a public server.

But these rules and realistic stuff is -I think- what makes this game so great. I think those tutorials can really add to this. This way people can just view a video about how something is done and a few minutes later, they can implement it in-game. Awesome .

T0M@field']In other words: I dont wanna "fight against rules". I would prefer realistic driving physics and vehicels which are difficult to handle with less punish rules for these who didnt read the wiki.

What I said above .

T0M@field']I dont wanna e.g. a F-16 waiting for X-Mas to get ready for take off without any advice... but more often than not a smacktard sticks a C4 or Slam on the plane before you can take off - priceless^^
Or why doesnt SM spawn in the air instead of "crawling out of a pile of backpacks"?

That last thing is pretty annoying. The first thing about taking off which takes time... well.... it's more realistic than instantly being able to take off?
Learning how to fly isn't easy too. That takes time, just like all the other things.

T0M@field']
I know the devs are just developing many new rules and features in order to solve old glitches and bugs...but PLEASE keep it simple and easy.

Being a grunt is easy, just do your grunt-thing and get into the action. If you want more, you have to learn. It's just like real-life .

T0M@field']And a game which claims to be realistic is a paradoxon - i know.
I hope none will take this critisim personally or think i wanna flame - its meant to be constructive.
I love this mod and theres no other mod which is kicking *** like PR.

I agree. And no offense taken, my friend . I'm sure others agree on that.

T0M@field']Thors Brigade and its community is discussing every day (and night^^) and everyone is invited to discuss with us.
As in the beginning of this large text mentioned many german players are to shy to write into this board.
So please be nice to these few who dare to write.

THX

I hope I was nice . Perhaps I sound offending here and there, but I totally don't mean to be so. I'm just stating that... to me it's obvious to learn how to play. Learning, practicing and doing it in the action is what makes me feel good, really (and it's not like I have all the time in the world)

Good luck gaming! (and to all who feel like Tom)