Explosive Force

Soulja · Post by **Soulja** » 2007-11-25 18:08

Shouldn't explosions have more force to them? I've seen even small IEDs send a APC a few feet off the ground or flip them and there's even one video where a IED sends a Abrams tank 30 feet in the air. I constantly see IEDs going off right under warriors on al basrah and they just blow up, they dont move at all and even when the jihad semi goes off right next to one they dont move. I know it's not hardcoded to an extent because when you get hit with a smaller explosive in the side like a RPG or something the vehicle moves a bit. I'm not saying vehicles should fly when blown up but maybe just kinda flip or something like you would expect if a few pounds of explosive went off under a land rover or something.

Before someone says it, I know this came up before but I tried to search and didn't come up with anything.

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-11-25 19:21

TOPIC: EXPLOSIONS

Before someone says it, I know this came up before but I tried to search and didn't come up with anything.

Classic. Must drive the mods crazy. Next time try harder. Thats the motto of this project.

Soulja · Post by **Soulja** » 2007-11-25 19:27

Actually i tried pretty hard, whatever, then bump the other one and lock this. I looked for explosion and force and everything else, that one never appeared on the list.

snipe_like_a_stone · Post by **snipe_like_a_stone** » 2007-11-25 19:33

lol but its in gen discussion

Post by **Ninja2dan** » 2007-11-25 22:51

Soulja wrote:...even small IEDs send a APC a few feet off the ground or flip them and there's even one video where a IED sends a Abrams tank 30 feet in the air....

First off, I hope you are talking about in game and not in real life. Becauase if you are talking about real life, you are grossly misinformed. For example, "IED sends a Abrams tank 30 feet in the air"? An M1 Abrams weighs over 60 tons. Even a Mk84 2.000lb bomb would have a hard time pushing that weight. There is no IED I have seen that could move such force.

This subject seems to have been around for a while now and still no new changes. I'm guessing that shockwaves and blast force are not possible yet due to coding. Until someone says it's possible, might as well lock the topic.

snipe_like_a_stone · Post by **snipe_like_a_stone** » 2007-11-25 23:10

Ninja2dan wrote:First off, I hope you are talking about in game and not in real life. Becauase if you are talking about real life, you are grossly misinformed. For example, "IED sends a Abrams tank 30 feet in the air"? An M1 Abrams weighs over 60 tons. Even a Mk84 2.000lb bomb would have a hard time pushing that weight. There is no IED I have seen that could move such force.

This subject seems to have been around for a while now and still no new changes. I'm guessing that shockwaves and blast force are not possible yet due to coding. Until someone says it's possible, might as well lock the topic.

you'd be surprised

Desertfox · Post by **Desertfox** » 2007-11-25 23:13

Ninja2dan wrote:First off, I hope you are talking about in game and not in real life. Becauase if you are talking about real life, you are grossly misinformed. For example, "IED sends a Abrams tank 30 feet in the air"? An M1 Abrams weighs over 60 tons. Even a Mk84 2.000lb bomb would have a hard time pushing that weight. There is no IED I have seen that could move such force.

This subject seems to have been around for a while now and still no new changes. I'm guessing that shockwaves and blast force are not possible yet due to coding. Until someone says it's possible, might as well lock the topic.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uV-05i6InHo
I guess warning, insurgent propaganda?

Its not 30 feet, but it is in the air.

Soulja · Post by **Soulja** » 2007-11-26 00:25

Ninja2dan wrote:First off, I hope you are talking about in game and not in real life. Becauase if you are talking about real life, you are grossly misinformed. For example, "IED sends a Abrams tank 30 feet in the air"? An M1 Abrams weighs over 60 tons. Even a Mk84 2.000lb bomb would have a hard time pushing that weight. There is no IED I have seen that could move such force.

This subject seems to have been around for a while now and still no new changes. I'm guessing that shockwaves and blast force are not possible yet due to coding. Until someone says it's possible, might as well lock the topic.

Actually iv seen that video desertfox posted and also heard my cousin talking about a Abrams getting flipped over and thrown off the road by an IED, they found it 20ft from the edge of the road on it's top so don't think they cant be moved.

Waaah_Wah · Post by **Waaah_Wah** » 2007-11-26 01:28

Hehehehe the crew probably wet themselves

BloodBane611 · Post by **BloodBane611** » 2007-11-26 01:48

Abrams tanks weigh approx. 90 tons. It takes a big bomb to flip one over, nonetheless toss it into the air. Someone can do the physics calculations but its a buttload of force to throw 90 tons into the air. If we're gonna spend 9 hours burying bombs, complete with water breaks and a small breakfast buffet to attract volunteers, then I'm all for tank flipping bombs. But seriously.

Waaah_Wah · Post by **Waaah_Wah** » 2007-11-26 01:55

Nope, its aprox 60 not 90

BloodBane611 · Post by **BloodBane611** » 2007-11-26 02:06

Yeah, gross weight is 63,000 KG. My bad, shoulda checked janes first. Regardless, the power of the blast is still enormous. So now we only gotta shovel for 6 hours. Fantastic.

Soulja · Post by **Soulja** » 2007-11-26 04:10

I never said i wanted tanks to do cartwheels across the desert but I just don't wana see them sit there when a bomb goes off under them, especially lighter vehicles. Stick to the topic.

Post by **Ninja2dan** » 2007-11-26 13:42

One thing to consider when using that video as reference, is that the explosive device used would have been buried a few feet under the ground. I'm guess the device was roughly an old artillery round or something similar, not just a homemade pipe bomb. While we have seen such devices employed over the past few years, their type is quite rare and uncommon. Not to mention those devices require a lot of time and effort to set up.

Don't understand what I'm talking about? Go get two firecrackers. Light the first one and put it on the palm of your open hand, holding your hand flat with palm up. BANG! All you got was a little sting and your hand smells like powder. Now light the second firecracker, but this time hold onto it really tight. BANG! Now go pick up your fingers before your neighbor gets pissed off.

My point? The commonly used IED's in PR are a smaller size, and are set up relatively fast. They are not large devices buried in the ground where they will have much more force behind them. They are simpler devices that in reality would kill or maim personnel and damage light-armored vehicles. APC's and armor would have little or no damage from the size of IED's that we are using in PR (hand-deployed, roughly around 5-6lbs compound).

If you want a larger device, then add a 5-minute deploy time. I don't think many people will stand there holding the mouse down for 3-5 minutes just to set up a device that "might" kill a tank or APC. I see no problem with the devices in PR damaging APC's but not tanks.

In that reference video the tank did "fly" because the force was from underneath the ground, where the force of the device was multiplied. The tank would have had little damage if any, and if so it would have been from the landing and not the device itself. Sure, the crew would be hurting. Hell, I had a concusion from driving my Paladin over a dead log at 15MPH. And that was while wearing CVC helmet.

I've been handling explosives for over 10 years, so trust me. The devices we currently have in PR would NOT have anywhere near such force. I can offer up other suggestions for new IED designs that would be more realistic, but I don't see much point as it would be more complex and time-consuming than what we have now. People barely want to use the IED's we have, it would be a cold day in hell when we can get enough people to actually sit there for a couple minutes to bury one.

Post by **Jaymz** » 2007-11-26 13:59

There's a physical setting in the BF2 tweak files actualy called "explosive force". Though if anything, most explosive weapons need less of it. It's absolute stupidity that a grenade ca send a full squad flying into the air.

As I've said before,

Project Reality

directed by John Woo

Xander[nl] · Post by **Xander[nl]** » 2007-11-26 16:57

'[R-CON wrote:Desertfox;536928']http://youtube.com/watch?v=uV-05i6InHo
I guess warning, insurgent propaganda?

Its not 30 feet, but it is in the air.

God I love M1's... It just keeps driving.

I see no point in even trying to IED an Abrams. (IRL) Even if you destroy it, the crew is very likely to surive. They'll just get a new one.

Sprint · Post by **Sprint** » 2007-11-26 18:38

I vote for bigger blasts with c4 too, and the land mines, but I just cant bare nades

Post by **Jaymz** » 2007-11-26 18:45

Jonny wrote: More importantly:
None of the vehicles are using the corrcet value for g (no one has bothered changing this, there are very few physicists or engineers in PR), and each weapons explosive force can be set differently. So, Jaymz, decrease the value for nades and up it (a lot) for C4 after changing the value of g in the tweak files.

Did you ever even consider the possibility that those values are the way they are for other reasons? (handling, acceleration, stability)

Like the great egg once said, if you inject realism into one area of BF2 it will play absolute fubar with almost everything else.