Weapon Accuracy

|:XAS:| Bravo · Post by **|:XAS:| Bravo** » 2006-02-28 12:27

In game everyone takes the MG kit and just sprays just hoping to wipe out a squad, with a regular rifle we just hope we can take one guy down. What's the deal? I mean the MG is just way to accurate, I can kill a guy with an MG, but from the same distance I cant take down one guy with a sniper rifle.

OriginalSnoozer · Post by **OriginalSnoozer** » 2006-02-28 12:39

I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with the MG's. They're accurate, sure, but probably very realistic (never fired a MG myself though).

The problem is that on some maps (read: Oasis) there are just too many of them. The worst example happened the other night, when US had taken all flags and EVERYONE (close at least) had SAW's and were just spraying the last uncappable flag. But uncappable flags is another thread, hehe.

Since the engine cannot put restrictions on classes (to my knowledge) the only way is to make the MG's worse...which I do not promote at all!
Until DICE or someone clever makes class restrictions possible, the MG-Rambo guys cannot be dealt with I'm afraid. The mod (and all weapons within) is supposed to be real. I think they are.

Rifleman · Post by **Rifleman** » 2006-02-28 13:54

the only way is to make the MG's worse...

Just adjust snipers a bit more... becouse know even from 200-300m i kill snipers easily with mg...nvm which one... saw or not... it's VERY easy...
Snipers can make their life harder... or adjust other classed better... bigger smoke from smoke nades to cover squads...
I believe as Snoozer that they are as accurate as they are IRL...

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-02-28 13:59

the thing is the MGs in real life are accruate. and if you cant shoot anything with that m16, im sorry to say but you must be 1 really shit shot as you can easily snipe ppl from quite long ranges with that gun and the AK-101.

angus · Post by **angus** » 2006-02-28 14:24

I may have a partial solution for the LMG's. But it means we have to accept that they cannot be fired from the shoulder. This may or may not be true.
If the line

Code: Select all

ObjectTemplate.zoom.OnlyZoomWhenProne 1

is added then the sights will only be available when prone. In the standing or crouch position the tracers will be the only reference to aim with. Accuracy and tracer visibility may need some tweaking also.

I am not sure if this may have the unwanted effect of support falling to prone more or not. Maybe slowing the SpeedDevSub so it takes longer to regain accuracy after moving would also help.

Sound good to anyone?

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-02-28 14:29

angus wrote:I may have a partial solution for the LMG's. But it means we have to accept that they cannot be fired from the shoulder. This may or may not be true.
If the line
Code: Select all
ObjectTemplate.zoom.OnlyZoomWhenProne 1
is added then the sights will only be available when prone. In the standing or crouch position the tracers will be the only reference to aim with. Accuracy and tracer visibility may need some tweaking also.

I am not sure if this may have the unwanted effect of support falling to prone more or not. Maybe slowing the SpeedDevSub so it takes longer to regain accuracy after moving would also help.

Sound good to anyone?

Im very suprised no 1 has thought about this as yet. Or if they have im not sure why they havent put it in as now you say it, it really dose stair you in the face in the bf2 editor.

Make a new topic for this as i think this could be a very nice bit for the LMGs

Peter-SAS · Post by **Peter-SAS** » 2006-02-28 14:53

thats sounds like a grand idea

Yes the SAW is accurate and deadly in real life, but this is a game, and people abuse it. We need to place as many drawbacks on the kit to level the playing field.

Being able to use the sights when prone is a step in the right direction, and should be tested IMO

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-02-28 15:00

Peter-SAS wrote:thats sounds like a grand idea

Yes the SAW is accurate and deadly in real life, but this is a game, and people abuse it. We need to place as many drawbacks on the kit to level the playing field.

Being able to use the sights when prone is a step in the right direction, and should be tested IMO

I know i only use the sights on the SAW when prone anyways as theres no point when standing up. Maby somtimes crouched if im behind a small wall or somthing

Braddock096 · Post by **Braddock096** » 2006-02-28 15:11

I only use my mg standing if I can't see from prone, I need to shoot from behind cover or if I get surprised.

IMO support weapons are FINE as far as accuracy goes. I would advocate making them less accurate from standing and crouched just to stop the whining.

Also, making the bipod deployable [i.e you go prone, you press a button to deploy the bipod, your movement is restricted but you get far less muzzle climb and recoil etc] would be a good idea.

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-02-28 15:28

Braddock096 wrote:I only use my mg standing if I can't see from prone, I need to shoot from behind cover or if I get surprised.

IMO support weapons are FINE as far as accuracy goes. I would advocate making them less accurate from standing and crouched just to stop the whining.

Also, making the bipod deployable [i.e you go prone, you press a button to deploy the bipod, your movement is restricted but you get far less muzzle climb and recoil etc] would be a good idea.

Yes like AA has it so you deply your bipod, then you have to undeply it before you can get up. Same thing would be good for the sniper rifle too

Rifleman · Post by **Rifleman** » 2006-02-28 16:17

Also, making the bipod deployable [i.e you go prone, you press a button to deploy the bipod, your movement is restricted but you get far less muzzle climb and recoil etc] would be a good idea.

IDD!

Zantetsuken · Post by **Zantetsuken** » 2006-02-28 16:27

that's one of the things I like about AA, bipods, but can BF2 even do weapon accessories like that?

also, like everybody else has been saying all over the place, the M24 is way to inaccurate for a bolt action and outshot by a Dragunov or the Chinese semi auto rifles - the reason most "professional"/military snipers use bolt actions is they are (supposed to be) generally more accurate than semi-autos...

00SoldierofFortune00 · Post by **00SoldierofFortune00** » 2006-02-28 17:40

THe tracers and muzzle flashes need major tweaking. If you can make those visiblw again, then most people can see where they are being shot from by the MGs instead of looking around and getting shot etc. If you actually see where the fire is coming from, then they can avoid it, get to some good cover, and have a much better chance.

Also, being a little less accurate with the MG while standing is good even though it actually is pretty good now. That prone thing will take too much and will completely screw that class up when they need to escape quick.

But fixing the tracers/muzzle flash will fix part of the problem. If they see the flash, then they know what direction to shoot instead of ending up ontop of a MG.

Braddock096 · Post by **Braddock096** » 2006-02-28 17:57

I see the reason of the support class as providing base of fire for your squads movement... I really don't give a toss if it becomes harder to lone wolf with a mg.

I was my old clans dedicated MG'er for several games, DoD and Red Orchestra requiring the mg to be deployed before use for any form of accuracy. That makes the mg a much more tactical weapon to use, you need to think about placement for maximum effect and it beomes much harder to assault with it.

Ghost33 · Post by **Ghost33** » 2006-02-28 17:58

angus wrote:I may have a partial solution for the LMG's. But it means we have to accept that they cannot be fired from the shoulder. This may or may not be true.
If the line
Code: Select all
ObjectTemplate.zoom.OnlyZoomWhenProne 1
is added then the sights will only be available when prone. In the standing or crouch position the tracers will be the only reference to aim with. Accuracy and tracer visibility may need some tweaking also.

I am not sure if this may have the unwanted effect of support falling to prone more or not. Maybe slowing the SpeedDevSub so it takes longer to regain accuracy after moving would also help.

Sound good to anyone?

I think I may be the only person that dosent agree with this. I find it higly unrealistic to not be able to shoulder a 249SAW, If I'm rounding a corner I have no idea whats behind I want my 249 shoulderd and ready to fire all the way around that corner, sure it won't be as accurate since you have nothing to brace with but for the first few rounds it should still be lethal.

00SoldierofFortune00 · Post by **00SoldierofFortune00** » 2006-02-28 18:01

I really wasn't thinking of lone wolfing when I was posting at all. There is a video out of Iraqi that has a SAW gunner standing up and firing while his fellow Marines are behind him which I think was from Faluja(sp?) I'll try and find it because standing up and firing the SAW is realistic, but fiding a good place to fire from with the bipod down is also.

Braddock096 · Post by **Braddock096** » 2006-02-28 18:14

You can fire the SAW from standing. You can fire virtually anything from standing, its the accuracy that suffers.

Considering that the SAW is a Light Machine Gun you SHOULD be able to shoot standing but with accuracy penalties,

I've even seen modern videos and contemporary pictures of German mg'ers shooting the MG42 in "assault mode" i.e shooting from the hip on the advance. You arn't going to win any accuracy awards but you are putting rounds down range which aids in fire superiority.

Sonic Boyster · Post by **Sonic Boyster** » 2006-02-28 18:18

I'm pretty sure that if they made snipers more realistic everyone would select sniper rifles over assault rifles. Well, not everyone, but considering how much of the combat is at distance in PRMM you'd almost always be better off with a sniper rifle than an assault rifle. If they can find a way to make it 'realistic' but 'hard to use' more power to them, but I don't think that's likely in BF2. The SAW could use a tiny bit more deviation per shot regardless of whether or not it is realistic for the sake of gameplay. They already tweaked snipers to make them unrealistic for the sake of gameplay, they can do a very small amount of the same thing to another weapon to make it fair for everybody else, otherwise you'll still have every new player running around with a SAW and firing off 50 rounds every time they see someone.

00SoldierofFortune00 · Post by **00SoldierofFortune00** » 2006-02-28 18:31

Braddock096 wrote:You can fire the SAW from standing. You can fire virtually anything from standing, its the accuracy that suffers.

Considering that the SAW is a Light Machine Gun you SHOULD be able to shoot standing but with accuracy penalties,

I've even seen modern videos and contemporary pictures of German mg'ers shooting the MG42 in "assault mode" i.e shooting from the hip on the advance. You arn't going to win any accuracy awards but you are putting rounds down range which aids in fire superiority.

Yea this is what I was suggesting. You have fire superiority at the expense of accuracy which means you can move with your squad without sitting there and really raping everything down the street standing up which wouldn't happen with "no fire while standing mode."

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-02-28 18:49

i onistly find that SAW and RPK are fine as they are. If you keep your head down and flank a Support you can easily take him down.