Frames based timer on suppression effect

blud · Post by **blud** » 2008-04-03 19:03

As I understand it the suppression effect lasts for a certain number of frames, not milliseconds. IMO this is horribly unfair.

What this means is, lets say the suppression effect is 100 frames long, then joe moneybags with his nice new PC who is getting 100 FPS only sees the suppression for 1 second. Meanwhile people like me with older pcs who frequently get only like 20 FPS will see the same suppression for 5 seconds! (If you aren't following, 100 frames divided by 20FPS = 5 seconds.)

Now my numbers are picked out of the air, but whatever the actual numbers are the same principle applies. I see a lot of comments of people saying that they get quickly killed by people who they figure should be suppressed. Well this can account for some of that. There are also people who feel that the suppression should be reduced. The people saying both of those things likely have lower FPS. Then you have people saying the suppression is just right, well, they probably have good FPS.

I know that PR adds a lot above and beyond BF2, so it's going to require better specs, but at least with all the normal added stuff you can turn down your graphics settings to get better FPS. With the suppression there's nothing you can do.

People with older PCs already have bad FPS and ugly graphics (tweaked down just to try and squeeze some FPS out) and probably worse sound even. All of which are strikes against them on the battlefield giving them a disadvantage.

Now a person with an amazing machine can turn down his graphics settings and crank up their FPS to maximum levels which will reduce the suppression effect even more for them. How is that any better than someone circumventing the shaders?

Anyhow, I really hope the devs try to fix this issue and make the suppression timer be time based instead of frames based. And I hope they care about trying to do that. If there is no way, or if they just don't want to, then I have to say that this feature is further unleveling the playing field, and it's unfortunate because, like the FPS hungry maps like Fools Road, it's working on squeezing people like me out of the game.

Post by **Spec** » 2008-04-03 21:27

i think that are server frames, they are the same for everyone.

Post by **Spearhead** » 2008-04-03 21:57

I am afraid the effect is mostly depending on client frames due to the way the shaders in BF2 work and also due to the way the shaders are triggered. All that is in the thread is known and has already been mentioned in the shader feedback thread. I suggest a merge or close.

As for balancing: I have an idea or 2 that may help those with low FPS but it will not be implemented before 0.8 (if it works) Still need to see if my idea is feasible at all.

Post by **Spec** » 2008-04-04 01:21

oh, sorry then. BF2 works strange...

Post by **GeZe** » 2008-04-04 01:22

I was wondering why the suppression effect seemed a little long. Now I know... because of my 13-15 fps.

[T]MLPatriot · Post by **[T]MLPatriot** » 2008-04-04 02:47

[R-CON]GeZe wrote: I was wondering why the suppression effect seemed a little long. Now I know... because of my 13-15 fps.

holy ****! no wonder lol.. you must get killed all the time.

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-04-04 03:42

Dam Im glad I didnt downgrade now. I expect most physics things are decided server side, did shell shock duration and that kind of thing always work client side this way?

When I first played the bf2 demo I only had ps1.2 on a ti4200, ie. not even dx8.1 and when I had shell shock the entire screen would go black till it wore off - now that was hard core. Hence how I became a heli ho, no shell shock there

Snowno · Post by **Snowno** » 2008-04-04 09:19

I think it may be possible for those with a uber computer to get the suppression last even shorter.. BF2 has a max fps of 100, but theres is a console command to unlock this 100 fps limit, wouldn't that make the suppression even shorter if they get like 800 fps?

blud · Post by **blud** » 2008-04-04 18:47

Snowno wrote:I think it may be possible for those with a uber computer to get the suppression last even shorter..

Yes, that's what I was saying. (Although for a PC to get 800fps in PR it would have to be some kind of beast!)

BloodAce wrote:I really think all players with old machines (including myself) will have to buy newer ones sooner or later so i don't see it should be treated as a problem.

It's not just about players with old computers. Even players with good computers may have suppression that is twice as long as players with uber machines.

Ares640 · Post by **Ares640** » 2008-04-04 19:42

The suppression effect lasts about 5-7 seconds for me, in which time I have to basically run and hide and wait till its gone before i can do anything at all. It is impossible to see anything during this time, almost the same as when you get a major lag spike and cant do anything. It's basically equivlent to playing the game on 8-10 FPS =/ I think it should be lowered to 3 seconds for us with lower framerates.

Post by **Spearhead** » 2008-04-04 22:06

Yea. The game will never be 100% the same for everyone. That's not really possible for a game like PR. We try to keep it balanced for all players but sometimes the way things are don't allow us to keep things 100% even for everyone.

The good news is that the largest impact on gameplay results comes from the players and their skill at doing the right things at the right time. Individuals can make some difference but the team sticking closer to a good plan is almost always the one that wins.

The only advice I have right now for anyone suffering from the suppression is to adapt. Try to play roles where the suppression does not get into your way as much. People inside vehicles are not affected by suppression at all. Medics usually stay back a bit and are less likely to be the first the enemy shoots at...

I don't say that we don't care about people's problems but we can't always make everyone happy with a release.

maz.uk · Post by **maz.uk** » 2008-04-04 23:10

no matter wot game you play online there is always going to be a guy with a more powerful pc and he will most of the time have the edge on you in a one on one, we all no that when we upgrade we kick *** more until 12 month down the line and then its time to get the cash out again ,i have a couple of guys in the clan with 2 sli 8800gts in there PCs and the drive us mad ,but its great make you change your style of play and think more that's the beauty off PCs online

Mora · Post by **Mora** » 2008-04-05 13:49

YouTube - PR - Suppression Effect Test

General_J0k3r · Post by **General_J0k3r** » 2008-04-05 13:59

maybe make a fps cap around 60fps mandatory (if possible to check with PB) and then tweak it to 60fps?

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-04-05 14:43

Nicely done, 25fps offically sucks I guess. Does the black part of the video increase the quality youtube allows in the first part?

While I was messing around with game.lockfps I noticed it seemed to improve fools road for me, might have been a coincidence or something but during the game I didnt notice any lag except for like 3 pauses for it to load textures just like any large map will do.
Fps went to 188 when I loaded the map before settling to a much higher figure then normal, didnt notice less then 40 and there was no moving in treacle effect at any point

How do I turn on refresh rate lock in the video options to stop tearing?

Mora · Post by **Mora** » 2008-04-05 15:05

Yeah with the hack i use it normally makes the video quality better on youtube. but this video is in 50fps and i guess the youtube hack doesn't work then.

Sabre_tooth_tigger · Post by **Sabre_tooth_tigger** » 2008-04-05 15:11

Try hosting a video on vimeo.com, if you record in widescreen it will not alter the original quality afaik.
If anyone knows how I can play bf2 in widescreen without actually buying a monitor, ie. black bars, etc then I'd like that because otherwise I have to resize/convert the video which sucks

gazzthompson · Post by **gazzthompson** » 2008-04-05 15:13

good video, i max about 30 FPS but when suppression kicks in it drops to about 10.