GloryHoundz Steel Thunder Server-Side Suggestion

EON_MagicMan · Post by **EON_MagicMan** » 2006-03-02 18:48

I'd like to bring up the idea of losing the Jeeps in the 16-player version (Kind of like vehicles were removed from Oasis).

Any real squad player knows that having the jeeps is a bad idea, because it:

a)Splits up the squad (considering the Jeeps have 3 slots)
b)Attacking squads have little chance to defend against them, and if there is poor/no defense, they have to turn tail just to keep those 1-3 guys from capping the base behind you!

I know it's fast, and handy, but seriously, the real battles aren't when one side's choked up on either bridge. The real battles are in that large forested area on the east side of the map!

Because of Jeeps, one side often finds away to cap both bases pretty soon in the map, and from there on, it is very difficult to swim/cross the bridge to recap.

I'd rather that if a team snuck by, they would do it on foot, forcing squads to move in lines.

I had a very fun game yesterday, when me and the whole squad led by 00SoldierofFortune00 were being stocked by a whole enemy squad as we snuck by. The fight carried on to the rear flank of their base, with us moving, yet still firing back at them and using smoke for cover, and them chasing us.

Eventually, things went to hell and they got our squad.

What does everybody think? I really think Jeeps make those oh-so-fun battles in the forest rarer, and they generally force the fighting to a slaughter on the bridge-- it's not fun to be on the giving end or the receiving end.

PLEASE CONSIDER THIS SUGGESTION!

I'm sure myself and others would greatly appreciate it! The map is SO good already, but often times, the battle sucks just because 2 guys snuck through on a Jeep.

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-02 21:33

I think the jeeps should stay there.

It makes the game a bit more fast paced imo. And people can make suprise attacks etc.

And hearing a vehicle while running around in the forest, gives you sorta; get down! incoming vehicle thingy. It's cool

But yeah, it can split up squads. But don't forget not everyone is in a squad. And if you have a bit more organized squad. People just agree not to use them, or arrange that 3 guys drive to there or that flag etc. and meet up!

But a bit off topic: Oh yeah I was with ya there together with 00soldieroffortune00

Never ever I've had such a nice time in a game before like yesterday! GG ! Hope to play with ya again.

(|US|Wesh) <- ingame name

EON_MagicMan · Post by **EON_MagicMan** » 2006-03-02 21:38

Wesh wrote:It's makes the game a bit more fast paced imo. And people can make suprise attacks etc.

It's only really fast paced in the way that the game ends quickly, because a jeep got by those sweeping the forest. Nobody's going to carry a SRAW to stop them, and you aren't guaranteed to shoot the driver out.

As for surprise attacks-- how's a flank sound? Or lying down in the grass, waiting in ambush?

Post by **RikiRude** » 2006-03-02 21:38

maybe just up the spawn times on the vehicles, or have less of them.

i do agree the best battles are in the forrest.

but i wouldnt mind seeing all vehicles gone.

Cerberus · Post by **Cerberus** » 2006-03-02 21:53

I'd rather have the transports (HMMWVs and vans) on Steel Thunder than FAVs and buggies.

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-02 22:02

EON_MagicMan wrote:It's only really fast paced in the way that the game ends quickly, because a jeep got by those sweeping the forest. Nobody's going to carry a SRAW to stop them, and you aren't guaranteed to shoot the driver out.

As for surprise attacks-- how's a flank sound? Or lying down in the grass, waiting in ambush?

I don't think the vehicles are as strong as you make them

Imo what it takes is a lot bullets going through the air and then you have it. Also consider using the grenade launcher from assault (smoke as cover, hidding). Acutally as i see it, the infantry definitely has an advantage when running in the forest against a jeep. - But ok maybe I havn't met a skilled/wise jeep squad? You can show me!

But hell yeah. I like going on foot in the forest together with your squad. But I like variances. As i wrote before, love when you suddenly can hear a jeep driving around

, could be a boat as well when you're close to water.

EON_MagicMan · Post by **EON_MagicMan** » 2006-03-02 22:10

Okay, I just got off playing that map. I actually quit in frustration, because, of course, the map starts, our squad (Chinese) takes the boat to the Dam outpost, another few scattered guys take the Jeep through the forest.

Enemy team takes a couple of Jeeps to our base. Of course, surely, our Jeep passes their Jeep in the forest, and it's a race to the spawn point. They beat us, it takes 5 minutes for my idiot squad to realize while I'm trying to type and head back through the forest, because although a message pops up, they don't speak chinese.

I get popped, spawn at the original base, and get capped again, by someone who is already there.

If this is fun, then FINE, enjoy your jeeps.

Taking them out would force people to hoof it through the forest, and have a head on conflict, in the forest, rather than just driving by eachother and giving eachother the finger.

*EDIT* Players are always going to be stupid, not wait and defend, and so the battle is going to be ruined pretty quickly. Force them into a fun situation, where the best tactics and combat skills win, not just the best racer.

I've made some helpful diagrams

I would also advocate either letting both teams start with two bases, or have both teams only start with one.

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-02 22:18

Cerberus wrote:I'd rather have the transports (HMMWVs and vans) on Steel Thunder than FAVs and buggies.

I don't know about that.
That could be 4 guys travling easy towards the enemy flag. Making it easy to avoid these populair and fun foot 2 foot combat in the forest. And make an easy ambush on base.

BUT YES I know it is only 1 more. But i do think it is 1 too much.

Think about it; 2 guys more = full squad behind enemy base.
I like it better with 3 guys more = full squad behind enemy base

EON_MagicMan · Post by **EON_MagicMan** » 2006-03-02 22:29

Wesh wrote:I don't think the vehicles are as strong as you make them
Imo what it takes is a lot bullets going through the air and then you have it. Also consider using the grenade launcher from assault (smoke as cover, hidding). Acutally as i see it, the infantry definitely has an advantage when running in the forest against a jeep. - But ok maybe I havn't met a skilled/wise jeep squad? You can show me!

But hell yeah. I like going on foot in the forest together with your squad. But I like variances. As i wrote before, love when you suddenly can hear a jeep driving around , could be a boat as well when you're close to water.

I'm not saying that jeeps kill you or anything-- in fact, they try not to engage you. IT leaves an assaulting infantry squad helpless to stop them, and most leaders are too stubborn to head back to the base to stop them.

Not to mention, two oncoming jeeps never stop, but rather, just drive past eachother.

More often than not, this map is just a big race-- once you're pushed past that bridge, it's pretty much over. Only once or twice have I ever overcome that with the squad.

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-02 22:36

Nice diagrams

I do get your point. But hopefully and I don't think people will always be 'stupid' all the time. And if you are in a nice server with nice people and with people who have a bit skill, and lets say, a bit organized with a commander etc.

There IS gonna be people defending and people not passing by each other.

I don't like the idea of this "safeness" in your pocket while trying to fight and move towards the enemy's base. I like that the enemy acutally can make a turning point in the fight.

But yes what you just experienced sounds a bit fooked

??: It's sad.

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-02 22:42

EON_MagicMan wrote:I'm not saying that jeeps kill you or anything-- in fact, they try not to engage you. IT leaves an assaulting infantry squad helpless to stop them, and most leaders are too stubborn to head back to the base to stop them.

Not to mention, two oncoming jeeps never stop, but rather, just drive past eachother.

More often than not, this map is just a big race-- once you're pushed past that bridge, it's pretty much over. Only once or twice have I ever overcome that with the squad.

Yes but again. Players are not always stupid. It's a hard map.
The end - i think

EON_MagicMan · Post by **EON_MagicMan** » 2006-03-02 22:46

Wesh wrote:Nice diagrams

I do get your point. But hopefully and I don't think people will always be 'stupid' all the time. And if you are in a nice server with nice people and with people who have a bit skill, and lets say, a bit organized with a commander etc.

So that prettymuch excludes public servers, unless you have a few "PR Heroes" playing, which is either a hit or a miss.

Wesh wrote: There IS gonna be people defending and people not passing by each other.

I don't like the idea of this "safeness" in your pocket while trying to fight and move towards the enemy's base. I like that the enemy acutally can make a turning point in the fight.

The turning point is when you advance and obliterate the enemy squad, or when you are obliterated.

I think with public servers you do have to force these situations. Really, it's not fun being in the most epic battle when a Jeep goes by, deliberately trying to run a few of your guys over (obviously), and then either you turn around and chase, or rely on your defenses, the guys who got bored of defending and hopped on a boat to be heroes.

Here's the difference between Jeeps and Infantry in this situation: With jeeps, if you want to get by, you just drive through-- you don't even need to excercise caution, because the other team spawning an Anti Tank guy would be a waste of a man, and you've got about an 80% chance of driving through an enemy squad without getting shot out, because it's too damned fast.

With Infantry, if you want to get by, you can sneak by. If you're successful, you can blame it on the fact that the enemy didn't cover enough area, or was weak in one area, not on the fact that you were flying by them at 100km/h, and that they're too determined to attack than to turn around.

Either way, it's probably worth a try. It sure did wonders for Oasis!

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-02 22:55

Hmm, Hehe you are starting to convince me a bit tbh!

But I do need to experience this "phenomenon" a bit more!
Think I might have played steel thunder on too crowded serveres. Where theres always someone staying back.

00SoldierofFortune00 · Post by **00SoldierofFortune00** » 2006-03-03 02:46

The assault grenade launcher is pretty bad against the jeeps and vehicles. They don't take them out all the time even with a near or direct hit. I hit one right in the front or close to the side once and it still did not blow up the buggy. They should have to go through the forest(kill zone) or take a boat which makes it harder to have people going back and forth constantly for flags they lose. The #1 reason flags are taken so quickly and loss so quickly again is because people just rush in buggies and they spawn their whole squad behind enemy lines which doesn't make them clear out all the enemies in the area really.

They should have to eliminate all threats in the area and then get on teh flag which makes it much more realistic and plausible to real combat rather than buggy rushes.

Wipeout · Post by **Wipeout** » 2006-03-03 03:35

The no jeeps Idea is nice because then you don't have a few guys running around just capping, instead you have strategy. More strategic defense planning and attack planning.

And the always fun ambush. Whether on the receiving side or on the attacking side, it's always fun to participate in an ambush. Because if your on the receiving side, it's like Oh my god! How did that just happen that was awesome. And on the attacking side it's like, wow we just scared the **** and slaughtered that entire squad.

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-03-03 06:53

I would like to keep the RIB in. But have it on a long spawn time. But yes. LOOSE THE JEEPS! I never take them as they do split up the squad.

Peter-SAS · Post by **Peter-SAS** » 2006-03-03 15:24

Simple suggestion to it splitting up squads. We need 6ton transport trucks

With MG's on top for suggestion (no crosshairs)

I think in the large version of the map, you should cut down on the tanks, by about 2, and then adds some jeeps. But in the 16 player version, pehaps no jeeps and no tanks

Wesh · Post by **Wesh** » 2006-03-03 15:45

Peter-SAS wrote:Simple suggestion to it splitting up squads. We need 6ton transport trucks With MG's on top for suggestion (no crosshairs)

I think in the large version of the map, you should cut down on the tanks, by about 2, and then adds some jeeps. But in the 16 player version, pehaps no jeeps and no tanks

yeah.

*agrees*

{GD}Snake13 · Post by **{GD}Snake13** » 2006-03-03 16:25

But basicly you're just trying to dumb the map down, you should have people on defense, not change the map so you don't have to bother. If you don't have people defending your rear you get encircled, this is what should happen not a problem with the map

Post by **Rhino** » 2006-03-03 17:56

keep as manny tanks as there are on 32 and 64. Its a armor battle and we need to keep it that way. on 16 man you dont want any tanks or jeeps.