Militia unique deployables

Harrod200 · Post by **Harrod200** » 2007-09-09 18:11

Since militia (rightly) cannot place standard deployables like bunkers, sandbags, wire etc, how about something less effective but still useful that they faesibly could deploy without needing the logistics of a regular army;

Road block; Burned out (possibly burning to cause damage), immovable car. Would block vehicle access across a road (like Sandbags) and cause mild infantry damage (Razorwire), but would require some form of building and maybe a molotov to set it burning (but it doesn't stop burning once started). Same way to get rid of it as anything else; big gun shooting it enough destroys it in a similar way to the burned out hull of a destroyed vehicle.

Foxhole; Not sure how realistic it would be, but a spawn point for troops. No kit request but low profile; no sound and appearing to be underground, low visuals. Destroyed by single grenade. Very limited number per round, not just at once; a limit of how many can be deployed in the whole round so once they're gone they're gone. Must be deployed >100m from a CP. Built with shovel.

Cache; Spawn point (similar GFX to current Insurgent RP) for a single RPG & PKM (possibly Mosin Nagant), provides ammo. Again, limited number per round and must be 'repaired' before weapons spawn. >100m from a CP.

All those could be setup by a Militia with little in the way of preparation, and would be in line with guerrilla warfare tactics.

[EDIT] Sorry, title should be Militia, not Insurgent; forgot which was which

ops:

Reddish Red · Post by **Reddish Red** » 2007-09-09 19:51

Hi Harrod.

Anyway, I think only Roadblock and Cache will work, since something about Mapping for Foxhole (Fill in). Oh and i would love to see Roadblocks, and maybye some roadblocks that act as Barbed wire (Aka Flaming tires etc)

Harrod200 · Post by **Harrod200** » 2007-09-09 19:59

Ello red *waves*

Foxholes (only said that cos couldn't think of anything that a militia may use, and they could hide camoflaged until the enemies hoved into view) would work in exactly the same way as a Firebase does now for the regulars (minus the kit request, since militia don't have any);

Placed
Built
Spawned on

But a maximum of for example 5 per round (random number that), so as soon as one is destroyed it is gone and cannot be rebuilt. It wouldn't affect map development & balance any more than a firebase or RP does now, it would just be more discrete and not squad-locked like an RP

DarkTalon · Post by **DarkTalon** » 2007-09-10 01:09

I think we could get foxholes to work, something like this

the red part is the part touching the ground (origin) that would determine the height of the foxhole.

it's more like a crater, but it's the closest thing we could do next to editing the map in-game.

Harrod200 · Post by **Harrod200** » 2007-09-10 09:16

You're thinking too big

I was thinking along the lines of a barely man-sized 'hole' image, not actually a structure going into the ground, a small crater (easily missed unless you are actively looking for it, not much bigger in diameter than a person's x-section from above). It's not a defensive structure, it's a deployed (very weak) Militia spawn point, taking the place of bunkers and firebases.

-=TB=-ante9383 · Post by **-=TB=-ante9383** » 2007-09-10 14:15

Wow, those are some great ideas, Harrod!

I support this notion!

hx.bjoffe · Post by **hx.bjoffe** » 2007-09-10 14:25

I agree to that both Militia and Insurgents need to be able to build something, at least some hinder in the path for both infantery and vehicles.
Get the shovels out!

Harrod200 · Post by **Harrod200** » 2007-09-10 15:48

I don't think Insurgents should get anything, after all they're supposed to be a poorly organised rabble who have just picked up a gun to fight the invaders. A Militia though has some organisation and should at least be able to use what they have on hand (cars etc) to hinder the enemy.

General Dragosh · Post by **General Dragosh** » 2007-09-10 17:19

Great idea the foxhole..........id like that it looks like..hmmm i dont know how to describe, mabye a small camo-net on the ground...!

[EC]DR.NOobFragger · Post by **[EC]DR.NOobFragger** » 2007-09-10 18:00

that sounds like a good idea and in Black Hawk Down i remember those guys setting heavy stuff in the roads and stuff so why couldnt some insurgents do it?

Hardtman · Post by **Hardtman** » 2007-09-10 18:15

'[EC wrote:DR.NOobFragger;481249']that sounds like a good idea and in Black Hawk Down i remember those guys setting heavy stuff in the roads and stuff so why couldnt some insurgents do it?

Although you are right, you should best be wary of getting "facts" from movies in the future. Even BHD, which is very realistic for a movie, has some errors.
I don't want to rant, just some friendly advise

.

On topic: I do also like the idea of unique deployables. Maybe we could distinguish the roadblocks of militia and insurgents in the way they are set up:
While the insurgents just pile random stuff(sofas,TVs,Chairs,Tables,whatever) until it's big enough, Militia's barricades should look as if they were constructed with a plan in mind. Say, a car as "basement", suppurted by some logs behind it or such. Also, we have to keep in mind that both factions have only limited access to the materials.
While the insugents are easy because aforementioned stuff is easy to get, Militia does not has acces to such, at least not in Mestia (and I seem to remember somebody saying that future maps for militia won't be urban maps either), so here it would mostly consist of wooden constructs, maybe a car, although they probably not have enough of those to "waste" em in a barricade.

DarkTalon · Post by **DarkTalon** » 2007-09-11 01:00

'[EC wrote:DR.NOobFragger;481249']that sounds like a good idea and in Black Hawk Down i remember those guys setting heavy stuff in the roads and stuff so why couldnt some insurgents do it?

try not to mention BHD here, you'll get eaten alive.

SuperTimo · Post by **SuperTimo** » 2007-09-11 16:01

insted of foxholes what about a Bivvy area for Milita?

A bivvy is a shelter made with a sheet or poncho that is tyed to trees with bungies.
Basicly there would only be one area allowed per game and would consist of 3 or 4 bivvies (2 trees with a poncho or cam net over 2 bungies tied to the trees) and maybe a stove and some weapon props.

This could be an alternative spawn point for Milita which would fit in with the forest whilst still being realistic as it could simulate a staging point for an OP (observation point) or operation.

The milita could spawn there request Kits and get ammo and possibly get weapons pickups.

Thats my idea i also like the ideas of roadblocks and cahces nice going!

Harrod200 · Post by **Harrod200** » 2007-09-11 16:16

The problem with a bivvy would be how obvious it is, my idea of a foxhole is for something very low profile that is a fairly high value asset/target.

Currently RP's are found by sound most of the time, a silent foxhole would have to be hunted down either by looking at every inch or watching where enemies are coming from. A simple tiny model acting only as a spawn point (no ammo resupply, health, kit requests etc, merely spawning) would be very hard for the British/American forces to find, but essential.

It's the stealth I'm aiming for with the idea; enemies seemingly coming out of nowhere as if hidden in the woodland or whatever environment.

The cache would deal with pickup kits (RPG, PKM, possibly a Mosin; I think an SVD would be too valuable a weapon to have so many) and if they get any, requested kits, along with ammo and would have a greater visual model, IMO the current Militia RP would be ideal.

El_Vikingo · Post by **El_Vikingo** » 2007-09-11 17:19

Since when would a foxhole be a valuable asset? My dog could dig one!

I don't think militia would be hiding in a hole the size of a bog, but that's just me.

SuperTimo · Post by **SuperTimo** » 2007-09-11 20:52

if a bivvy area is correctly camoflaged and in a sutible location it shouldnt be that difficult to find.

i can see what your thinking with fox holes but i dont think its possible to have plobbable ones.

AnRK · Post by **AnRK** » 2007-09-11 22:22

I think if we were to have such a thing for any faction, those dug outs with the camo netting on operation ghost train (just before right hand turn to the north bridge flag if your play Brits) would be an awesome template and much more useful then a foxhole for a single person, that is if anyone actually knows what my shitty vague description is referring to.

Can't really think of anything deployable that would be used in guerilla warfare though other then the odd dugout position, but that's pretty boring job for the commander to go round allocating holes to be dug, maybe if the squad leader could issue the command though, seems a little much work for something not particularly useful alot of the time. The whole point is to pretty mobile I though and avoid that kinda thing whenever possible isn't it?

Harrod200 wrote:I don't think Insurgents should get anything, after all they're supposed to be a poorly organised rabble who have just picked up a gun to fight the invaders. A Militia though has some organisation and should at least be able to use what they have on hand (cars etc) to hinder the enemy.

In alot of Middle Eastern countries alot of people have been firing arms all/most their lives, you get that in the U.S. and other western countries, nevermind under any highly repressive, violent, sectarian and very militarised regime. Also many of these countries which the "Insurgents" are going to belong to have organised paramilitaries which these forces will belong to. They have very limited resources so they arn't going to go wasting them by forming a mass mob and firing frantically into the air whilst charging heavily armed and armoured western soldiers.

Harrod200 · Post by **Harrod200** » 2007-09-13 10:00

AnRK wrote:Can't really think of anything deployable that would be used in guerilla warfare though other then the odd dugout position, but that's pretty boring job for the commander to go round allocating holes to be dug, maybe if the squad leader could issue the command though, seems a little much work for something not particularly useful alot of the time. The whole point is to pretty mobile I though and avoid that kinda thing whenever possible isn't it?

Well currently the Militia commander cannot deploy anything, his role is very
limited. The job would be no more boring than playing commander for any other side; running around deploying these assets in locations that would be valuable for the team. The only difference for Militia would be that there is no Support Truck to get to the location.

As for lack of mobility, if that is the case why do Militia squads have RP's? The foxhole is little more than an RP everyone can spawn on, and is much harder to locate.

LtSoucy · Post by **LtSoucy** » 2007-09-13 10:10

ya i go for this idea. Also give them a AA gun because on Mestia the yshould have more then 2 or 3 AA guns.