Fire Selector Woes.

[asiLLasiTgets]

I did multiple searches on the forums (Fire Selector, Ak-101, Firing Modes, Single, Automatic, Burst) and came back with nothing on the subject. So, here it is.

I was wondering why the weapons default to unrealistic standards? Most modern military units don't train their infantry in automatic fire. It's more less a luxury. You have it if you need it, but you're always taught to take "Aimed" single shots, under the base of fire of your Gunner.

...This wouldn't bother me so much if this Mod didn't stress such realism. Automatic or Burst fire aren't even next in the chain of the fire selector switch after Safe.

Is there a reason for it? It's very annoying, especially considering the fictional innaccuracy given to the Ak101 (The rifle is very capable of outshooting the M4, and matching long distance accuracy with the M16. Somthing that PRMM doesn't seem to take into account).

I would really like to see the weapons default to the military standard of "Single". It's what soilders are taught on, and it just bugs the heck out of me to spawn into a particular position with my weapon on auto. Especially considering how utterly ineffective it is.

...just a minor grip. Other than that; get some Kit Restrictions , Fix the Sniper (SDM anybody?), and you fellars have one hell of a Mod on your hands.

Good work so far. Thanks for your time and effort to bring the realism community somthing truely great; and lacking... Realism.

{WP}Paas

Fully automatic has it's benefits. In a CQB situation it is a neccescity. If you learn to control the full automatic fire from your rifle into 2 to 5 round bursts it can be extremely effective as well. It is all a question of the range you are engaging. At long range obviously well aimed single shots are king, however in lets say a 50m firefight with multiple hostiles full auto could prove to be of value. The assualt rifle can shoot with decent accuracy at 50m on full auto in controlled bursts suppressing hostiles if not eliminating them. This is especially true with rifles that fire smaller rounds like .223 or 5.45 x 39. Most people who do not have expierence with assult rifles and full auto firearms generally operate with the same assumption you have about full auto. I do agree with your point on the selector though, I guess I would like to take it a bit farther. I would like to see weapons start with the safety on. After all this is the most realistic scenario, But we can not have it all. The development team has enough on thier plate.

[eggman]

I agree with this gripe hehe... I always set my weapon to single fire and find it annoying when I take an aimed shot, typically the first in a double tap, and realise it's on full auto... I forgot to set it to single shot for the umpteenth time that day.

I've done some CQB / FIBUA / MOUT training and even in those cases, single fire is the norm and burst or full auto is a discretionary choice by the soldier; typically a double tap in single fire is what's taught as the most safe and effective mode of engagement.

Other military experienced folks may have a different experience and/or opinion but that is how I understand it.

Not sure where this is controlled, hopefully it's an easy change.

egg

[Raptor]

Yeah, the AK-101 might be able to outshoot the M4A1, if it was being shoot by a US or Allied soldier, but its being shot by a Middle Eastern troop, who are not completely properly trained in shooting (yeah, you can argue about how its a fictional army and what not, but its supposidly made up of all the Middle Eastern muslim nations (Iraq, Iran, Syria, ect) whose troops are not as properly/well trained as US/NATO troops. I say leave the AK-101's accuracy alone to compencate with that, also if anything they shouldn't be using the AK-101 but a Middle Eastern (Iraq/Iran made) AK-74.

I do agree that you should spawn with your weapon on semi, not full auto (unless you're the automatic rifleman) or three round burst. But its not that big of a deal, when you spawn in, just hit 3 once or twice and its fixed. (But if you truely want to get technical, you're not supposed to have your weapon off of safe until you're engaging the enemy, or unless you're the point man for the squad.)

[asiLLasiTgets]

eggman']I've done some CQB / FIBUA / MOUT training and even in those cases, single fire is the norm and burst or full auto is a discretionary choice by the soldier; typically a double tap in single fire is what's taught as the most safe and effective mode of engagement.egg

It is the most safe means, no argument there, that is what I was tought too. That training is for the garden variety soldier ( you dont want a person from backwoods kentucky who cant read and is uneducated to go through the door behind you , on full auto and go crazy with it and kill your whole entry team). For a person who knows what they are doing, A person who has a higher skill set, and when you are working with a team of men you have trained with and can trust, full auto will put the most ammount of bullets on the target.

[asiLLasiTgets]

if anything they shouldn't be using the AK-101 but a Middle Eastern (Iraq/Iran made) AK-74.

Ak 47 in 7.62x39 ak 74 in 5.45 x 39 are the most abundant. I absolutely agree. I bet maybe a tenth of a percent of the ak's in the middle east are .223 ( excluding the israeli Galil).

[Raptor]

I'd say possibly the AK-102, since thats the Russian export model, but it fires .223 NATO(5.56x45mm) and is not as common as the AK-47/74/M series.

But if the dev team is going to do that, than they also need to replace the Mi-28 Havok with the Mi-24 Hind and the T-90 with the T-72/80.

[fuzzhead]

I agree, weapons should be set on single shot when spawned in, EXCEPT:

Kalishnikovs first setting is full auto, THEN semi-shot

Russians have a different mind set

[Wolfguard]

Please make it like other games where you push a button, like "B" as most common, to change the rate of fire. In addition, of course, make a little indicator in one of the corners that shows what rate of fire you have selected if you should forget.

[Tacamo]

I agree, weapons should be set on single shot when spawned in, EXCEPT:

Kalishnikovs first setting is full auto, THEN semi-shot

Russians have a different mind set

They sure do love overwhelming firepower in large volumes. Just look at some of their other systems. Smerch MLRS, Kirov Class Cruisers, the large number of artillery divisions and the good old SS-18 Satan that had the option of 10 MIRV's or a single 20-25 megaton warhead.

[Raptor]

Please make it like other games where you push a button, like "B" as most common, to change the rate of fire. In addition, of course, make a little indicator in one of the corners that shows what rate of fire you have selected if you should forget.

There is an indicator that shows what ROF you have selected (lower right corner, right next to the counter that shows how many magazines you have left). Unless you're talking about a image indicator (ie... One Bullet = Semi, Three Bullets = 3rd Burst, Five Bullets = Full Auto).

Also you can change ROF by hitting "3" or scrolling with the mouse wheel, selecting the weapon (that can have its ROF changed) and left click (than repeat until you get your selected ROF).

[Rifleman]

Yeah, the AK-101 might be able to outshoot the M4A1, if it was being shoot by a US or Allied soldier, but its being shot by a Middle Eastern troop, who are not completely properly trained in shooting

My friend was in Polish army and has been shooting akms and after few moments of training was very good at it... and in our army u can;t shot too many rounds becouse of limitations which are ******
My father has been shooting from ak47 and he says that's not hard....
So.... if this is correct..i think that these troops knows how to aim right...

[Hitperson]

fire selection needs to be faster as does realoading it is just too care free.

[BrokenArrow]

What do you mean faster? Fire selection takes a fraction of a second and reloading is pretty quick (not to mention never fumbled with, hits his mark every time).

[Hitperson]

in the game it is too casual im sure in conbat you would re load as fast as you could. (including not tugging out the empty mag just releasing it as you reach for another.)

[BrokenArrow]

Well if the speed is increased the likely hood of fumbling with the clip would increase greatly. Really I think it loads pretty fast as it is now, especially the machine guns.

[Hitperson]

i was more focusing on the rifles but mostly the fire selection should be faster.

[mav3r1c]

I think that you should put it to semi for the US guns, but like someone else said, the AKs are set to full auto. I also think that to deter people from using full auto, you should put in gun jamming. I dunno how everyone else feels about this, but it would be pretty cool if you ask me.

[angus]

I'm not sure about the current patch, but while playing with the Tweak files in the demo I found that the order firerate lines change the default setting.

Code: Select all

ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 2
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 1
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 0

Would spawn on Auto, next Burst, next Semi.

Code: Select all

ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 0
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 2
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 1

Would spawn on Semi, next Auto, next Burst.

[Hitperson]

thanks that code will be really handy.