Armor, AA and RPG's hit impact

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-12-14 07:08

It seems like specially the tanks are not vurnable for infantry fire as RPG's and the missile launchers.
It even prohibits having maps where only one faction has tanks, because tanks vs tanks is the ultimate to take them out.
How many RPG's does it take to take out a tank? 6-8.
Can we have any solution on this. E.g. let's say missile launchers and a 2-3 RPG's will start to penetrate the tank or hitting it so the crewmen need medical attention or at least getting out for field dressing. RPG's should even have the impact to penetrate and make smoke come in to the tank so as long the tank don't get fixed being inside the tank will make you bleed because of the bad smoke that will enter the tank.

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-12-14 07:24

45 tanks were disabled by 51 missiles/rockets that hit. 24 had armor penetrated. In 3 tanks ammunition detonated. On average only one crewman out of 4 died as a result of armor penetration.
25 crewmen in 11 tanks died from ATGM (3 tanks lost entire crews - 4 each).
5 crewmen in 2 tanks died from mines.

waronline.org, article

halvor1 · Post by **halvor1** » 2007-12-14 07:36

I would love too see some smoke when hitting a target there aren't that much explosions though the aftermath do have sometimes fires inside the vehicle's.

Be advised some viewers might find this inappropriate just showing an example that's all

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=338fda3dee

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-12-14 07:43

Ghost1800 wrote:Do they mention the type of missiles/rockets that were actually used?

During the Second Lebanon war Hizbullah's advanced armor-piercing RPGs damaged 40 Merkava tanks and killed more than 30 tank crew members.

An RPG-29 has the ability to do it with a good hit.

markonymous · Post by **markonymous** » 2007-12-14 07:43

nicoliani wrote:45 tanks were disabled by 51 missiles/rockets that hit. 24 had armor penetrated. In 3 tanks ammunition detonated. On average only one crewman out of 4 died as a result of armor penetration.
25 crewmen in 11 tanks died from ATGM (3 tanks lost entire crews - 4 each).
5 crewmen in 2 tanks died from mines.

waronline.org, article

if they dont mention what missiles they used then you cant really comment on it. for all you know they could have been hellfires.

Teek · Post by **Teek** » 2007-12-14 07:44

nicoliani wrote:45 tanks were disabled by 51 missiles/rockets that hit. 24 had armor penetrated. In 3 tanks ammunition detonated. On average only one crewman out of 4 died as a result of armor penetration.
25 crewmen in 11 tanks died from ATGM (3 tanks lost entire crews - 4 each).
5 crewmen in 2 tanks died from mines.

waronline.org, article

ATGM stands for Anti TAnk Guided Missle, like a TOW for example.
Also, context, what tank was it against, what type of missile or rocket (big difference btw) What war?

Post by **Dunehunter** » 2007-12-14 07:54

nicoliani wrote:During the Second Lebanon war Hizbullah's advanced armor-piercing RPGs damaged 40 Merkava tanks and killed more than 30 tank crew members.

An RPG-29 has the ability to do it with a good hit.

Yes, but that's not the RPG we have in game if I am not mistaken. A H-AT equivalent of the RPG is being worked on by the IDF community mod team if I'm not mistaken, but the ones you can use in PR at the moment are older models (RPG-7?)

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-12-14 08:03

I can't comment on the russian article more than that. RPG-7 amd RPG-7V are used right now in PR.

http://kalag.proboards101.com/index.cgi ... 1174141981

halvor1 · Post by **halvor1** » 2007-12-14 08:13

I really dont think the insurgents use all the time scopes on their rpg beacause of the cost for it. so i would prefer too see an rpg with ironsight like the at4. Look at the Insurgency mod for Hl2!

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-12-14 11:47

Any why, even though RPG's and missiles aren't always fatal, in PR a crewman is fully secured from any injuries. Even though the tank is burning, crewmen can easily retreat and repair. Obviously this should be changed so the crewmen take bleed from smoke and continuous hits, making them vulnerable so they need instant repair and medical attention at the spot and not to drive away come back and own again.
Imagine the tanks anti-smoke system to do it's job, get out of the tank or get suffocate. I think there is much to be done to simulate the vehicles in PR, and hope does guy's working on the air patch can do it here to, or the Dev's.

nicoX · Post by **nicoX** » 2007-12-14 11:56

Harrelson · Post by **Harrelson** » 2007-12-14 12:50

A modern ATGM will penetrate any tank even the front armor. (Some penetrate 1500-3000mm of rolled homogeneous armor, that up to 3 meters of high strength steel. 3M = 15 feet)

The only way to beat it to have active interception systems like trophy and arena.

CAS_117 · Post by **CAS_117** » 2007-12-14 23:13

I heard that they had evidence of Syrian RPG-29s, and Iranian Kornet ATGM.

agentscar · Post by **agentscar** » 2007-12-14 23:21

2-3 RPG's hurting an M1 Abrams or Challenger II,BAHAHAHAHA!

CAS_117 · Post by **CAS_117** » 2007-12-14 23:37

Not sure a '29 would scratch either of them. Maybe a top or rear hit with like 6 on the same spot would break the RA and then the chobham armor... if by then the tank didn't realize something was up I think they would need some drivers ed. Tandem charge would bust right through though.

Sadist_Cain · Post by **Sadist_Cain** » 2007-12-14 23:40

well as far as I know Modern MBTs can shruf off single or double rpg's effectively. but its things like working in a team using one to blow through reactive armour and then the other rpgs would all attack this vulnerability. I wanna see more damage to crewman and lotsa smoke from several RPG hits on the same area of a tank.

Also more Damage less destruction

more often tanks are simply knocked out of commission due to being damaged on the battlefield instead of being totally destroyed.
more blown tracks, locked turrets, and is there a way the pereiscope can be scrambled if its hit?