Award negative points for certain actions

[Alex6714]

no. once my squad was pinned down, and alex came in with his huey tipped that guy with the skids and we were clear to move ..

But I didn´t suicide then, I only crushed him.

I am guilty of LATing everything I see, if I can do it, and I have ammo why not? My ping sucks enough and with the deviation its just too much for me to bother with a gun.

[Waaah_Wah]

I was playing on 7 Gates and I was on China and defending the Bunker behind the first flag, and there was an enemy firebase on the hill and for every 30 seconds to a minute after the start of the game, they were firing HAT round after HAT round down onto that firebase and kepy spamming it until the end of the game. It was at a minimum, 10 HAT rounds fired, but I am sure there were much more because I went off with my squad to attack a RP. We managed to keep the Bunker up, but tell me that is realistic or fair.


And yes, IT WOULD BE possible for a single guy to fire off 100 rounds of a HAT during an entire game if it was long enough. All you need is a firebase, a HAT, and some high ground or a good location.

And I doubt that they would store that much rounds in a firebase. We are not talking about a LAW or LAT or SMAW, but basically a Javalin round.

Get a sniper to headshot him as hes waiting for hit weapon to settle? Is that hard?

[Waaah_Wah]

Well I guess I come from the other side of your great rounds, which don't happen to be so great.

The only few good rounds I had, were 1. on Kashan 2. in armor 3. good squad 4. optional: competent team.

Everything else is nightmare.

Being in your squad is a nightmare... Really. I have never seen a person complain so much in so little time. I think i left your squad after 5 min or so.

[Airsoft]

now you know how it feels to go against CATA 1

It really is up to the player if they want to waste it mabye 5 min later they get pinned down by a vodnic hehe too bad you wasted it on a rifleman

[Drake]

This is a hardcore mod for hardcore players, and we all know that hardcore players dont care about the scoreboard, only winning the map.

So why does this thread on scoreboard has 5 pages?????? Only vanilla noobs active on the forum???????

To be serious: The scoreboard DOES NOT affect player behavior, neither do spawn times. (players are hardcoded)

If you ask me, only show scoreboard on round end. This way you cant use it to tell who is alive or confirming kills. (can still be useful, even with the 30 sec delay)

[00SoldierofFortune00]

Get a sniper to headshot him as hes waiting for hit weapon to settle? Is that hard?

And how many times is that sniper a smacktard or the HAT is way out of range but is capable of spamming? Not like I can magically say "hey sniper, take him out" when most don't care or I can't get my hands on one myself or marksman. I even had someone in my squad do HAT sniping on Kashan next to a supply source and it is not exacly the most fair thing. You don't think we tried to take them out? I checked for him and could not find him because he was eitherh hiding behind the firebase on the hill or was out of range. And even if we did, they had a whole firebase full of men there to pick up the HAT and keep the fire going. You don't think our team did anything about it? We did, but sometimes, somethings are just not possible.

I am fine with someone walking along, seeing infantry, and using the HAT against them, but sitting at an unlimited resupply source and using a HAT, especially while out of range is cheap, easy, and not exactly realistic.

[Waaah_Wah]

^^Then pick up a marksman kit and shoot him. Ffs its not hes invincible where he sits. Get a L-AT and blow up the bunker, get a grenadier to blow him to hell, supress the piss out of him. There are millions of options.

[ryan d ale]

I am fine with someone walking along, seeing infantry, and using the HAT against them, but sitting at an unlimited resupply source and using a HAT, especially while out of range is cheap, easy, and not exactly realistic.

Beyond visual range engagements happen.

It's only the same as indirect fire (artillery) or air to air missles.

Supressive fire is also similliar if it is in a situation where the enemy aren't confirmed but are likely to be (behind: walls, ridges, foilage).

[Pvt_Parts]

I don't have online play experience, but in theory...

Summary of ideas for conventional armies:

• Losing an aircraft with 90% or more health should have an extra spawn penalty if there are more than 8 people on the server. Crash and suicide all you want, but you will have to wait longer to try again.
• If scriptable: When you fire an AT/AA round, it adds 1 second temp spawn time (2 for HAT). Hitting a vehicle removes the same amount. Use it right, and there is little difference to you. Abuse/misuse it a little, and there is a little annoyance. Abuse it a lot (ie: spamming 20 HAT rounds from a firebase), and you'll probably stop playing.
• -or- If scriptable and if varaibles can be assigned to players: track how often the wrong ammo is used. Only when it gets ridiculous -- 6 HAT no vehicle hits/kills, 10 LATS no vehicle hits/kills, etc) -- then you punish.

Conventional armies often do non-conventional things. Try as much as they like, upper brass can not control every action of the fresh enlisted. However, those who continually behave in such a manner often will eventually be noticed and be punished. If not because the brass disagrees with the behavior, then at least for public relations reasons.

I doubt the code will allow differentiating if an AT/AA round kills infantry without hitting/killing anything else, so there would be no balanced way of "punishing" that way. Limitations aside, the ideal design would be that if a member of a conventional army kills infantry with an expensive round (AT/AA) they get a strike against them. Enough strikes and they are punished.

Another idea is that each expensive round cost 1 second of temp spawn to fire. (2 seconds for HAT) Hitting a vehicle with the round would undue x seconds, where x is the penalty. I'm not sure if that would be possible.

I've heard that in the Air Force (and Navy wings) that you are held accountable for your vehicle and munitions. If you crash (not get shot down) you are going to receive punishment unless it was beyond your control (hardware failure). If you jettison your munitions when you are not in a dangerous situation requiring it, you again, are going to be reprimanded if not punished. In the forums at Frugal's World of Simulations, there are several real life military aviators if you'd want to check with them. Any real life foot soldiers here, ask your CO if you'd be in trouble for using a couple dozen Javelin/Stinger rounds to hit an enemy that a marksman could hit (especially if it was in the field where it could be a while before ammo is replenished).

Crashing while above 90% health should give a higher respawn time. Planes and choppers are VERY expensive IRL, and very valuable in PR. If you suicide run, you suffer (if you survived, you'd be in BIG trouble for crashing undamaged million dollar vehicles). If you crash because you can't fly yet, you suffer. (Maybe the punishment is waived on servers with less than 8 people, so people can practice without penalties.)

Its been a while since I looked at the scripts for PR 0.5, so I don't remember what is and is not possible. I'm not really for or against the punishments, just thought I'd throw in a moderated idea. Once I get online experience, I may wind up agreeing with those whining -err- concerned individuals.

[00SoldierofFortune00]

^^Then pick up a marksman kit and shoot him. Ffs its not hes invincible where he sits. Get a L-AT and blow up the bunker, get a grenadier to blow him to hell, supress the piss out of him. There are millions of options.

Wow, did you not just read a word I said?

For 1, I was a SL, so I couldn't magically request or just walk along and find a marksman to pick up and 2, I already told the marksman/sniper in my squad to take out that HAT, but it was not possible. And as I have already said, he ducked down behind the firebase after his shot and he was in the woods and out of visual range. And if someone did shoot him, there was a whole squad around his firebase to pick up the HAT and continue the spamming. Stop trying to simplify the situation by just saying "pick up a marksmans!" when you know just as well as I do that HAT sniping from a firebase is a problem for this game and something that does not exactly draw players in masses to this game, but discourges them.

Beyond visual range engagements happen.

It's only the same as indirect fire (artillery) or air to air missles.

Supressive fire is also similliar if it is in a situation where the enemy aren't confirmed but are likely to be (behind: walls, ridges, foilage).

Those are different though as those people are carrying around bullets, not thounsand dollar rockets and spitting them out like candy.

And HAT is not supposed to be artillery. It is supposed to be used against vehicles and firebases IN a responsible way. I am actually fine with the grenade launcher being used as a mortaresque weapon, but you only get around 2 HATs per team, so why is it being wasted by some smacktard on non prescious targets? If the HAT is just walking along and hits a troop, I am fine because then he only has 1 more shot, but if you are at a firebase, that is a waste of a valuable asset and it can easily be abused.

[CAS_117]

Oh give it a rest already. I'm getting so sick of people who don't like how the enemy kills them. Could you imagine the massive blow to morale that would occur in a real war if the generals started whining to the enemy forces that "IED's, or Airstrikes aren't fair". In a war you throw the kitchen sink when you have it. Get real please. One of the main concepts in war is you reply to the enemy with a dissimilar weapon. This has overwhelming tangible and psychological effects. ie)

- They attack you with a rifle, use a grenade or machine gun.

- If they attack with a grenade or machine gun, use a rocket or APC.

- If they attack with an APC or rocket, attack with artillery or a tank.

- If they attack with artillery or a tank, attack them with air.

- If they attack with air, then attack with fighters.

And this goes on forever. Whoever is the most prepared wins. The fact remains that until the semi-automatic rifle, the crossbow is many times faster to fire, more accurate, and cheaper to produce than the bolt action rifle. Why was a rifle used by Napoleon and even in the American Civil war? I believe Napoleon put it well:

"The moral is to the physical as three is to one".

If people feel the need to ram a chopper into an enemy vehicle then there clearly is a need for something capable of the same effect without the smacktardery.

[SuperTimo]

i hartily endorse this post or thread.

[gclark03]

The idea of a fair fight in real war is a foolish, Hollywood-fueled myth, and the World Wars are a notable exception in those battles we've all seen on television.

My point is this: whenever possible, military forces are trained to avoid a fair fight with any force. For example, during the initial invasion of Iraq, instead of gunning down a convoy of white, insurgent-filled Toyotas, the Marines called in air support, eliminating even the possibility of taking casualties. Such is true of all war, whenever possible, and the nature of the (now-cliched) quote "A good general chooses his battles".

[Masaq]

And this goes on forever. Whoever is the most prepared wins. The fact remains that until the semi-automatic rifle, the crossbow is many times faster to fire, more accurate, and cheaper to produce than the bolt action rifle. Why was a rifle used by Napoleon and even in the American Civil war? I believe Napoleon put it well:

Of course, that argument would be even more valid had Napoleon ever adopted rifles for the French Army. As it was, he didn't - prefering smoothbore mustkets that were less accurate and faster to fire. The only rifle used during the Napoleonic wars in any quantity was the Baker rifle, which was a muzzle-loading flintlock not bolt-action, and certainly didn't use percussion caps like Civil War weapons did.

Napoleon preferred fire from columns to smash enemy line formations. Less firepower but a much greater psychological strength. The British, especially Wellington, used Rifle companies in the skirmishing lines to hit French officers and NCOs before the French muskets could have any hope of returning fire effectively; the Baker's rifled barrel and leather patches pulled over the shot made it accurate out to about 150m, around twice that of the smoothbores being used by regular British forces and the French.

What's more, first-rate infantry units could manage a rate of 5 shots a minute in volley fire, from a typical campaign-strength battallion of 500-600 troops, you could have over 2,500 rounds headed down-range every minute. Of course, most units couldn't manage five, and when enemy fire started thinning the ranks a little the volley fire was usually dropped, but to say that the weapons were less effective than crossbows by 1800 is rubbish - they weren't adopted because they were better psychologically, they were in use because by 1800 and still later up to the 1830s (in the case of the flintlock Baker Rifle), they were superior weapons.

[Waaah_Wah]

Wow, did you not just read a word I said?

For 1, I was a SL, so I couldn't magically request or just walk along and find a marksman to pick up and 2, I already told the marksman/sniper in my squad to take out that HAT, but it was not possible.


Not to be an ***, but nothing is impossible. Your talking like the guy in invincible where he sits and spams rockets at you. Hes not.

And as I have already said, he ducked down behind the firebase after his shot and he was in the woods and out of visual range. And if someone did shoot him, there was a whole squad around his firebase to pick up the HAT and continue the spamming.

Then continue with shooting them untill noone dares to stick their heads out.


Stop trying to simplify the situation by just saying "pick up a marksmans!"

It IS that simple really.

when you know just as well as I do that HAT sniping from a firebase is a problem for this game and something that does not exactly draw players in masses to this game, but discourges them.


I have NEVER had any problems with HAT sniping. Yes the guy might kill me a couple of times but its not really harder than taking a marksman kit or if your the SL get someone in your squad to take it.

Bold and red

[Psyko]

So after a number of months i have come to terms that, smacktards will allways be around, when they arnt raping mains and teamkilling, their are raping our ventrilo server

So what can we do to help erradicate smacktardary? The first thing that comes to mind is changing the score system a bit.

To Make people check their targets and make them more anal about it...
When a player teamkills, (Accidentally or deliberately) Their score returns to Zero, both on overall player score and on teamwork points, but their kills wouldnt change. Also, at the end of the round on the "Best whatever" screen, there would be a "warrent for arrest score-set" (or somthing along those lines) where anyone with zero score that was in the match for more than 10 minutes would become part of. This is so people who just joined the round shortly before the match ends dont get the warrent and thus arnt being watched by server admins for the next round. I think theres allready somthing like, the worst teammate or somthing, but i never bother to check it, and my idea is to make it more obvious/important and usefull to observe.

[Masaq]

Uh, why? All that does is punish players who make an accidental TK or two - and they will happen, blue-on-blue is inevitable. The players who come on in order to cause trouble don't give a foetid dingo's kidney about the score because all they're there to do is cause grief.

[Rudd]

The players who come on in order to cause trouble don't give a foetid dingo's kidney about the score...

haha, its worth coming on the PR forums just for phrases like these

also, this is true.