Realistic ballistics & zeroing rifles

[zangoo]

ok so i am wondering if ObjectTemplate.fire.projectileStartRotation a/b/c, would make the bullet arc upwards, or just make the bullet go sideways in the air, cus if it makes it go sideways then you could use a rocket engine bullet and it would work.

[zangoo]

it is in there, but it does not say anything but the name so i just tryed using stuff from the one that controlls the position cus it is so close to this one.

[AnRK]

Mathematically based science hurts my head, let's talk Philosophy! What do people think of Kant's theory of perception?

[zangoo]

could i see it? also nedlands1 you said you had a way to zero the guns how did you do that?

[Jay]

Deviation is needed to enhance realism and help prevent all those dolphin-diving shits who made me quit vBF2 long before I found PR. Ballistics on the other hand are needed to enhance the realism and make all of us real shooters happy.

As far as I can tell, prone spamming is actually the fastest way to get less deviation. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here please.

Edit: I understand what the whole deviation thing symbolizes, I just think it's a poor way of implementing it (not saying that there actually is a better way, just stating an opinion).

[zangoo]

guys i am not sure if this is the way nedlands was zeroing the guns, i am pretty sure it is but here is is.


the gun

Code: Select all

rem *** Generated with Bf2Editor.exe [created: 2005/4/5 15:44]
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 0 0 1 2
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 0 0 0.25
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 0 1 2
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 1 1 2
GeometryTemplate.compressVertexData 1
GeometryTemplate.maxTextureRepeat 8
ObjectTemplate.activeSafe GenericFireArm usrif_m14
ObjectTemplate.creator MBA-1:mba
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.saveInSeparateFile 1
ObjectTemplate.castsDynamicShadow 1
rem ---BeginComp:WeaponHud ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent WeaponHud
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.weaponIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\USRIF_M14.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.altWeaponIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\USRIF_M14.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.selectIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\Selection\USRIF_M14.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.hudName "killed"
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.guiIndex 9
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.altGuiIndex 52
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.deviationFactor 1
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.disableOnSprint 1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:MultiFireComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent MultiFireComp
ObjectTemplate.fire.roundsPerMinute 900
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 0
ObjectTemplate.fire.useDummyProjectiles 1
ObjectTemplate.fire.addBarrelName m14_barrel
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp :D efaultAmmoComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultAmmoComp
ObjectTemplate.ammo.ammoType 1
ObjectTemplate.ammo.magSize 20
ObjectTemplate.ammo.nrOfMags 6
ObjectTemplate.ammo.reloadTime 4
ObjectTemplate.ammo.reloadWithoutPlayer 1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SoldierBasedRecoilComp ---
rem Long Barrel 762 Standard Recoil Precision Rifle
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SoldierBasedRecoilComp
ObjectTemplate.recoil.hasRecoilForce 1
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilForceUp CRD_UNIFORM/0/0/0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilForceLeftRight CRD_UNIFORM/0/0/0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.zoomModifier 0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.goBackOnRecoil 1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SoldierDeviationComp ---
rem Long Barrel 762 Optical Sight Precision Rifle
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SoldierDeviationComp
ObjectTemplate.deviation.minDev 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setFireDev 0.2 0.05 0.005
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setTurnDev 0.2 0.1 0.1 0.005
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setSpeedDev 2 2 2 0.05
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setMiscDev 2 2 0.05
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModStand 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModCrouch 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModLie 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModZoom 1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp :D efaultSoundComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultSoundComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp :D efaultAnimationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultAnimationComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp :D efaultZoomComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultZoomComp
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomDelay 0.2
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomLod 1
ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0
ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0.12
ObjectTemplate.zoom.changeFovDelay 0.08
ObjectTemplate.zoom.disableMuzzleWhenZoomed 1
rem ---EndComp ---
ObjectTemplate.geometry usrif_m14
ObjectTemplate.setCollisionMesh usrif_m14
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 0 Collision_Material 68
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 1 lambert1 68
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Mesh
ObjectTemplate.aiTemplate usrif_m14
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Fire1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Fire1P_Outdoor
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Fire3P
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0131251/0.522905
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_BoltClick
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_TriggerClick
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_SwitchFireRate
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Reload1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Reload3P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Deploy1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Deploy3P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m14_Zoom
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate e_muzz_g3a3
ObjectTemplate.setPosition -0.00022652/0.013967/0.524617
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate e_shellejection_556
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0.0179642/0.0207936/-0.198724
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate m14_barrel
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.09/0
ObjectTemplate.setRotation 0/-0.5/0
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.animationSystem1P Objects/Weapons/Handheld/RURIF_Dragunov/AnimationSystem1p.inc
ObjectTemplate.animationSystem3P Objects/Weapons/Handheld/RURIF_Dragunov/AnimationSystem3p.inc
ObjectTemplate.projectileTemplate 556_45saw
ObjectTemplate.velocity 294
ObjectTemplate.itemIndex 3
ObjectTemplate.delayToUse 1

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Fire1P
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/usrif_m14/sounds/m14_fire_1p.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 0
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 0
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 1
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.pan 0.5
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1
ObjectTemplate.setPosition -0.00022652/0.013967/0.524617


ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Fire3P
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/usrif_m14/sounds/m14_fire_3p.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 0
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 1
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.9
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1
ObjectTemplate.pitchEnvelope 0/1/0.9/1.1/1/1/0/0.97/1.03/
ObjectTemplate.volumeEnvelope 0/1/0/1/1/1/0/0.95/1/
ObjectTemplate.position -0.00022652/0.013967/0.524617
ObjectTemplate.minDistance 4
ObjectTemplate.halfVolumeDistance 15
ObjectTemplate.soundRadius 1.5

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_BoltClick
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/rurif_gp30/sounds/gp30_bolt_click.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 0
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.56
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.pan 0.5
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 0.5

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_TriggerClick
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/uspis_92fs/sounds/mono/trigger_click.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 0
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.35
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.pan 0.5
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_SwitchFireRate
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Reload1P
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/Weapons/Handheld/rurif_dragunov/Sounds/Dragunov_reload_1p3p.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 0
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.48
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.pan 0.5
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Reload3P
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/Weapons/Handheld/rurif_dragunov/Sounds/Dragunov_reload_1p3p.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 1
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.48
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1
ObjectTemplate.minDistance 0.5
ObjectTemplate.halfVolumeDistance 1

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Deploy1P
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/chsni_type88/sounds/type88_deploy.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 0
ObjectTemplate.stopType 0
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.49
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.pan 0.5
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Deploy3P
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/chsni_type88/sounds/type88_deploy.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 1
ObjectTemplate.stopType 0
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.46
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1
ObjectTemplate.minDistance 0.5
ObjectTemplate.halfVolumeDistance 1

ObjectTemplate.activeSafe Sound S_usrif_m14_Zoom
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser dsu
ObjectTemplate.soundFilename "objects/weapons/handheld/rurif_bizon/sounds/zoom_generic.wav"
ObjectTemplate.loopCount 1
ObjectTemplate.is3dSound 0
ObjectTemplate.stopType 1
ObjectTemplate.volume 0.35
ObjectTemplate.pitch 1
ObjectTemplate.pan 0.5
ObjectTemplate.reverbLevel 1

ObjectTemplate.create RotationalBundle m14_barrel
ObjectTemplate.createdInEditor 1
ObjectTemplate.floaterMod 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0

the bullet

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ObjectTemplate.create GenericProjectile 556_45saw
ObjectTemplate.material 3762
ObjectTemplate.damage 36
ObjectTemplate.minDamage 0.4
ObjectTemplate.DistToStartLoseDamage 400
ObjectTemplate.DistToMinDamage 1000
ObjectTemplate.gravityModifier 0.3
include projectiles_common.tweak
include projectiles_tracer_r4.tweak

the tracer for the bullet

Code: Select all

ObjectTemplate.tracerScaler 20
ObjectTemplate.maxTracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.minTracerScaler 10
ObjectTemplate.tracerSizeModifier 5
ObjectTemplate.tracerConvergeDistance 20
ObjectTemplate.tracerTemplate p_tracer_r
ObjectTemplate.tracerInterval 1

the m14 shoots a slower bullet to show that the gun is zeroed more, it goes about 1 foot higher then where you are aiming at the highest point in flight. also every bullet is a tracer.


now it is working 100% for the person firing the gun, they will see it rise and then fall to the zeroed point, out at 300m, but other people see the bullet take a diffrent path, it will be about 20m to the right at 300m. i am not sure what is causing people to see 2 diffrent bullet paths.


if you would like to try this out download the file i have attached to this post and un-znip it. you just have to drop the pr folder included in the download into
C:\Program Files\EA GAMES\Battlefield 2\mods
and allow it to overwrite anything.

done

now if you want to put it back to normal.

go to
C:\Program Files\EA GAMES\Battlefield 2\mods\pr\objects

delete objects_server_patch

now go to
C:\Program Files\EA GAMES\Battlefield 2\mods\pr\serverarchives.con

open it, it should look like this

Code: Select all

fileManager.mountArchive objects/Objects_server_patch.zip Objects
fileManager.mountArchive objects/Objects_server.zip Objects
fileManager.mountArchive menu/Menu_server.zip Menu
fileManager.mountArchive Common_server.zip Common
fileManager.mountArchive ../bf2/Objects_server.zip Objects
fileManager.mountArchive ../bf2/Menu_server.zip Menu
fileManager.mountArchive ../bf2/Common_server.zip Common

delete

fileManager.mountArchive objects/Objects_server_patch.zip Objects

now it should look like this

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fileManager.mountArchive objects/Objects_server.zip Objects
fileManager.mountArchive menu/Menu_server.zip Menu
fileManager.mountArchive Common_server.zip Common
fileManager.mountArchive ../bf2/Objects_server.zip Objects
fileManager.mountArchive ../bf2/Menu_server.zip Menu
fileManager.mountArchive ../bf2/Common_server.zip Common

now save serverarchives.con

now you can play pr.

[Sadist_Cain]

I'm a big fan of this

Realistic ballistics would add so much more skill to shooting.

Though a must ask, Every bullet being a tracer? That's just for testing I assume, Otherwise it's going to be starwars out there lol

[zangoo]

yha it is just for testing, the slow bullets are also for testing. i hope that someone can over come this problem with the bullet having diffrent paths for each person or this way will not ever work.

[zangoo]

ok jonny, i have set the speed lower so that the bullet would have to arc higher and it would be easyer to see. the angle of the barrel has changed i can also change where it is on the gun.

main changes, the bullet now shoots from your gun not the center of the screen, the barrel is angled up so the bullet will be fired up, the angle is so small you wouldnt see the diffrence if you change the angle of the barrel or the angle of the scope.

i mean that i would see the bullet arc up then fall and hit cas in the face, he would see it land 20m to the side of him at 300m, the same thing if i was standing there. the problem is a network issue, i think i need to set some kind of networkableinfo.

[zangoo]

here are the changes

rem ---BeginComp:MultiFireComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent MultiFireComp
ObjectTemplate.fire.roundsPerMinute 900
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 0
ObjectTemplate.fire.useDummyProjectiles 1
ObjectTemplate.fire.addBarrelName m14_barrel
rem ---EndComp ---

ObjectTemplate.create RotationalBundle m14_barrel
ObjectTemplate.createdInEditor 1
ObjectTemplate.floaterMod 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0

ObjectTemplate.addTemplate m14_barrel
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.09/0
ObjectTemplate.setRotation 0/-0.5/0

[BloodBane611]

That is a very strange bug. Where you testing it on a local server or a dedicated?

[zangoo]

guys i forgot to set the gravity modifier to 0.66, but the guns are still zeroed and if you want to set real gravity go into the bullet file and chnage the gravity modifer to 0.66 and go into the m14 and under m14_barrel there is something called ObjectTemplate.setRotation 0/-0.5/0 change the -0.5 to -1 and the gun will now be zeroed at 300m with real gravity.


update: i have zeroed the m40a3 to 600m with real gravity and speed, i will post a video soon.

[RCMoonPie]

I agree with most of the thread except for the "technical programming jargon".
But I dont have to understand it to play it. LOL

I do want to respectfully point out that the following explanation in regard to zeroing a rifle is incorrect:

To zero a rifle the user must be made to aim the barrel slightly above the target,
to let the bullet rise and then fall onto it at the range it is zeroed to.
To accomplish this the sights must be moved down by a few tenths/hundredths
of a degree so that when they are lined up on a target the rifle will be zeroed correctly.
This angle is very small, it only causes a rise of 10-20 cm at the highest point, but you
will be able to say that the rifles are actually zeroed and that the ballistics are realistic.
I was also told by a friend who was in (I think) the army cadets that they are told to aim for
the neck, not the head. I think this shows why that is.

If a rifle is "zeroed" on a target at a range of 300 yards...there is no need to elevate the rifle's sights
on target to compensate for drop...unless the target is farther away than the zeroed 300 yards.
Thats what zeroed means...no other adjustment needs to be made.
With this, if my rifle is zeroed at 300 yards, but my target is only 250 yards away, I would need to aim
ever so slightly lower than my intended target...not because the round rises...but because my sights are elevated
above the required distance.
A round does not rise at all.
The round will travel when fired in a straight and flat trajectory (under ideal conditions) until velocity is lost,
then it will begin to drop. This drop is due to the obvious, loss of speed and gravity's pull.
Once again, the round will not rise unless it is fired at an upward angle by the shooter.

When properly sighted and zeroed....the round goes where the sights are looking....not where the barrel is pointing.
The realization of this fact is key.

I learned my marksmanship skills on the Hue City range at Parris Island. And I maintained the award of "Rifle Expert"
my entire time in the Marine Corps. But, if you would rather take the word of an "army cadet" please feel free.

So, to engage targets at greater distances beyond that of the 300 yard zero, you make adjustments to elevation
by adding "clicks" on to your rear elevation sight. Engage those targets and remember to take those clicks back off of
the rifle after the engagement. If not you will be shooting high when you engage closer targets later.
But, not because the round rises...but because of your now elevated sights.

Now...what I would propose is to keep the sights graphically in the same place...zeroed at 300 yards to hit a target at
center mass.
Targets beyond the 300 yard range would require elevation added in order to strike center mass.
So when sighted in and aiming at a target at 300 yards...when I fire....the round should strike the target where I am aiming
my sights....no where else.
At targets beyond 300 yards, my rounds should be striking below center mass uless I compensate for elevation....
by aiming slightly above center mass...or ideally if timing allows, by adjusting the elevation sights on the weapon.
Elevation adjustment could be done in game by making a key stroke in the amount of adjustment needed while the weapon
is snapped into sight. For instance, the visual one would have while looking through a scope at the horizon would be seeing
the horizon move up slightly when elevation is added, and seeing the horizon move down when elevation is taken away.
The sight picture/aimpoint would remain the same and unchanged.

[nedlands1]

guys i am not sure if this is the way nedlands was zeroing the guns, i am pretty sure it is but here is is.

EDIT: IIRC the "ObjectTemplate.setPosition " should has a negative value not a positive one so the barrel is lower that the sights which are themselves positioned at the origin of the model (ie where the barrel is on the model). Bullets will come out below the weapon. Ideally the sights need to be moved up, not the barrel down. I suppose one could achieve this by relocating the origin to where the sights are and then moving the barrel down but I assume that needs to be done at the modeling -> importing stage.