Trouble distinguishing civillians from insurgents.

USMC_Cook · Post by **USMC_Cook** » 2008-01-12 02:32

I’ve been having a little trouble distinguishing civilians from insurgents; specifically, the insurgent with the red and white head wrap. From shorter distances it really isn’t an issue, but from farther away both classes look exactly alike. I’m pretty sure the reason for this is that at longer distances objects show less detail, so I’m guessing that the head wrap just doesn’t show up when I see an insurgent at long distance. This isn’t a problem with a scoped rifle, but when I use iron sights it becomes pretty frustrating. For example, I’ll see a guy in the distance (using binocs) that looks like a civilian, but then he’ll start shooting at me!

I may be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that I'm looking at what I think is a civillian but is actually an insurgent. Is anyone else having this problem? Also, is there any way to fix it (my graphics settings are already maxed out)?

Post by **Spec** » 2008-01-12 03:19

Well, usualy its possible to see if someone is holding a gun, but if the distance is too long to see the position of his hands, well, I'd say - take cover. If he shoots, kill him, if not, let him escape.

unrealalex · Post by **unrealalex** » 2008-01-12 03:45

I think they meant it to be that way. Insurgents probably don't run around the city with their guns out in real life anyway. It should be hard to tell whos a civilian and whos not.

ralfidude · Post by **ralfidude** » 2008-01-12 04:36

Well the thing about the distance is that i was with a squad cleaning out the city of any pests, but were communicating on whether we were to open fire up on the targets or not based on civilians or not. But from far the civilians look like they are always holding a gun, and then once u get a bit closer, that gun holding position changes to something weird like the rock or what not... thats alot of valuable time spent looking for a positive target, but hey, thats war, gotta be sure about everything... unless ur a bomb... cuz damn, once that babe goes off, it dont matter who you are.

BloodBane611 · Post by **BloodBane611** » 2008-01-12 04:51

What are your video settings at?

zangoo · Post by **zangoo** » 2008-01-12 05:14

well i have this problem too, but i only shoot at a target after i ask sl if i should open fire, if he says i will wait a sec then shoot no matter what it is. if you really want to make sure, use the binocs to make sure. still it is fun just to open up on a civ to have him cry about you shooting him.

s3v3ndust · Post by **s3v3ndust** » 2008-01-12 05:20

my rule:

if its a lot of friendly troops near by with one civilian out in a field on his own, shoot him before he spots you, i think its worth the ticket loss. chances are half of the insurgent team will move onto your position and destroy what territory you've already crossed thanks to this one civi.

I'm not sure why any civilian spotting with binoculars isn't considered as an enemy combatant, in a time of war they would be shot from my perspective.

Post by **Spec** » 2008-01-12 07:18

The civilians are strange anyways. They ARE fighters, they even got a (weak, but in some cases lethal) weapon, the stones. When i think "civilians", i usualy expect some poor guys running around in fear, not people jumping in the line of fire whenever they can to make the enemy "lose tickets" or something... But AI civilian-bots dont work with BF2, so these almost-civilians are all we got...

zangoo · Post by **zangoo** » 2008-01-12 07:43

why wouldnt civ bots work with bf2? you can change their what they try to do most, eg move to places or attack.

aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Avoid 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier MoveTo 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Idle 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Fire 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Special 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier TakeCover 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Change 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Revive 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier c4 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Special2 1.0
aiSettings.setBehaviourModifier Special3 1.0

make it so they avoid people and take cover, done they wont jump in the way, just not to sure how bad this would effect server speed, but i have played on a server with 55 bots and 9 players with no lag.

Post by **Spec** » 2008-01-12 07:48

I mean, its impossible without giving up player slots.

zangoo · Post by **zangoo** » 2008-01-12 08:01

there has to be a work around cus i have played with 96 bots. i think this line of code has something to do with this.

aiSettings.maxBotsIncludeHumans 1

this would stop the current system where civ are just things that want to try to eat bullets.

BabaGurGur · Post by **BabaGurGur** » 2008-01-12 09:00

Use your binocs, if you cant tell, either shoot him or get out of his sights.

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-01-12 10:22

Zangoo I'd like to see a video of 96 bots or at least a screenshot if you can, pr with a few more slots would be really helpfull sometimes.
Kashan could use 100 slots and basra with a few civ bots as well as players sounds good too

Even if they could raise slot counts though, it'd cause problems with some maps having too many players then

Post by **Outlawz7** » 2008-01-12 10:41

96 on local Single Player server, not on over-loaded live multiplayer server probably.
Some servers can't even run the new 0.7 maps.

zangoo · Post by **zangoo** » 2008-01-12 12:15

here is a guy that was playing with 128 bots

bf2 128 bot - Google Search

now remember he is hosting the server and playing the game with 128 bots on a single core cus bf2 is single threaded, so a high end server with bots that dont even try to shoot should have no problem with 10 bots. here is a screen shot of me messing around with 240 bots only 80 some spawned, fps would be 25+ but when i went to that screen it went to 5-11fps.

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-01-12 14:38

I understand the server load would be higher but I thought they could not even do 65 slots for some reason

6 bit variable? 2^6=64

I have a conroe at 3.4ghz, I'd love to mess around with the PRM maps with 240 bots

I guess a 9800gtx sli would be needed too because the player models are probably quite high load to render

zangoo · Post by **zangoo** » 2008-01-12 18:34

well i think that max # of bots you could have playing is 9*6=54*2=108+2=110, cus from what i have seen a bot will not spawn if it is not in a squad or commander.

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-01-12 18:45

So that works in single player which suggests its the internet network code that fails to account for greater numbers or does hosting locally across a lan also work

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-01-12 18:46

BloodBane611 · Post by **BloodBane611** » 2008-01-13 04:16

So that works in single player which suggests its the internet network code that fails to account for greater numbers or does hosting locally across a lan also work

Part of it is that every time you double the number of players, you quadruple the amount of data that needs to be processed and sent by the server.

why wouldnt civ bots work with bf2? you can change their what they try to do most, eg move to places or attack.

You can get them to move, but they can't be interacted with by players, so they would just wander randomly around Basra. And you lose player spots to get there.

BF2 is limited to 64 players on a server. There is no way around this on this engine. Be happy with what the DEVs have achieved.