Suggestions for future flight modelling

[Drav]

Firstly, I'm sick of ppl using the lynx as an example on why helicopter can fly upside down in PR. A lynx can loop the loop. I know this, as I have seen one do it with my own eyes. As far as I know it can not barrel roll or maintain inverted flight.

However, the large majority of helicopters can not even loop without catastrophic failure. Other than that, I think the helicopters flight dynamics are really quite good, other than there being no torque effects. Unfortunately this is what makes helicopters difficult to fly, so any modelling without this is like a racing game with only automatic transmission.


(and I do have a little bit of flight time in Robinsons)

As for the jets, I've only flown Cessnas and Bulldogs, so I couldnt really comment with any authority. I'd risk saying their low speed handling is ****, and there is no real stall, just a progressively larger sink rate the slower you fly. The planes also do not deccelerate during steep turns. That is a fairly major omission.

I'd also be interested to know if each jet has an optimum speed for best turn radius. This is quite a big deal in proper dogfighting, as it means you can turn much faster than your opponent if you are at the right speed and he is not. This coupled with losing speed during high g manoevers means you have to juggle the throttle carefully to get the best performance out of your aircraft.....

So ye, I'd like to see optimum turn speed, deceleration during High G turns and helicopter torque. However this isnt a moan. Seeing as this aint flight sim, I think the devs have done a great job so far. I also know the bf2 editor isnt packed with options for flight dynamics modelling, but I thought seeing as you guys have packed so much in already why stop there??

[CAS_117]

Hi Mescaldrav. I designed the aerodynamics for a lot of the jets, and I agree with everything you said. Basically in reality the angle, area, and thickness of the wings define lift. In BF2, the lift is simply in place by a lift coefficient which is simply an arbitrary value attached to a point in space on the plane, ultimately, this means the planes are extremely unstable. Also, planes travel at fairly low speeds. In some cases, only 1/6 of their real life values. This means that in order to keep them in the air they must have fairly high lift coefficients. This makes energy loss negligible. Worse still, the planes have no auto trim. You might notice sinking and climbing without any input. In reality the plane will keep a steady attitude, but that isn't the case here. Right now, I must find the planes max speed and weight and then balance their lift coefficients to make them stay level. As for corner speed, currently, the more lift a plane has the better the turn rate. You will have the most lift at low altitude. So corner speed is theoretically infinity.

I hope that helps :S .

[maverick551]

Just the same old limitations on the BF2 engine. Its a shame. Good points brought out on this post, however, I know that havening some torque effects implemented would be very realistic, I don't see how a the current pedal/rudder system could cope with such effects on the aircraft. I can see that becoming extremely difficult for pilots attempting to fly without actual flight simulator rudder pedals. But I have to say, the planes have improved greatly since the earlier patches and as a frequent pilot, I thank the DEVS.

[Scot]

Hi Mescaldrav. I designed the aerodynamics for a lot of the jets, and I agree with everything you said. Basically in reality the angle, area, and thickness of the wings define lift. In BF2, the lift is simply in place by a lift coefficient which is simply an arbitrary value attached to a point in space on the plane, ultimately, this means the planes are extremely unstable. Also, planes travel at fairly low speeds. In some cases, only 1/6 of their real life values. This means that in order to keep them in the air they must have fairly high lift coefficients. This makes energy loss negligible. Worse still, the planes have no auto trim. You might notice sinking and climbing without any input. In reality the plane will keep a steady attitude, but that isn't the case here. Right now, I must find the planes max speed and weight and then balance their lift coefficients to make them stay level. As for corner speed, currently, the more lift a plane has the better the turn rate. You will have the most lift at low altitude. So corner speed is theoretically infinity.

I hope that helps :S .

Holy hell thats confusing...

[arjan]

Holy hell thats confusing...

i lold

[Drav]

Thanks for responses guys, ye I guess it was a bit of a shot in the dark. So without a really basic physics model for air moving over a wing we're not going to get much of that stuff then

CAs, it sounds like you've done pretty well already given you've had to base all the physics off a very problematic base. Understood all of it apart from the corner speed bit! Good luck with your future endeavours.....