Unscoped Rifleman Discussion.

[DavidP]

Let's have a discussion guys, On how we would increase the Unscoped Rifleman's Appeal to the Playerbase.

3 rules.

1. Keep it Civil!

2. Dont suggest punishing one Kit or 'Class' (As some people still call it) To give another an Edge.

3. Dont suggest something stupid that wont work. Like Grapple or a Shotgun.

(Sorry for Mini Modding)


Ok I will start.


I can think of a few.


1. Give them the same amount of field dressing's as an Officer.

2. Increase the Ammo bags ammo capacity.

3. Increase Handling of Unscoped Rifle to simulate lighter weight.

4. Shorter Reload time.

5. Lower Deviation when in full auto.

Agree/Disagree? Ok now you go.


EDIT: Sorry guys for the rush post but i gotta go to sleep early for work tomorrow.

[DarthDisco]

As I have said before. Nothing needs to be done to the unscoped rifleman, what needs to be done is to remove the ammo bag from the scoped rifleman. This is not "penalizing" the scoped rifleman, it is restoring the balance between the two kits. It is a perfectly fair trade off: one kit is better at killing directly with more accurate fire. The other provides ammunition to his squadmates allowing them to kill more effectively.

[OkitaMakoto]

Shotgun would be neat for door breaching
Would make the Iron Sights more useful in urban environments.

Other than that, Ill have to think.

And yes, I read your post.

p.s. I heard it already supplies more ammo than the Scoped ammo bag does.

[00SoldierofFortune00]

As I have said before. Nothing needs to be done to the unscoped rifleman, what needs to be done is to remove the ammo bag from the scoped rifleman. This is not "penalizing" the scoped rifleman, it is restoring the balance between the two kits. It is a perfectly fair trade off: one kit is better at killing directly with more accurate fire. The other provides ammunition to his squadmates allowing them to kill more effectively.

The ammo bag has already been nerfed, so it wouldn't balance anything. The Iron Sights are there for CQB w/ammo and the Scoped rifle is there for long range w/ammo plain and simple.

[SGT.JOKER]

I dont really think anything should be changed in the scoped or unscoped riflemen class right now seeing as how I use both of them equally.

give him a pistol maybe? other then that or a shotgun like okita already said Im not sure what else you could give him that a RL soldier would have, maybe not as many field dressings as the officer, give him 2 if you're gonna add any. Maybe give him a 5 or 6 frag grenades? something like that?

[CAS_117]

If I were in a real war I would put a scope on every item I had including my knife. Irons just have zero advantages over scopes.

Scopes are better in CQB (under 30 yards) due to lower recoil, meaning more shots. Not to mention better visibility since you have nothing in your way. I don't see why its necessary to give certain kits scopes or not. Just make them limited to balance them.

[MrD]

Ironsights are perfect for CQB and anything under 100m. Scopes have their downfalls.

In fact, I've almost been shot in the face due to someone with a scope on his assault rifles planting his barrel in a fallen tree and firing thinking his scope was the bullets trajectory, the round ricocheted, buzzing angrily past my face. Or the time when I've been unable to fire because I couldn't trust the guy to my side who kept moving in front of me, not keeping pace properly, where using the scope was a hindrance due to him being on my right hand side (I shoot with both eyes open which would be fine if he had been on my left)

Ingame the ironsighted rifleman is handy for players with a certain style of gameplay, who prefer fighting under 100m, in urban or forest settings. To always pick a scoped rifleman in those settings is silly and leads to you dying a lot more often being unable to see what is going on around you.

In the real world, there are emergency ironsights on top of the SUSAT for the L85 rifles that can become handy for CQB. Although then you are probably trying to fight the urge to use your rifle like a pistol, your arm to 'point' at the enemy (hell, the rifle is 10lbs in weight, not the lightest, but still pretty wieldy)

[Tweaky]

Hmmm this is such an interesting topic, I have some insight on what REALLY makes unscoped rifles different from that of a scoped rifle:

1) The barrel's heatguards can be used to sharpen your knife, while at the same time dramatically decreasing the layers of skin on the palm of your hand each time you fire, thus creating an essential bullet vortex continuum only known to unscoped weapons.

2) The bullets should not make noises when they hit any surface, even the birch tree bark as seen on Qinling!

3) If you use the ironsights for 20 secs or more, you will get pinkeye.

4) If you are holding the unscoped kit, and then pickup a scoped kit, you will suddenly become 80 pounds heavier. Therefore, you cannot use any tactical stance other than prone, and only have 10 seconds of sprint time.

5) Unscoped rifleman should only be allowed to drive the CO trucks IF they need to do a beer run.

6) By holding the unscoped rifle in a vertical fashion, it should instantly make the soldier camouflaged in the surrounding environment, invisible to enemy eyes. You see, scoped rifles have solar glass resonance, which can be detected by crystalline-resonomanators (commonly used on the battlefield).

Your turn, now go.

[nedlands1]

With the optical scope you get magnification at the expense of your field of view. With the iron sights you get you large field of view but miss out on the magnification. This in itself balances out quite nicely IMO. The reduction in recoil, when zoomed, is what gives the scoped rifles the upper hand. If this is changed I don't think there will be such a problem.

[CAS_117]

Hmmm this is such an interesting topic, I have some insight on what REALLY makes unscoped rifles different from that of a scoped rifle:

1) The barrel's heatguards can be used to sharpen your knife, while at the same time dramatically decreasing the layers of skin on the palm of your hand each time you fire, thus creating an essential bullet vortex continuum only known to unscoped weapons.

2) The bullets should not make noises when they hit any surface, even the birch tree bark as seen on Qinling!

3) If you use the ironsights for 20 secs or more, you will get pinkeye.

4) If you are holding the unscoped kit, and then pickup a scoped kit, you will suddenly become 80 pounds heavier. Therefore, you cannot use any tactical stance other than prone, and only have 10 seconds of sprint time.

5) Unscoped rifleman should only be allowed to drive the CO trucks IF they need to do a beer run.

6) By holding the unscoped rifle in a vertical fashion, it should instantly make the soldier camouflaged in the surrounding environment, invisible to enemy eyes. You see, scoped rifles have solar glass resonance, which can be detected by crystalline-resonomanators (commonly used on the battlefield).

Your turn, now go.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXPjF5J_CGo[/youtube]

Ironsights show you most of the screen except in front of you.

[zeidmaan]

I could live with extra field dressing or two for the unscoped, but removing ammo from the scoped is out of the question. Just think about it. If you have a squad with medic, HAT, and SAW you will need two ammo guys. If scoped dont have ammo you will end up with a squad full of unscoped people and you will be shit.

I think its good as it is. Some people will prefer iron sights in some situations. There will be more scoped riflemans around than unscoped but that is how its supposed to be.

[Top_Cat_AxJnAt]

I love em both but really the iron sites are many many times for aesthetically pleasing to use. Just as long as you dont get rid of them entirely i am happy.

[Severloh]

Give'm a Red Dot

But really, you could reduce deviation of unescoped weapons, since it is easier for the common soldier to aim faster and mantain control without aiming with his scope (I guess)

[OkitaMakoto]

I think after a few months after everyone has used the ACOG enough, we'll all get over its cool look and maybe more will switch over to the irons. I know that I personally take the ACOG, half for the reason that I love the little red triangle, and half because I think its a bit more effective at the ranges I tend to engage enemies at...

[zeidmaan]

How bout this... ironsights doesnt have to wait 1,whatever seconds before accurately shooting OMG OMG OMG!!!!

[OkitaMakoto]

How bout this... ironsights doesnt have to wait 1,whatever seconds before accurately shooting OMG OMG OMG!!!!

God no... that'd be like, half the classes running around with no los in accuracy :'(

its not to make the class BETTER, its to make it slightly more appealing. Theres a difference

[pureperversions]

could always give the unscoped rifleman the masterkey varient for that added emphsis on cqb fighting, no idea how common masterkey varients are if at all though

[Alex6714]

Give scoped rifleman a bit less grenades then to non-scoped rifleman

I second this.

[DarthDisco]

I honestly don't understand why the idea of taking away the ammo from Scoped rifles doesn't appeal to people. It is a perfect solution. it doesn't make the scoped rifle any less effective than the irons, or make the irons any better. It creates a very simple and effective reason to choose irons over scoped and makes the irons an invaluable squad asset.

More than any of these things, its easy. This change requires no accuracy modding, no changing ballistics, no damage or frag grenade changes. Just remove the bag from scopes. There is no reason for both of them to have an ammo bag.